JIM5.0

The way I see it, I am not bashing these Korean cars nor Americans who make some of them. I am only calling them junk from MY own experience and experiences of friends I know who had them.
I know that SOME Hyundai & Kia cars are made in AL. For example, the Kia Soul is made in those AL plants.
BUT the Korean cars that I am referring to are the ones NOT made in the US, the ones that come from Korea.

For example, the Kia Forte come from Korea. I know this because I DROVE ONE. When I was at a Kia dealership, the very first thing is I looked at the VIN because I knew that some Kias come form the US. None of the Fortes on the lot had that made in the US "1" as the first character. They were all from Korea, and therefore not the AL plant.
Anyway, the salesman and I took it for a test drive. Not even one block from the dealership lot, the engine spontaneously died. The salesman tried to blame it on me and said I knocked it out of gear. I looked down and it was still in "D." Also, even I it came out of gear and went to "N" it would not have died, the tranny just would have been disengaged. The salesman trying to cover up for it only pissed me off even more.
A lady I worked with bought two Kias, both Rios, one for each of her daughters. She had to lemon law both of them under Texas lemon laws.

The way I see it, I have not trashed on any hard working Americans who work in those Alabama plants, who probably actually might be forced to work for lesser pay/benefits than say a GM worker, or Ford worker.

S197steve

Where did you get your info on pay ranges for factory workers?

Is that the same place you got your info for your original statement: Posting up a personal experience is one thing. Posting up assumptions and generalizations are what make people look ignorant...

My family owns a Hyundai Sonata and a Kia Sorrento... both have much more reliable than the Cadillac SRX and GMC Acadia that we have also owned. My parents SRX was in the shop for literally 10 of the first 15 weeks they owned it! But that doesn't mean all Cadillacs are crap.

Personal experiences vary from one to another, that's why industry standard testing (like the one I posted) are important. They look at the bigger picture and not just one man's experiences.

daredevil95

Hyundai and Kia have always been known for their inexpensive price and quality issues. As of the past 3 or 4 years Hyundai has really improved in quality and public opinion. Kia still strives to improve it's quality and public opinion.

JIM5.0

I make no quotes nor am I stating this as a fact. I used the words "probably" and "might." I never said "they are" nor did I mean them as facts.

So no sources

And just the same for your own assumptions and generalizations. Just because you had no problems with your two Kias does not erase the fact that others have problems with theirs.

And you hit on something: All cars have problems. Even our beloved Mustangs have problems. But just as how my one experience with a single Kia does not mean ALL Kias are bad, that same logic works on your own over generalization. Just because your Kias are problem free do not mean they are all superior cars.

If you love your Kias, there is nothing wrong with that. They are good cars for you and you therefore attribute that to Kia as a whole. (This too is only my opinion because I cannot prove this is the case nor can I ever cite an accepted source that factually proves you love your Kias.)
But I make no apologies for my dislike of Kias. And that is my own opinion and not a generalization that I am trying to force on you to make you change your mind about your cars.
Please don't take my statement as a generalization; it is only my opinion.
As a matter of fact, this entire thread is only a sum of opinions. Everyone is expressing theirs on what they think and want the 2014 or 2015 Mustang to be or will be.

I do not wish to be drawn into a spiteful argument. You know my feelings, and I clearly know yours.
Lets just agree to disagree, preferably in a friendly manner.

pdonket

Now if we're being completely honest here...Ford, Chrysler, and GM all have by FAR the best paid workers in the auto industry, there's no dispute to be had here.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aIXCyJCo4vq8

There's a link doing the analysis. Note that Hyundai is around $30/hour with benefits, while Ford is having to work hard to get down to $50/hour lol. And Ford's numbers estimate considerable worker turn-over to get to that rate.

Hope one day I'm getting $50/hour including benefits...

ironh19

my Kia was a piece of ****. glad its gone and I will never own a korean pos ever again.

S197steve

Which is quite why I wanted to bring up your original post because you're absolutely right: All vehicles have problems. So your statement was a massive (and incorrect) generalization. You lumped all Korean vehicles into one statement. I never once said they were superior cars, in fact I don't believe they are. I just said that it's good to know the facts before making a statement.

On a side note, you don't know my feelings towards any of the cars we've discussed because I haven't made anything other than fact based statements about them yet. :-)

I don't love the Sonata or the Sorrento... The Sonato, while very quiet and gets great gas mileage is a very boring car. The Sorrento rides very rough. The SRX is gone, thankfully. I prefer the Acadia, even with the problems it's having right now (it only has 19k miles, seriously GMC!!).

Seriously though, I have no issues with agreeing to disagree. I've enjoyed many of your posts on this forum for a while now... I was just very surprised to see your original statement as I don't recall seeing posts like that from you in the past.

S197steve

Fair enough... I had no idea so just wanted to make sure Jim5.0s statement that began with "...probably actually might be forced..." was accurate. It sounds as though the statement was a guess that was alluding to forced labor at miniscule wages. :-)