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347 stroker + TFS TW 195cc "fast as cast" + custom cam and supporting cast........ as Emeril would say..... BAM!
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__________________ ACRONYMS:
LUK=Let Us Know, GL=Good Luck, LMK=Let Me Know, JIC=Just In Case, BTSTDTRT=Been There Seen That Done That Repaired That, YCYDYP=Your Car Your Dough Your Prerogative and the classic... DILLIGAS=Do I Look Like I Give A S***
1986 GT-X303-289 heads-1.72 rockers-RG 4+1 Trans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel5.0
Great thoughts will overwhelm a feeble mind.
There is never money to do it right, but there's always money to do it over.
The proof of understanding is the ability to explain it. (H. Torruella)
i checked Trick flow and the fast as cast is a 190cc. i was thinking of going bigger like a 205 TW but valves and exh runners are the same size.
so would the 205cc head make any more power than the 190cc because of the same size valves and exhaust?
__________________
1989 Mustang coupe, 5.0 5spd swap, Centerforce DF, 3.73's, BBk's, Flowmaster cat-back. BLACK
1988 Mustang GT 5.0 5spd.-- 1962 Ford Falcon 302 5 spd
why are high rpm motors such pigs on the street??? i have a buddy with a 7000+rpm sbc which is daily driver. Big cam, idles at like 1100rpm. not the nicest but it works
I said normally not always. We all have a differant outlook as to what is truely a street car and what is a marginal street car. While a 306 could be made a lot more streetable at 7000 rpm than a 347 the fact remains that no cam can make really great power for off idle to 7000 rpm. This is where custom ground cam really comes into play. It can widen out the power band in your exact combo. But you have to know exactly what that is first.
If You buddy is reving his Small Block Chevy past 7000 under load rpm he's doing it with a Solid roller. Solid rollers have a much more aggressive ramp profile and nice tight spring pressures.
What I consider a Pig on the street may be perfectly acceptable to someone else. It's subjective. My car for instance. It makes great power, idles at around 1200 rpm (has a custom ground cam) and I could probably run it with a 1800 stall converter and make it more streetable but FOR ME that not optimal for the real power band of the car so it has a 3500 stall in it. To me my car will be an absolute pig on the street. I have no doubt I could drive it daily with no problems. While it will idle at 1200 rpm and the engine pulls fairly well from 1500 rpm but it really comes alive around 3000 rpm.
The bottom line is that streetable, true sreet car is a very subjective term. The one thing thats for sure in any engine is that in order to get up to 7000+ rpm you have to have some tight spring pressures and the larger the valve the more spring pressure you need. High spring pressures lead to valvetrain failure. There is no free lunch
i checked Trick flow and the fast as cast is a 190cc. i was thinking of going bigger like a 205 TW but valves and exh runners are the same size.
so would the 205cc head make any more power than the 190cc because of the same size valves and exhaust?
No specific component makes power on its own, it has to be matched, combined based on what you're looking for. Just like this 306 example that is a daily driveable setup (with A/C and everything)...... Canfields 195, Victor Jr intake, ProForm 750, 1 7/8" headers, and it idles at 650-700 pulling a solid 17" of vacuum. It also pulls to 7200 RPM's before he can shift.... and no.... high spring pressures (when valve train is set/configured correctly) do not lead to valve train failure..... in that example "175#s on the seat and 460# on the nose" were the ticket.
And yes.... TW's "fast as cast" are 190cc...... sorry.
__________________ ACRONYMS:
LUK=Let Us Know, GL=Good Luck, LMK=Let Me Know, JIC=Just In Case, BTSTDTRT=Been There Seen That Done That Repaired That, YCYDYP=Your Car Your Dough Your Prerogative and the classic... DILLIGAS=Do I Look Like I Give A S***
1986 GT-X303-289 heads-1.72 rockers-RG 4+1 Trans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel5.0
Great thoughts will overwhelm a feeble mind.
There is never money to do it right, but there's always money to do it over.
The proof of understanding is the ability to explain it. (H. Torruella)
.. and no.... high spring pressures (when valve train is set/configured correctly) do not lead to valve train failure..... in that example "175#s on the seat and 460# on the nose" were the ticket.
So you don't think that 460#s of open pressure on a hyd roller cam will speed up valve train failure? That kind of pressure is rough on the valve train and he better be running some serious parts. (which I'm sure he is) Just a little hard core hyd roller for my taste.
So you don't think that 460#s of open pressure on a hyd roller cam will speed up valve train failure? That kind of pressure is rough on the valve train and he better be running some serious parts. (which I'm sure he is) Just a little hard core hyd roller for my taste.
Nope.... that was an item tested by Crane some time ago (July 2007) using a spintron setup to prove the xxx# valve spring pressure = hydraulic roller lifters collapse fallacy/mythology. They ran a test bed engine with valve spring pressures that started at 145# of seat pressure and 440# of open pressure 248/248 duration and .632" lift with 1.7 rockers, @5400 RPM's for periods of 50 hrs, and ended with seat pressures of 240# and open pressures of 615#...... when a cam lobe gave way due to a possible PR flex issue.... not the lifters, not the rest of the valve train.
It may be hardcore for your taste, but it drives like a stock engine, in 5th. gear down to 1,500 RPM's, no bogging, no hesitation/stumbling and revs above 7,000 RPM's...... 11.40 ET@117 MPH after a 200 miles drive.
__________________ ACRONYMS:
LUK=Let Us Know, GL=Good Luck, LMK=Let Me Know, JIC=Just In Case, BTSTDTRT=Been There Seen That Done That Repaired That, YCYDYP=Your Car Your Dough Your Prerogative and the classic... DILLIGAS=Do I Look Like I Give A S***
1986 GT-X303-289 heads-1.72 rockers-RG 4+1 Trans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel5.0
Great thoughts will overwhelm a feeble mind.
There is never money to do it right, but there's always money to do it over.
The proof of understanding is the ability to explain it. (H. Torruella)
im leaning towards the 306 now, cheaper and im thinking about where i should be putting my money right now (work tools, house etc...) so i got a good crank ,rods and block.
tfs190cc fast as cast. 11:comp. hollley systemax. 75 mm tb. 80mm maf. with 30lb inj w/ a 190lph pump on top of a 306 with a custom cam . should be 350hp
my goal is to run mid to low 12's which i think is capable with a good set of sticky tires.
if not, then the bitch will be on the bottle fed.
Thanks huge guys, really appreciate the info/ tips/ help
__________________
1989 Mustang coupe, 5.0 5spd swap, Centerforce DF, 3.73's, BBk's, Flowmaster cat-back. BLACK
1988 Mustang GT 5.0 5spd.-- 1962 Ford Falcon 302 5 spd
im leaning towards the 306 now, cheaper and im thinking about where i should be putting my money right now (work tools, house etc...) so i got a good crank ,rods and block.
tfs190cc fast as cast. 11:comp. hollley systemax. 75 mm tb. 80mm maf. with 30lb inj w/ a 190lph pump on top of a 306 with a custom cam . should be 350hp
my goal is to run mid to low 12's which i think is capable with a good set of sticky tires.
if not, then the bitch will be on the bottle fed.
Thanks huge guys, really appreciate the info/ tips/ help
I'm putting together a stock block 302 (standard bore). I went custom cam, and my goal was to be in the 12's with my 160k mile 89 hatchback. Jay Allen ground me a custom cam, based on the data I provided (302, Twisted Wedge Heads, 650 double pumper, 410 gear, 3100lbs, AOD with a kit and a 3300 stall converter, Nitto drag radials, upper and lower control arms, strange adjustable struts, Moroso drag springs, full length sub connectors, rear seat delete, fiberglass hood, blah blah blah). After ordering, I received an email with my cam data and freaked out! The data showed that this cam would perform at it's optimum, with a 4500 stall converter?. I was puzzled as to why he ground this profile, when I stated on my data sheet that I already had a 3300 converter. A call to Jay and he assured me that my goals would be reached with the cam he ground. I didn't understand the data sheet, but Jay explained that I could exceed my goals if I went with a higher stall. Moral to the story: A custom cam will get you closer to your goals than an OFS cam, as long as you provide accurate data.
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