Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
10-16-2006, 12:18 PM
#1
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Join Date: Apr 2006
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Posts: 1,268
Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
I am really getting close to going with the XCharger. As I get closer, more questions and issues come to mind.
The one that is really bugging me is the REAL general reliability of cars that have had power adders put on. People who tend to put these sorts of devices on tend to be a bit forgiving with "issues" that come up.... I think it's generally perceived to be "part of the game".
What do I mean by that? Well, for a car that is basically stock, I would expect to drive it for a significant period of time (50,000 plus miles) without having to be annoyed with a large amount of issues. I.e. I would not expect fluids to be leaking... would not expect the car to not start.... would not expect error codes to keep popping up.... would not expect the car to suddenly be running rough.....
This is where I am having my trouble... I really want a power adder, but I don't want to be tinkering with the car to fix little issues every 1000 miles. I want to be able to take the car on a 1200 mile round trip weekend without a 50% chance of some FI adder issue having me wonder if I will make it back home, or stranding me somewhere.
I want a power adder, but I DON'T WANT MY NEW HOBBY to be screwing with the power adder and car to make sure it run correctly.
So I need a sense from you folks who have power adders..... how fragile are the cars after you add these things? Do you have constant nagging issues, but you just deal with them? Or do you just drive these things for thousands of miles with no big issues?
AND... if you encounter a problem 500 miles from home, how do you cope with this? Can't just take it to a Ford dealer, right? You fix it yourself you hope? Or you are screwed and you tow it home.....
I am leaning toward XCharger if anybody has any specifics on this..... but..... I am worried this route is just the beginning of constant nagging problems.... I am not in the mood for that. If so, I will wait for 2009 Mustangs and go with a GT.
Enlighten me, of FI'ed ones.....
The one that is really bugging me is the REAL general reliability of cars that have had power adders put on. People who tend to put these sorts of devices on tend to be a bit forgiving with "issues" that come up.... I think it's generally perceived to be "part of the game".
What do I mean by that? Well, for a car that is basically stock, I would expect to drive it for a significant period of time (50,000 plus miles) without having to be annoyed with a large amount of issues. I.e. I would not expect fluids to be leaking... would not expect the car to not start.... would not expect error codes to keep popping up.... would not expect the car to suddenly be running rough.....
This is where I am having my trouble... I really want a power adder, but I don't want to be tinkering with the car to fix little issues every 1000 miles. I want to be able to take the car on a 1200 mile round trip weekend without a 50% chance of some FI adder issue having me wonder if I will make it back home, or stranding me somewhere.
I want a power adder, but I DON'T WANT MY NEW HOBBY to be screwing with the power adder and car to make sure it run correctly.
So I need a sense from you folks who have power adders..... how fragile are the cars after you add these things? Do you have constant nagging issues, but you just deal with them? Or do you just drive these things for thousands of miles with no big issues?
AND... if you encounter a problem 500 miles from home, how do you cope with this? Can't just take it to a Ford dealer, right? You fix it yourself you hope? Or you are screwed and you tow it home.....
I am leaning toward XCharger if anybody has any specifics on this..... but..... I am worried this route is just the beginning of constant nagging problems.... I am not in the mood for that. If so, I will wait for 2009 Mustangs and go with a GT.
Enlighten me, of FI'ed ones.....
10-16-2006, 12:47 PM
#2
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,172
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
Well, any FI system is going to reduce the life of the engine...regardless of motor period. Well, maybe with exception to a built block, terminator or what not. But at low boost, most are predicting the cars will run fine to 150K ish before having to deal with issues. There is no exact number because no one has pushed it that long, but a good way to find out is ask some of the Ranger guys with the X.
As for screwing with the power adder, I have been running my all season, beating on it at the track and driving it to work every day with no issues. And I can run it under boost when I'm driving around town or to work and keep wear and tear off of it. One key with this is to invest in a boost guage, with a boost vac display, so you can forcibly run under boost. That is what a lot of us do, I've spoken to Afixer and scrming about it several times.
As for being 500 miles form home, and the car breaks down. To be honest, the nitrous was the most complicated for me on issues. It was wired up wrong....and once I turned on the bottle heater and spary at the same time, I blew the pcm and a fuse and had to have it towed back to Ford for repair. I lucked out as they covered it under warrenty.
The other thing is taking precautions, which I'm a firm believer in. Here is a list of things I do / abide by since my stang is heavily modified and my daily driver:
1. Get a AAA account (includes free towing). Will save your ***!
2. Drive as much as you can under boost
3. Keep a full size spare in the trunk (I use a old stock 16 inch wheel w/bfg, I know this not related, but figured I'd cover it)
4. Keep a basic set of tools in the car, along with a road side kit (includes jumper cables, tire flat, etc)
5. Find a shop close to you that can handle stuff that might not be honored on the warrenty, have them do a few jobs on the car to establish a relationship (I have 2 in my area I could trust in an emergency)
6. Change your oil every 3K miles (with a FI system on there, I wouldn't wait for 5K)
7. And for me personally, I decided the power adder I went with had to have an intercooler
8. Get a wide band gauge to monitor your AF
9. Get a boost gauge to help drive under boost
I'm sure the others will chime in.
As for screwing with the power adder, I have been running my all season, beating on it at the track and driving it to work every day with no issues. And I can run it under boost when I'm driving around town or to work and keep wear and tear off of it. One key with this is to invest in a boost guage, with a boost vac display, so you can forcibly run under boost. That is what a lot of us do, I've spoken to Afixer and scrming about it several times.
As for being 500 miles form home, and the car breaks down. To be honest, the nitrous was the most complicated for me on issues. It was wired up wrong....and once I turned on the bottle heater and spary at the same time, I blew the pcm and a fuse and had to have it towed back to Ford for repair. I lucked out as they covered it under warrenty.
The other thing is taking precautions, which I'm a firm believer in. Here is a list of things I do / abide by since my stang is heavily modified and my daily driver:
1. Get a AAA account (includes free towing). Will save your ***!
2. Drive as much as you can under boost
3. Keep a full size spare in the trunk (I use a old stock 16 inch wheel w/bfg, I know this not related, but figured I'd cover it)
4. Keep a basic set of tools in the car, along with a road side kit (includes jumper cables, tire flat, etc)
5. Find a shop close to you that can handle stuff that might not be honored on the warrenty, have them do a few jobs on the car to establish a relationship (I have 2 in my area I could trust in an emergency)
6. Change your oil every 3K miles (with a FI system on there, I wouldn't wait for 5K)
7. And for me personally, I decided the power adder I went with had to have an intercooler
8. Get a wide band gauge to monitor your AF
9. Get a boost gauge to help drive under boost
I'm sure the others will chime in.
10-16-2006, 01:13 PM
#3
MF Administrator
Join Date: May 2005
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 8,191
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
I am not speaking from direct experience with FI, but from a general modification standpoint.
If you are serious about installing a power adder like the X-charger, then you will also want/need to invest in other mods to accommodate the increased power levels. Like a junkie looking for his next fix, your desire for more power will likely increase after the FI. LCA/UCA's will improve your launch, but your ride quality on a DD may suffer (which may not bother some, but may be a probelm for others). That's just one example. You'll want gears & LSD, which will increase your cruising RPM's. That will also increase wear on your motor because it will be running faster than before installing gears at a given speed.
These are the random thoughts from somebody who is in the same situation as you. I would love an intercooled turbo like Todd's (Rygen's), but I'm not ready financially to make that commitment on my DD (soon to be my wife's DD). It's a matter of looking at your wants/needs/expectations for your car, and deciding what's important to you (thank you Captain Obvious!).
Bill Jr.
28hopup
If you are serious about installing a power adder like the X-charger, then you will also want/need to invest in other mods to accommodate the increased power levels. Like a junkie looking for his next fix, your desire for more power will likely increase after the FI. LCA/UCA's will improve your launch, but your ride quality on a DD may suffer (which may not bother some, but may be a probelm for others). That's just one example. You'll want gears & LSD, which will increase your cruising RPM's. That will also increase wear on your motor because it will be running faster than before installing gears at a given speed.
These are the random thoughts from somebody who is in the same situation as you. I would love an intercooled turbo like Todd's (Rygen's), but I'm not ready financially to make that commitment on my DD (soon to be my wife's DD). It's a matter of looking at your wants/needs/expectations for your car, and deciding what's important to you (thank you Captain Obvious!).
Bill Jr.
28hopup
10-16-2006, 01:24 PM
#4
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,172
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
ORIGINAL: 28hopup
I am not speaking from direct experience with FI, but from a general modification standpoint.
If you are serious about installing a power adder like the X-charger, then you will also want/need to invest in other mods to accommodate the increased power levels. Like a junkie looking for his next fix, your desire for more power will likely increase after the FI. LCA/UCA's will improve your launch, but your ride quality on a DD may suffer (which may not bother some, but may be a probelm for others). That's just one example. You'll want gears & LSD, which will increase your cruising RPM's. That will also increase wear on your motor because it will be running faster than before installing gears at a given speed.
These are the random thoughts from somebody who is in the same situation as you. I would love an intercooled turbo like Todd's (Rygen's), but I'm not ready financially to make that commitment on my DD (soon to be my wife's DD). It's a matter of looking at your wants/needs/expectations for your car, and deciding what's important to you (thank you Captain Obvious!).
Bill Jr.
28hopup
I am not speaking from direct experience with FI, but from a general modification standpoint.
If you are serious about installing a power adder like the X-charger, then you will also want/need to invest in other mods to accommodate the increased power levels. Like a junkie looking for his next fix, your desire for more power will likely increase after the FI. LCA/UCA's will improve your launch, but your ride quality on a DD may suffer (which may not bother some, but may be a probelm for others). That's just one example. You'll want gears & LSD, which will increase your cruising RPM's. That will also increase wear on your motor because it will be running faster than before installing gears at a given speed.
These are the random thoughts from somebody who is in the same situation as you. I would love an intercooled turbo like Todd's (Rygen's), but I'm not ready financially to make that commitment on my DD (soon to be my wife's DD). It's a matter of looking at your wants/needs/expectations for your car, and deciding what's important to you (thank you Captain Obvious!).
Bill Jr.
28hopup
Keep in mind the X makes power at 2K, which is also the stock stall on the auto. So the stock gear on this FI kit works really well.
10-17-2006, 09:17 PM
#6
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location:
Posts: 2,250
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
dont really have input but ive had several cars that i have added f/i too with no problems really. But i dont really keep any of my cars for longer than 80k or so.
10-17-2006, 11:04 PM
#7
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 114
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
LX200:
I am in the same boat as you. I am ready to get the SC but am concerned about what maintenance or what I will need to upgrade. I know a little about cars but absolutely nothing about superchargers. All I know is it will make my car much faster and thats what i want
I also was a little concerned about the life of the car since I drive it everyday. rygenstormlocke stated to drive the car under boost(I honestly do not know what that means). These are the things that I personally need to research
I am in the same boat as you. I am ready to get the SC but am concerned about what maintenance or what I will need to upgrade. I know a little about cars but absolutely nothing about superchargers. All I know is it will make my car much faster and thats what i want
I also was a little concerned about the life of the car since I drive it everyday. rygenstormlocke stated to drive the car under boost(I honestly do not know what that means). These are the things that I personally need to research
10-17-2006, 11:15 PM
#8
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location:
Posts: 2,250
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
ORIGINAL: ScreaminYellow
LX200:
I am in the same boat as you. I am ready to get the SC but am concerned about what maintenance or what I will need to upgrade. I know a little about cars but absolutely nothing about superchargers. All I know is it will make my car much faster and thats what i want
I also was a little concerned about the life of the car since I drive it everyday. rygenstormlocke stated to drive the car under boost(I honestly do not know what that means). These are the things that I personally need to research
LX200:
I am in the same boat as you. I am ready to get the SC but am concerned about what maintenance or what I will need to upgrade. I know a little about cars but absolutely nothing about superchargers. All I know is it will make my car much faster and thats what i want
I also was a little concerned about the life of the car since I drive it everyday. rygenstormlocke stated to drive the car under boost(I honestly do not know what that means). These are the things that I personally need to research
10-18-2006, 01:34 PM
#9
4th Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,268
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
Well... as I've said before, this is my play car, so I am looking at 3000 miles a year. So, it sounds like...
1. If there is any effect on engine longevity, I won't get there
2. The systems are not so fragile that they require constant tinkering
so.... that's all good news.....
1. If there is any effect on engine longevity, I won't get there
2. The systems are not so fragile that they require constant tinkering
so.... that's all good news.....
10-18-2006, 06:17 PM
#10
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Join Date: Apr 2006
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Posts: 1,157
RE: Forced Induction - True effect on car's long term general reliability
sry this is totally off topic but rygen i saw u said 5k miles. I have about 31,000 miles on my car and was supposed to change it at 30,068. Do you think i'll be fine till I drive back down to jersey this weekend and i'll be oh around....31,300?