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Bought a 96 gt tonight...Lots of CEL codes

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Old 01-25-2013, 09:56 PM
  #31  
petrock
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Originally Posted by gmb96gt
The cel just came back on. System too lean bank 1 and 2. I do know that one of the o2 sensors(passenger side) has a broken wire
That broken wire would probably explain the p1036 & p0141 codes you got. I’d replace that sensor or if money is tight you could cut out the bad wire, solder in some good new wire and seal it with some shrink wrap tubing.


Originally Posted by gmb96gt
and it sounds like I have a small exhaust leak somewhere around the exhaust manifold or manifold to x pipe.
If the leak is between the pre-Cat O2 sensor & the motor then that would explain the lean condition your having. If the leak is between the cat and exhaust tip, then it is not causing your lean condition. However, the lean condition is being seen on both sides of the motor (bank 1 & bank 2), so you may have exhaust leaks on both sides.

Good luck...

Last edited by petrock; 01-25-2013 at 09:58 PM.
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Old 01-25-2013, 09:57 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by gmb96gt
The cel just came back on. System too lean bank 1 and 2. I do know that one of the o2 sensors(passenger side) has a broken wire and it sounds like I have a small exhaust leak somewhere around the exhaust manifold or manifold to x pipe.
Gee, you think maybe those might be part of the problem?
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Old 01-25-2013, 09:59 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by petrock
That broken wire would probably explain the p1036 & p0141 codes you got. I’d replace that sensor or re-solder that wire back together with some shrink wrap tubing.



If the leak is between the pre-Cat O2 sensor & the motor then that would explain the lean condition your having. If the leak is between the cat and exhaust tip, then it is not causing your lean condition. However, the lean condition is being seen on both sides of the motor (bank 1 & bank 2), so you may have exhaust leaks on both sides.

Good luck...
Tomorrow will be my first day to actually work on the car. When I get off work, it's dark. I'll change the fuel filter, oil, trans mount and try to hunt down the exhaust leak. If it doesn't rain that is.

Anyone have any input on the frame situation?
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:05 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by cliffyk
Gee, you think maybe those might be part of the problem?
Well I didn't know about the o2 sensor until the car was on the lift earlier. And I'm not wondering why these codes are popping now. I'd be surprised if they weren't. But I will admit, I really wasn't sure if a small exhaust leak could trip the o2.
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:11 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by petrock
That broken wire would probably explain the p1036 & p0141 codes you got. I’d replace that sensor or if money is tight you could cut out the bad wire, solder in some good new wire and seal it with some shrink wrap tubing.
The OP said it "has a broken wire", in the absence of knowing what particular wire was broken (a heater or O² sensor signal wire) it is difficult to say what would cause what. Also, many O² sensor wires are made of Monel (nickel/copper alloy) and cannot be soft soldered--it is much better to use a full compression, dielectric grease filled, crimped butt connector on O² sensor wires. HF has a great full compression tool for only $10.


If the leak is between the pre-Cat O2 sensor & the motor then that would explain the lean condition your having. If the leak is between the cat and exhaust tip, then it is not causing your lean condition. However, the lean condition is being seen on both sides of the motor (bank 1 & bank 2), so you may have exhaust leaks on both sides.

Good luck...
An exhaust leak near (even after) the sensor will cause it to report a lean condition. This happens because the exhaust flow is not one homogeneous stream, but rather a series of pulses created by each exhaust event. These pulses have a head, body, and tail; each with different characteristic, with their pressure relative to the outside world being the most significant.
  • The head is at a pressure higher than ambient, when it passes the "leak" the gas flows out into the world; but the chemical composition of the gas in the pipe remains unchanged;
  • The body is at or close to ambient pressure. When it passes the leak nothing happens as it and the ambient pressure are nearly the same--the chemical make-up of the gas in the pipe remains unchanged;
  • The tail is at less than ambient pressure (nearly a complete vacuum), and when it passes by the leak it sucks in ambient air--changing the exhaust gas chemical composition and making it appear "leaner" to the O2 sensor;
This is why the leak makes the PCM believe the mix is lean, a big or close enough leak can cause the sensor response to slow or even appear "stuck".

If this condition exists long enough the rich mixture (the PCM will richen the mix because it thinks it's lean and the leak prevents it from reporting properly) the O² sensor will be damaged by the overly rich mixture.

The sensor can be bench tested using a propane torch and multimeter, however the exhaust leak needs to be fixed or the "lean" condition will continue, and it will just ruin a new sensor...
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:15 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by gmb96gt
Tomorrow I will change the fuel filter, but it doesn't act like it's starving for fuel.
While it is probably a good idea to change the filter out since you don’t know when it was last changed, or ever changed, I doubt it has anything to do with the problems your having. So don’t be surprised if it doesn’t fix anything.

Originally Posted by gmb96gt
I really wasn't sure if a small exhaust leak could trip the o2.
Yes it can, very easily. Any unmetered air in the motor and/or exhaust will cause the O2 sensors to read more o2 then expected in the exhaust. The computer will, as a result, think the motor is running lean and try to correct it by dumping more fuel into the system. So the computer thinks your running lean, dumps more fuel into the system making you run rich. All due to the exhaust leak.

Last edited by petrock; 01-25-2013 at 10:19 PM.
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:18 PM
  #37  
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I just have to say...it does not look fun to replace the exhaust manifold gaskets, or install headers on these cars.
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:23 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by petrock
While it is probably a good idea to change the filter out since you don’t know when it was last changed, or ever changed, I doubt it has anything to do with the problems your having. So don’t be surprised if it doesn’t fix anything.


Yes it can, very easily. Any unmetered air in the motor and/or exhaust will cause the O2 sensors to read more o2 then expected in the exhaust. The computer will, as a result, think the motor is running lean and try to correct it by dumping more fuel into the system. So the computer thinks your running lean, dumps more fuel into the system making you run rich. All due to the exhaust leak.
Yeah I really don't expect the filter to fix it.

Understood. Looks like a pita to fix. lol
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:28 PM
  #39  
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It's not even remotely cold today and after Idling for 20+ mins, this "steam" never let up. The mechanic told me I probably had water in my mufflers. Does anyone else's car do this? Is this a ford thing? It's driving me crazy.
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