You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!
I have a question out on the Sniper forums as well but thought I would ask some of you guys who may have Sniper software.
My question is does anyone here running 60 lb injectors with Ford 90 LMAF sensor on Special Forces? Did you have any problems with fuel? If so, what did you do to resolve. I also have Commando software as well.
Note: I selected Ford, 90 Lightning MAF sensor within my tune. I can't give you air/fuel ratio since I have a blown motor build in progress. I am just trying to educate myself.
Thanks,
Keith
This ad is not displayed to registered or logged-in members. Register your free account today and become a member on Mustang Forums!
I have a question out on the Sniper forums as well but thought I would ask some of you guys who may have Sniper software.
My question is does anyone here running 60 lb injectors with Ford 90 LMAF sensor on Special Forces? Did you have any problems with fuel? If so, what did you do to resolve. I also have Commando software as well.
Note: I selected Ford, 90 Lightning MAF sensor within my tune. I can't give you air/fuel ratio since I have a blown motor build in progress. I am just trying to educate myself.
Thanks,
Keith
You should not have a problem with running 60lb injectors and the LMAF. However I would suggest (i am not familiar with sniper but the concepts are the same) that you fine tune the transfer function. That being said the LMAF is not going to measure enough air mass if you plan on making the power those injectors are capable of.
__________________
2001 Bullitt
281CI Blue Printed Engine (Teksid, CP's, Manley Billit, Cobra Crank,) Foxlake Ported SVO heads, PI CAM's, kooks LT's, 2.3L Allen Twin Screw Blower, 63lb, SCT2800 MAF, Mcloed 8" Twin disk, Viper T-56, Griggs GR40 With Watt Link. SSR GT3's... and more.
535HP, 530TQ 12PSI .
11.77 128.5MPH (Times need some work )
+1 and Pat at Sniper is very good at getting transfer functions dialed in he helped me with my 60# injectors and BA3000 90mm MAF sensor. You could always give him a call if you need to.
__________________
2000 Ford Mustang GT
Vortech V1 S Trim
JE 194329 Forged Pistons
CRS 5933F30 Forged Rods
Fel-Pro Gaskets & Bolts
Ford Racing 11" Clutch
Sniper Tuned
Pypes Violators
Mac Prochamber
B&M Shifter
Subframe Connectors
I run 42 lb injectors, the 90MM LMAF and Commando. Hopefully that's close enough . I had issues with it being too rich at idle, too lean at part throttle, and a major tip-in lean issue as well. I found it best to use SF to get the base tune, and then Commando will allow you to fine tune it to perfection. You did select the correct things in your SF tune.
As stated above, getting the Transfer Function correct is paramount. The stock one Sniper has is decent, but certainly not perfect.
The MAF transfer function is located in the "Functions" group under "MAF Transfer Function."
In order to tune this correctly, you'll need a wideband. I suppose you could try to do it with only STFTs and Recon, but that is a royal pain (I've done it both ways and the wideband is so much easier it's not even funny).
First you'll need to set your car in open loop. You can do this by turning off the Adaptive switch in your scalars and making the WOT TPS voltage table at zero. You also need to make sure your Stabilized Open Loop Fuel Table is 14.7 across the board under 4k RPMs and 80% load.
Next, you'll have to drive around and log your wideband AF. Try to get as many different MAF voltages as you can, and wait for your AF to stabilize before moving one.
Let's say you get an AF of 13 at a voltage of .86 (right around idle), and your MAF thinks it should have 23 KG/HR at that level. Clearly this is too rich, and it is caused by your MAF thinking it's getting too much air at .86 volts. So, we need to correct it. The best way to do this is to get an accurate AF ratio at .86 volts. Once you do that, you'll be able to divide the AF you recorded by the target AF (14.7), and then multiply the quotient by the airmass value in the MAF Transfer Function at the given voltage level. In our case, it would be (13/14.7) * 23 = 20.34. So, the NEW value in the .86 volt table entry should be 20.34 KG/HR. This will lean out the mixture and give you a nice 14.7 AFR at idle.
Do that for every MAF point and you're good to go! Everyone's is different, but on my MAF I needed to lean out <1v by about 13%, with 1-2.5v leaned out about 8%.
Also, if you have a blower, make sure your Injector Pressure Drop VS ACT table is set at 40 PSI for all points! I didn't know to do this, and it caused gobs of tuning nightmares.
Good luck!
Last edited by AirBrontosaurus; 08-07-2009 at 09:56 AM.
I run 42 lb injectors, the 90MM LMAF and Commando. Hopefully that's close enough . I had issues with it being too rich at idle, too lean at part throttle, and a major tip-in lean issue as well. I found it best to use SF to get the base tune, and then Commando will allow you to fine tune it to perfection. You did select the correct things in your SF tune.
As stated above, getting the Transfer Function correct is paramount. The stock one Sniper has is decent, but certainly not perfect.
The MAF transfer function is located in the "Functions" group under "MAF Transfer Function."
In order to tune this correctly, you'll need a wideband. I suppose you could try to do it with only STFTs and Recon, but that is a royal pain (I've done it both ways and the wideband is so much easier it's not even funny).
First you'll need to set your car in open loop. You can do this by turning off the Adaptive switch in your scalars and making the WOT TPS voltage table at zero. You also need to make sure your Stabilized Open Loop Fuel Table is 14.7 across the board under 4k RPMs and 80% load.
Next, you'll have to drive around and log your wideband AF. Try to get as many different MAF voltages as you can, and wait for your AF to stabilize before moving one.
Let's say you get an AF of 13 at a voltage of .86 (right around idle), and your MAF thinks it should have 23 KG/HR at that level. Clearly this is too rich, and it is caused by your MAF thinking it's getting too much air at .86 volts. So, we need to correct it. The best way to do this is to get an accurate AF ratio at .86 volts. Once you do that, you'll be able to divide the AF you recorded by the target AF (14.7), and then multiply the quotient by the airmass value in the MAF Transfer Function at the given voltage level. In our case, it would be (13/14.7) * 23 = 20.34. So, the NEW value in the .86 volt table entry should be 20.34 KG/HR. This will lean out the mixture and give you a nice 14.7 AFR at idle.
Do that for every MAF point and you're good to go! Everyone's is different, but on my MAF I needed to lean out <1v by about 13%, with 1-2.5v leaned out about 8%.
Also, if you have a blower, make sure your Injector Pressure Drop VS ACT table is set at 40 PSI for all points! I didn't know to do this, and it caused gobs of tuning nightmares.
Good luck!
Although shooting for 14.7 up to 80% and up to 4000RPM will work. I would set the base fuel table in all cells to the same value. That way you are not hunting a moving target. The Transfer function is correct when the actual A/F ratio matches every cell in the base fuel table (commanded) proceed with caution, DO NOT exceed 80~ LOAD when attempting this especially with a forced induction motor.
Below is an example of what a base table could look like. As you can see the commanded lambda value is not 1.00 all the way to 4000RPM. This particular table using TP rather than LOAD but you can see my point.
__________________
2001 Bullitt
281CI Blue Printed Engine (Teksid, CP's, Manley Billit, Cobra Crank,) Foxlake Ported SVO heads, PI CAM's, kooks LT's, 2.3L Allen Twin Screw Blower, 63lb, SCT2800 MAF, Mcloed 8" Twin disk, Viper T-56, Griggs GR40 With Watt Link. SSR GT3's... and more.
535HP, 530TQ 12PSI .
11.77 128.5MPH (Times need some work )
Pretty good (correct) info to go by. I would command a little fatter and couple of other things.
Keith, Once you have the power plant installed and running, contact me and I can help you out.
Just an FYI..... anytime you are dealing with a Non stock MAF / intake/ CAI set up you Have To dial in the transfer.
Casey
The graph was an example of what a base fuel table could look like. I agree and wouldn't run it that lean either. I am at work and don't have access to advantage or I would have taken a screen shot of one that I would use.
I just see too many people tuning the A/F based on what they want the A/F to be not what the base fuel table says. If you dial in the TF to match the base fuel table you can alter the A/F later by simply altering the commanded lambda. I am sure you knew all of that but others may not.
__________________
2001 Bullitt
281CI Blue Printed Engine (Teksid, CP's, Manley Billit, Cobra Crank,) Foxlake Ported SVO heads, PI CAM's, kooks LT's, 2.3L Allen Twin Screw Blower, 63lb, SCT2800 MAF, Mcloed 8" Twin disk, Viper T-56, Griggs GR40 With Watt Link. SSR GT3's... and more.
535HP, 530TQ 12PSI .
11.77 128.5MPH (Times need some work )
Although shooting for 14.7 up to 80% and up to 4000RPM will work. I would set the base fuel table in all cells to the same value. That way you are not hunting a moving target. The Transfer function is correct when the actual A/F ratio matches every cell in the base fuel table (commanded) proceed with caution, DO NOT exceed 80~ LOAD when attempting this especially with a forced induction motor.
Sorry, I must not have been clear.
What I meant was go into the SOLFT, and set each value to 14.7. In Commando the cells are laid out based on actual commanded AF, not a ratio of the commanded AF to 14.7. So you actually open up the table and just put 14.7 for each cell. That way, you avoid trying to hit a moving target, as you said, and you know EXACTLY what you want your AF to be. It makes the math a lot easier too .
Pretty good (correct) info to go by. I would command a little fatter and couple of other things.
Keith, Once you have the power plant installed and running, contact me and I can help you out.
Just an FYI..... anytime you are dealing with a Non stock MAF / intake/ CAI set up you Have To dial in the transfer.
Casey
Thanks Casey will do! I just got my built short block this week and installing cams, springs, and heads tomorrow. Once my build is done, hopefully by end of month, I will reach out to you. When the time comes, if I send you my new blower S.F. tune could you tweek a modified Commando tune based on all my mods???
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. Ford® is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company
Sniper Special Forces & Commando ?
. I had issues with it being too rich at idle, too lean at part throttle, and a major tip-in lean issue as well. I found it best to use SF to get the base tune, and then Commando will allow you to fine tune it to perfection. You did select the correct things in your SF tune.
