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4v 351c's had an awsome head design, it wasnt to good down low but in the mid to upper rpm ranges it couldnt be beat. i like 351w very much, they are fairly torquey for a smaller diaplacment motor and the blocks were cast with a lot of nicle so they are fairly strong.
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Like the others have said, you're dad is stuck in the 70s. If I was in highschool in the early 70s, I'd want a Cleveland or a big nasty Cobra Jet.... or a HEMI!
Today, I want a Dart block and a HUGE turbo. One down, one to go.
The 351W is a 9.5"deck 302 which makes it wider and taller. It has a stronger block than the 351Cleveland. The Cleveland is NOT a big block but does utilize the big bell housing pattern.
Want a powerful motor but less than 700 HP?....use a stock block Windsor with a main girdle and AFR or Trick Flow head. Want more than 700HP?....use a Dart, World or Ford Racing block with 4 bolt mains, siamese bore stroked as much as 454 cubic inches and bolt on real good heads like Yates (351C design) with high compression or power adder(s) depending on what you want and for the purpose you have in mind. Take a look at MM&FF magazine and see what 351W-based fords can do! How fast you really want to go????
Forget the Cleveland unless your restoring an old mach or Boss 351 to orginal.
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I've been wanting to get a full tubular frame for my 66', cut out the shock towers and slam a turbo 351 in it with a tremec t-56 magnum and an airlock 9", ladder bars and gummies. any other suggestions???
Alot of mis information here.
255, 260, 289, 302, 302 Boss 351W are all windsor based engines. They are all small blocks. They all share the same bore spacing and cylinder head design with the BOSS being the exception. Yhe BOSS has Cleveland heads on it.
351 Cleveland, 351M, and 400 are all 335 series small block Ford engines. Guess what? They sare the same bore spacing as the above mentioned engines. Wonder how they can be considered a big block??
Yes the Windsor does have more aftermarket support. That makes it more desireable to build and it can make things a little less complicated. But given the main bearing size of the Cleveland @ 2.75" and the Windsor @ 3.00 inch the Cleveland is at an advantage for higher RPM unless you buy a dart or world block with the 2.75" Clevelad mains in the Windsor design.
They all have advantages and disadvantages. More after market heads for a windsor. But after market Cleveland heads are KILLER over the windsor stuff.
If you are looking for a Windsor cylinder head that is comparable to a Cleveland head you get into using a larger valve on the inline Windsor head. (larger meaning larger than a 2.02 for example) Now look at what these heads do and look at what bore size they are flowed on. Most Windsor head aftermarket companies flow their heads on a 4.125 bore when they incorperate a 2.05 or larger intake valve. Have you ever wondered why?
Take that same head with a 2.05 or larger intake valve and bolt it to your 4.030 inch bore engine with the rotating assembly left out. Look up into the cylinder from the bottom side of the block. What do you see? The intake valve is so close to the cylinder wall you would think it was a young buck trying to get in real close with a hot chic for a slow dance.(cylinder wall shrouding)
This hurts air flow. This is the reason cylinder head companies flow that type of head on larger bore blocks.
Ever think about the cylinder heads that do not have this issue? I can name a few.
TFS Twisted wedge
Fast as cast Twisted wedge
TFS Hi ports
Ford Racing Z304 heads
Canfield heads
Oh and guess what? Stock Cleveland heads and 302 BOSS heads Hmmmmm?????
Cleveland and aftermarket Cleveland heads, and people there are a fair share of them.
TFS
Edlebrock
Ford Racing
Air Flow Dynamics
Cylinder Head Innovations
Blue Thunder
Pro Comp
Take a Windsor set up and go all Windsor stuff(block, heads, intake and do it all engine)
Take the same Windsor and use Cleveland heads with an intake that allows you to run the heads on the Windsor. Which engine will out perform the other?
I know................... Do you????
Sheesh ...... I know of a combo that runs 10.74 @128 in a 3250 pound 1990 Mustang on only engine. Stock crankshaft, stock rods, 850 double pump carb, long tube headers, 9.8 to 1 compression in .060 over bore. It is a displacement of 362 cubes and 87 octane fuel. Drive the car anywhere even super long hauls. Has cast iron 2 barrel Cleveland heads that are ported with a lowly inexpensive 138 dollar flat mechanical cam. It has a smaller than Windsor 9.2 inch deck height.
Oh I forgot, I know this quite well. I built the engine and own the car. And trust me, I have built many Windsors for my clients in my shop. Many chevys, a few pontiacs, a few Mopars, and also the lowly "old school" Clevelands.
I am building two Clevors now. (Cleveland headed Windsors) Why??? Because they will haul ass.
Joe
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Last edited by wildcobrar; 10-20-2009 at 01:44 PM.
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RE: 351 windsor
