4.10's girlfriend
03-31-2008, 02:48 PM
#11
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: So Cal
Posts: 3,569
RE: 4.10's girlfriend
ORIGINAL: 02ToRcHgTSLP
I have a diablo tuner and the setting for the gear ratio only got to 4.09 as close to 4.10 as I could get. Is my speedometer still gunna be messed up over .01??
I have a diablo tuner and the setting for the gear ratio only got to 4.09 as close to 4.10 as I could get. Is my speedometer still gunna be messed up over .01??
03-31-2008, 04:53 PM
#13
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Georgia
Posts: 931
RE: 4.10's girlfriend
The pinion crush sleeve may have not getten crushed all the way or the pinion nut may have came loose also. My car had a weird noise on decel after I installed mine. I checked and the pinion nut had come loose since I reused my old sleeve and didn't get enough rotatioanal torque on it.
03-31-2008, 06:43 PM
#14
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ca
Posts: 891
RE: 4.10's girlfriend
I got motive gears and I get a hum under high load and sometimeson deceleration but Ive heard thats just the way motive gearsare. I also had to buy a different pinion shim.My car made these noises even before I got gears installedso it doesnt bother me too much.
04-01-2008, 01:41 AM
#17
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 194
RE: 4.10's girlfriend
Best to check it or have it checked BEFORE you have more probs. If they were a used set of gears, good luck getting them perfect. Once they have been run they have a wear pattern period. You can almost never get them exact unless you mark teeth and realign them as you reinstall them.
It shouldn't be noticeable on accell if they are set up correctly. If you here it more on decel then the backlash is most likely off a bit or you're running too thin of an gear oil. If these were new gears get it checked quickly before you ruin them.
It shouldn't be noticeable on accell if they are set up correctly. If you here it more on decel then the backlash is most likely off a bit or you're running too thin of an gear oil. If these were new gears get it checked quickly before you ruin them.
04-01-2008, 01:47 AM
#18
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 194
RE: 4.10's girlfriend
Probably more info than you guys need but here's the best explanation on gear installs and torque specs. This should probably become a stick post just for quick reference under "GEAR INSTALLATION GUIDE" or something similar. Enjoy the read...
Gear Installation Guide and Specs:
[color=#000077]
1. Remove the old gear set and thoroughly clean both the ring gear carrier and rear end housing with solvent. After cleaning, air dry all parts.
2. Always verify that you have the correct gear ratio that you have purchased. This can be checked by dividing ring gear tooth count by the pinion tooth count. e.g. (Ring gear tooth count 35 T, pinion gear Tooth count 10 T, 35 divided by 10 = 3.50:1.
3. Many differential cases have many thousands of miles of service. Check all threads in the case for ware. It may be necessary to chase the treads to clean and align threads.
4. Check side bearing adjusters as they are often warped and out of shape making ring and pinion settings difficult. Replace as necessary.
5. Check ring gear back face for flatness. Generally after heat treating there may be a degree of taper. This may be rectified by lapping gear on sand paper on a glass flat plate. This will give you more even and uniform pattern when setting up you new gear set.
6. Careful attention should be give to blueprinting your rear end. Accurate clearancing will lead to a longer life for your unit.
7. All new parts should be thoroughly cleaned before assembly and checked for damage.
8. Examine the ring gear mounting surface for nicks or burrs which might prevent a flush mounting of the newly installed ring gear. Ring/Pinion tooth depth variations can result from a ring gear that is "cocked" on its mounting surface. If a ring gear spacer is to be used, also check it for surface imperfections. Nicks or burrs can be removed by using block-backed grit paper ora small file. Following material removal rewash in solvent and air dry. Mounting ring gear. Loctite ring gear bolts and torque to factory specifications.
9. All Motive Gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinions have been "Lapped" in sets and should never be mixed with another ring gear or pinion. Check to see serial numbers are the same on the ring gear and pinion.
10. Each motive gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinion is prerun and marked on the pinion face with its proper depth setting called the "Checking Distance". This dimension is from the face of the pinion to the axle center-line. A setting tool must be used to measure the checking distance. Pinion depth is adjustable by adding or subtracting shim thickness. Stay +/-.002 of the pinion dimension, (see Figure 'A' and 'B').
11. Once pinion depth is achieved using a new crush collar or preload shim pack set pinion bearing preload to 15 inch-pounds rotating torque with used bearings, and 25 inch pounds with new bearings. Once preload is set install the seal and loctite pinion nut.
12. Once the pinion gear is installed, position ring gear and carrier into housing to check backlash. Motive Gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinions are developed to be run at .008" to .012" back-lash for street gear sets.
13. Adjustments for backlash is done by spanner rings in the housing or shim packs behind the carrier bearing cups (GM) or cones (Dana). Always be sure carrier bearings are preloaded. The carrier should not fall out of the housing, but should have to be "tapped" in during final installation. Replace bearing caps and torque to factory specifications.
14. You are now ready to verify the tooth contact pattern. A gear marking compound should be used. Paint gear teeth with compound in several spots and rotate ring gear several revolutions. A tooth contact pattern will appear and should be similar to the pattern shown in illustration 'C'. If the pattern is not in the approximate position shown, reset pinion depth and backlash to correct pattern. Pinion shims usually must be moved in .003 of an inch increments to notice a pattern change. If a pattern is heavy toe subtract shims, (see Figure 'D') If a pattern is heavy heel add shims, (see Figure 'E').
NOTE: Reverse the procedure for 8" and 9" Ford
15. Fill the case with required amount of GL6 Torco 85W-140W with additive gear lube, and maintain the proper level at all times. Proper maintenance is a must to protect your safety and the working life of you gear set.
Torque Specifications
Ring Gear Bolts
3/8" x 7/8" RH 55-60 FT#
3/8" x 3/4" RH 45-50 FT#
3/8" ALL LH 45-50 FT#
7/16" ALL 60-65 FT#
1/2" ALL 100-110 FT#
Carrier Cap Bolts
7/16" (5/8" head) 60-65 FT #
1/2" (3/4" head) 80-85 FT #
Ring gear and pinion tooth pattern interpretation
When setting the pinion position, many of the service manuals required a final pinion position check by using gauges that verified the dimension from the center line of the differential carrier (center line of ring gear) to the face of the pinion (button). This surface (button) is not used on all new gears for verifying the pinion position. The service tools will be used to establish the proper amount of shims required prior to installing the pinion gear. The final pinion position will be verified by using the GEAR CONTACT PATTERN METHOD, as described in this bulletin.
RING GEAR AND PINION TOOTH CONTACT PATTERN
The TOE of the gear tooth is the portion of the tooth surface at the end towards the center. The HEEL of the gear tooth is the portion of the tooth surface at the outer end. The TOP LAND of a gear tooth is the surface of the top of the tooth. Every gear has a characteristic pattern. The illustrations show typical patterns only, and explains how patterns shift as gear location is changed. When making pinion position changes, shims should be changed in the range of .002 inch (.05 mm) to .004 inch (.10 mm) until correct pattern has been obtained.
When a change is backlash is required, backlash shims should be changed in the range of 1 1/2 times the amount of backlash required to bring the gears into specification. For example, if the backlash needed to be changed by .004 inch (.10 mm), the shim pack should be changed by .006 inch (.15mm) as a starting point. The actual amount of backlash change obtained will vary depending upon the ratio and gear size.
High backlash is corrected by moving the ring gear closer to the pinion. Low backlash is corrected by moving the ring gear away from the pinion. These corrections are made by switching shims from one side of the differential case to the other.
NOTE
When making changes, note that two variables are involved. Example: If you have the backlash set correctly to specifications and you change the pinion position shim, you may have to readjust the backlash to the correct specification before checking the pattern. Refer to pattern interpretation.
[color=#dd0000][b]WARNING: Gear teeth may have sharp edges. When han
Gear Installation Guide and Specs:
[color=#000077]
1. Remove the old gear set and thoroughly clean both the ring gear carrier and rear end housing with solvent. After cleaning, air dry all parts.
2. Always verify that you have the correct gear ratio that you have purchased. This can be checked by dividing ring gear tooth count by the pinion tooth count. e.g. (Ring gear tooth count 35 T, pinion gear Tooth count 10 T, 35 divided by 10 = 3.50:1.
3. Many differential cases have many thousands of miles of service. Check all threads in the case for ware. It may be necessary to chase the treads to clean and align threads.
4. Check side bearing adjusters as they are often warped and out of shape making ring and pinion settings difficult. Replace as necessary.
5. Check ring gear back face for flatness. Generally after heat treating there may be a degree of taper. This may be rectified by lapping gear on sand paper on a glass flat plate. This will give you more even and uniform pattern when setting up you new gear set.
6. Careful attention should be give to blueprinting your rear end. Accurate clearancing will lead to a longer life for your unit.
7. All new parts should be thoroughly cleaned before assembly and checked for damage.
8. Examine the ring gear mounting surface for nicks or burrs which might prevent a flush mounting of the newly installed ring gear. Ring/Pinion tooth depth variations can result from a ring gear that is "cocked" on its mounting surface. If a ring gear spacer is to be used, also check it for surface imperfections. Nicks or burrs can be removed by using block-backed grit paper ora small file. Following material removal rewash in solvent and air dry. Mounting ring gear. Loctite ring gear bolts and torque to factory specifications.
9. All Motive Gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinions have been "Lapped" in sets and should never be mixed with another ring gear or pinion. Check to see serial numbers are the same on the ring gear and pinion.
10. Each motive gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinion is prerun and marked on the pinion face with its proper depth setting called the "Checking Distance". This dimension is from the face of the pinion to the axle center-line. A setting tool must be used to measure the checking distance. Pinion depth is adjustable by adding or subtracting shim thickness. Stay +/-.002 of the pinion dimension, (see Figure 'A' and 'B').
11. Once pinion depth is achieved using a new crush collar or preload shim pack set pinion bearing preload to 15 inch-pounds rotating torque with used bearings, and 25 inch pounds with new bearings. Once preload is set install the seal and loctite pinion nut.
12. Once the pinion gear is installed, position ring gear and carrier into housing to check backlash. Motive Gear and Motive Gear Performance ring gear and pinions are developed to be run at .008" to .012" back-lash for street gear sets.
13. Adjustments for backlash is done by spanner rings in the housing or shim packs behind the carrier bearing cups (GM) or cones (Dana). Always be sure carrier bearings are preloaded. The carrier should not fall out of the housing, but should have to be "tapped" in during final installation. Replace bearing caps and torque to factory specifications.
14. You are now ready to verify the tooth contact pattern. A gear marking compound should be used. Paint gear teeth with compound in several spots and rotate ring gear several revolutions. A tooth contact pattern will appear and should be similar to the pattern shown in illustration 'C'. If the pattern is not in the approximate position shown, reset pinion depth and backlash to correct pattern. Pinion shims usually must be moved in .003 of an inch increments to notice a pattern change. If a pattern is heavy toe subtract shims, (see Figure 'D') If a pattern is heavy heel add shims, (see Figure 'E').
NOTE: Reverse the procedure for 8" and 9" Ford
15. Fill the case with required amount of GL6 Torco 85W-140W with additive gear lube, and maintain the proper level at all times. Proper maintenance is a must to protect your safety and the working life of you gear set.
Torque Specifications
Ring Gear Bolts
3/8" x 7/8" RH 55-60 FT#
3/8" x 3/4" RH 45-50 FT#
3/8" ALL LH 45-50 FT#
7/16" ALL 60-65 FT#
1/2" ALL 100-110 FT#
Carrier Cap Bolts
7/16" (5/8" head) 60-65 FT #
1/2" (3/4" head) 80-85 FT #
Ring gear and pinion tooth pattern interpretation
When setting the pinion position, many of the service manuals required a final pinion position check by using gauges that verified the dimension from the center line of the differential carrier (center line of ring gear) to the face of the pinion (button). This surface (button) is not used on all new gears for verifying the pinion position. The service tools will be used to establish the proper amount of shims required prior to installing the pinion gear. The final pinion position will be verified by using the GEAR CONTACT PATTERN METHOD, as described in this bulletin.
RING GEAR AND PINION TOOTH CONTACT PATTERN
The TOE of the gear tooth is the portion of the tooth surface at the end towards the center. The HEEL of the gear tooth is the portion of the tooth surface at the outer end. The TOP LAND of a gear tooth is the surface of the top of the tooth. Every gear has a characteristic pattern. The illustrations show typical patterns only, and explains how patterns shift as gear location is changed. When making pinion position changes, shims should be changed in the range of .002 inch (.05 mm) to .004 inch (.10 mm) until correct pattern has been obtained.
When a change is backlash is required, backlash shims should be changed in the range of 1 1/2 times the amount of backlash required to bring the gears into specification. For example, if the backlash needed to be changed by .004 inch (.10 mm), the shim pack should be changed by .006 inch (.15mm) as a starting point. The actual amount of backlash change obtained will vary depending upon the ratio and gear size.
High backlash is corrected by moving the ring gear closer to the pinion. Low backlash is corrected by moving the ring gear away from the pinion. These corrections are made by switching shims from one side of the differential case to the other.
NOTE
When making changes, note that two variables are involved. Example: If you have the backlash set correctly to specifications and you change the pinion position shim, you may have to readjust the backlash to the correct specification before checking the pattern. Refer to pattern interpretation.
[color=#dd0000][b]WARNING: Gear teeth may have sharp edges. When han
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