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View Poll Results: Do you want to get the Intercooler?
I would have but I didn't like that the X-Charger didn't come intercooled from the get-go like all superchargers should. I'm wondering what the bundled price of the X-Charger+Intercooler will be and what numbers it'll put out.
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sancho, i disagree. i agree with illin in the fact that if the X cost 2500-3000 they would sell 5 times as many. i would have boughten one a damn long time ago. I went with n20 because (compared to other vehicles) the x charger is HUGELY overpriced. Whether its great or not. what illin is saying is whether you sell few of a high priced product or alot of a low priced product then money wise its the same for the maker. However, it would provide much more interest to the people who own 4.0 's if it was less $
For the price, i'll never buy an xcharger. Nitrous is suitable for 1/5th of the cost
I also made this thread to tell Dave how many people were interested, and give him some peace of mind for investing in the production of the intercooler at a time of poor economy. There are people saying hell yes to this, who appear to not have an XCharger. Come on guys what's the deal?
I don't have one for now but my plan is to purchase one as soon as the intercooled kits come out. I've been patiently wating.
As for all of you complaing about the price...just don't buy it. Simple as that. If you want a new Mustang you have to pay the price for it. You could always buy something else if performance is your top concern. There are faster cars out there. If you like roots style superchargers you pay for what you want. I'll pay the extra because I don't want all the pipes filling up the dog house and I like the simple look. If the pipes didn't bother me I'd just go turbo and be done with it. Is it the best bang foy your economy buck? No. It is what it is and people have bought it so far. People will continue buying it.
If paying 70% of your car's value for an upgrade was a problem then explain to me all of the fox stangs with ungodly HP when right now I could find a dozen different 5.0s for $1500 or less and a set of heads can run from $650 to as much as $2000 plus
sancho, i disagree. i agree with illin in the fact that if the X cost 2500-3000 they would sell 5 times as many. i would have boughten one a damn long time ago. I went with n20 because (compared to other vehicles) the x charger is HUGELY overpriced. Whether its great or not. what illin is saying is whether you sell few of a high priced product or alot of a low priced product then money wise its the same for the maker. However, it would provide much more interest to the people who own 4.0 's if it was less $
For the price, i'll never buy an xcharger. Nitrous is suitable for 1/5th of the cost
I would put my savings down that the every single X kit will be more reliable than that X Carbon supercharger posted earlier. Same goes to all the cheap import turbo kits out there. Higher quality parts, GENUINE Magnuson/Eaton Supercharger, no iffy proprietary housing, exceptional ease of installation and instructions, and second-to-none customer service. I think any X-Charger owner will tell you that Dave is a good guy and is not out to screw anyone over with pricing. He has to turn a profit. I don't think he has the resources of a larger company to make more units simultaneously, which would greatly bring down costs. If he could sell them for $2500, he would. He is not stupid, he knows he would sell more if they were cheaper.
If you haven't noticed, any performance parts for hondas and other imports are WAY cheaper. That's because the market for them is huge - thanks to the fast and furious, everyone who owns a honda thinks they have a race car. Sure, there are tons of v6 stangs, but not a TON of people that are looking to slap on F/I like all the ricers in the various hondas, acuras, toyotas, etc. Also note that the 4.0 stang has only been in production since 05, so there really aren't that many 4.0 stangs out there when you compare to all the imports out there. The demand for the performance parts of those imports is WAY greater than for our v6 stangs, allowing companies to make tons of their parts to bring down costs because they know all the ricers out there will buy them up.
The point I am trying to make is that Dave at EE is not trying to screw anyone with his pricing, it's just what he has to do to keep in business. And making remarks that he is screwing people over is likely to perturb some people on here who know him personally.
__________________
'05 Black 4.0 auto | FRPP Duals | Hi-Po X-Charger 2.8 | Bama 91 tunes | Rockford Fosgate 12" sub w/ 500w amp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaunen
why does it say i have a 10incher?? WTF? faps to children,molests kids...wtf unbelievable
Please show me a post where ANYONE said, "Dave is screwing us"
We arent blaming dave for the fact that it is so much money. We just simply think it blow's ass that mustang owners get the shaft when it comes to pricing of performance mods. Whether its cams, whether its forged internals or in this case a supercharger.
But you cant possibly sit here and tell me that PART of the reason only 100 have sold is because of the price, you just cant.
I would put my savings down that the every single X kit will be more reliable than that X Carbon supercharger posted earlier. Same goes to all the cheap import turbo kits out there. Higher quality parts, GENUINE Magnuson/Eaton Supercharger, no iffy proprietary housing, exceptional ease of installation and instructions, and second-to-none customer service.
I have seen both in person. First, they are made by Jackson Racing and they are top-notch kits. Did you click on the link provided? The kit I listed uses a latest gen Eaton supercharger. Furthermore, these units a vastly superior warranty to the X...so I am not sure you have a ton of firm ground here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketballord
I think any X-Charger owner will tell you that Dave is a good guy and is not out to screw anyone over with pricing. He has to turn a profit. I don't think he has the resources of a larger company to make more units simultaneously, which would greatly bring down costs. If he could sell them for $2500, he would. He is not stupid, he knows he would sell more if they were cheaper.
Markets are what they are. Folks wonder why items dont sell...and there is one simple answer...you dont have a buyer. So in almost 3 years, we are sitting at less than 100 units out the door and you have to wonder why.
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketballord
If you haven't noticed, any performance parts for hondas and other imports are WAY cheaper. That's because the market for them is huge - thanks to the fast and furious, everyone who owns a honda thinks they have a race car. Sure, there are tons of v6 stangs, but not a TON of people that are looking to slap on F/I like all the ricers in the various hondas, acuras, toyotas, etc. Also note that the 4.0 stang has only been in production since 05, so there really aren't that many 4.0 stangs out there when you compare to all the imports out there. The demand for the performance parts of those imports is WAY greater than for our v6 stangs, allowing companies to make tons of their parts to bring down costs because they know all the ricers out there will buy them up.
I have noticed and that is exactly the point I have been trying to make. Just FYI, there are nearly 1MM S197's out there now and nearly 70% are V6's. So that puts about 650,000 of them out there. If 1/10 of 1% of us would go FI...that is 650 units. Yes, only 1 in 1000! So we have the numbers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by basketballord
The point I am trying to make is that Dave at EE is not trying to screw anyone with his pricing, it's just what he has to do to keep in business. And making remarks that he is screwing people over is likely to perturb some people on here who know him personally.
Noone said he is screwing people and there is no need to put words in my mouth. I do believe he is grossly overpriced and it is clear from the responses here and other threads that units would sell 10:1 if the price point was $2500.
As challenged earlier...you CAN produce a quality Eaton turn-key kit with tuner for $2500. Lets keep in mind that Jackson is small firm too...and yet they have found a way to bring these to market...and they sell a ton of them.
Like I said earlier...if they were $2500...I would buy one today. I bet allot folks reading this thread would do the same thing. At $4500..I will sit on the sidelines...and so will many others.
I have seen both in person. First, they are made by Jackson Racing and they are top-notch kits. Did you click on the link provided? The kit I listed uses a latest gen Eaton supercharger. Furthermore, these units a vastly superior warranty to the X...so I am not sure you have a ton of firm ground here.
I did click the link. The rotors are Eaton, yes. The housing is their own proprietary housing though. Maybe they are quality, I have not seen them in person, so you may be right here that I don't have a basis to judge. But I would put money for reliability on a full Magnuson/Eaton unit than a proprietary unit with Eaton rotors.
Quote:
Markets are what they are. Folks wonder why items dont sell...and there is one simple answer...you dont have a buyer. So in almost 3 years, we are sitting at less than 100 units out the door and you have to wonder why.
I have noticed and that is exactly the point I have been trying to make. Just FYI, there are nearly 1MM S197's out there now and nearly 70% are V6's. So that puts about 650,000 of them out there. If 1/10 of 1% of us would go FI...that is 650 units. Yes, only 1 in 1000! So we have the numbers.
For 1, EE is nowhere near as well known as Vortech or Procharger, so they suffer on sales right there. I bet there are tons of Vortech and Prochargers out there on sixers in comparison to X-Chargers. But of those, I bet a lot of them would love to have the looks of a positive displacement blower, but they didn't even know the X existed. I will say that I think Dave could spend a little more time on advertising his systems. Had it not been for these forums, I would have never heard of the X-Charger. So what I am saying is that most of the F/I sixers have taken another route, and I think a lot of that is due to not even knowing the X is an option. If you are saying 650,000 S197 sixers are out there, then a tiny portion of those are on the forums, and almost all the rest probably don't know the X exists. A buddy probably tells them Hey you can slap a Vortech on there. So they google vortech, find a vendor and buy that.
Take for example the forums. Of the F/I folks, the X is probably the most popular option. That's because those on the forum know about it. Were the general, non-internet-going sixer community aware of all the options, the X sales would be right behind the Vortechs, IMO.
Quote:
Noone said he is screwing people and there is no need to put words in my mouth. I do believe he is grossly overpriced and it is clear from the responses here and other threads that units would sell 10:1 if the price point was $2500.
As challenged earlier...you CAN produce a quality Eaton turn-key kit with tuner for $2500. Lets keep in mind that Jackson is small firm too...and yet they have found a way to bring these to market...and they sell a ton of them.
Like I said earlier...if they were $2500...I would buy one today. I bet allot folks reading this thread would do the same thing. At $4500..I will sit on the sidelines...and so will many others.
Quote:
Originally Posted by illin
I was challeneged to show that you cannot find a system for $3500 or even $3000...here is one with a tuner for $2500 at your door.
Sorry, but these guys are doing it and STILL turning a profit. They have excellent reviews and are well supported.
So either ours are made in such ridiculously small numbers they cannot get the per unit prices down...or we are getting royally shafted on price...or a combo of the two (probably the latter).
"...we are getting royally shafted on price...or a combo of the two (probably the latter)."
ok so you didn't say "screwed", you said "shafted". My bad, I must have gotten the mental thesaurus out and unknowingly replaced shafted with screwed. A matter of semantics I suppose.
And you guys can say all this stuff about the X being overpriced, but I have yet to hear you complain about the Powerhouse kit. Their kits at ~$5200, by your logic (which an unrealistic logic in this case), are even MORE overpriced considering they sell cheap as hell turn-key turbo kits for hondas. Same reasons why they have to charge that price for their kits apply to the X kit.
Maybe these two companies could try a different business model that could include something like an eBayMotors store to promote their systems, more advertising in magazines and the internet, etc. Then they would have to count on the demand being there to mass-produce their parts for cheaper per unit pricing. But that is just too risky considering the market for s197 sixers is not the same as the market for imports. It is SOOOO much smaller. Hell, even Summit Racing now has an import section in their parts catalog! A damn muscle parts magazine has taken on the import market! that's because it is massive, and comparing the s197 v6 4.0 market to the honda or other import market is just silly.
__________________
'05 Black 4.0 auto | FRPP Duals | Hi-Po X-Charger 2.8 | Bama 91 tunes | Rockford Fosgate 12" sub w/ 500w amp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaunen
why does it say i have a 10incher?? WTF? faps to children,molests kids...wtf unbelievable
Last edited by basketballord; 02-10-2009 at 08:17 PM.
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My bad, I must have gotten the mental thesaurus out and unknowingly replaced shafted with screwed. A matter of semantics I suppose.
