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Help with Valvetrain Problems!!!!!

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Old 12-08-2008, 12:39 AM   #1
88bluethunder
 
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Default Help with Valvetrain Problems!!!!!

OK, so I got a little 302 with GT40P Heads and the FRPP 1.6 rollers on them and a FRPP
B-Cam. a few months ago i notices the valve train getting louder and louder with a pretty harsh ticking coming from them. so i figured OK, well maybe they are outta adjustment. once i realized they are non-adjustable i bought the Shim Kit from summit to try and make a difference, well upon taking it all apart i decided to have a look at my lifters and i noticed one was cracked on the inside ( #8 cylinder exhaust side ) so i got new lifters from ford. Well i pulled the old lifters to put the new ones in and noticed that the old ones are about a 1/2 to 3/4 of a cm longer than the OEM lifters from ford. SO, the question is without knowing what kind of lifters these longer ones are, how do i replace all this and fix the problem?? Can I put the OEM lifters in and run fine with those possibly having to adjust the rockers with the Shim Kit?, or will i need to measure out new push-rods??? keep in mind I'm pretty mechanically inclined, but valvetrain is something I'm still learning on and this is my first stang... so go easy on me. I'm in the military and i'm due to go home for the holidays in a few days, so I'm looking for a quick, easy, CHEAP solution... thanx
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88 Mustang GT
.040 Bore, GT40P Heads w/ 1.6RR, B-Cam, Edelbrock Intake,70mm T/B, MSD Ignition, A/C Delet Kit,Under Drive Pulleys, Aluminum Radiator, Steeda TRI-AX, Aluminum Flywheel and driveshaft,UPR K-Member Kit w/Coil Overs, 3.73 Gears.

2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
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Old 12-08-2008, 06:35 AM   #2
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Can you post a picture of the two lifters?
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Old 12-08-2008, 04:35 PM   #3
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88 Mustang GT
.040 Bore, GT40P Heads w/ 1.6RR, B-Cam, Edelbrock Intake,70mm T/B, MSD Ignition, A/C Delet Kit,Under Drive Pulleys, Aluminum Radiator, Steeda TRI-AX, Aluminum Flywheel and driveshaft,UPR K-Member Kit w/Coil Overs, 3.73 Gears.

2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-08-2008, 04:38 PM   #4
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hows this??? i tried to take a picture of the lifter that is messed up, but i couldn't get my camera to focus in enough.. its broken internally, i'm quess from the pushrod bounceing on it.
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88 Mustang GT
.040 Bore, GT40P Heads w/ 1.6RR, B-Cam, Edelbrock Intake,70mm T/B, MSD Ignition, A/C Delet Kit,Under Drive Pulleys, Aluminum Radiator, Steeda TRI-AX, Aluminum Flywheel and driveshaft,UPR K-Member Kit w/Coil Overs, 3.73 Gears.

2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-08-2008, 04:41 PM   #5
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oh and the one on the left is the factory OEM replacement, and the right is the mystery lifter thats in the car now...
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88 Mustang GT
.040 Bore, GT40P Heads w/ 1.6RR, B-Cam, Edelbrock Intake,70mm T/B, MSD Ignition, A/C Delet Kit,Under Drive Pulleys, Aluminum Radiator, Steeda TRI-AX, Aluminum Flywheel and driveshaft,UPR K-Member Kit w/Coil Overs, 3.73 Gears.

2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-08-2008, 06:22 PM   #6
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I wish I could give you an accurate answer but I can't I don't remember seeing a lifter exactly like the one on the right. Although it looks well made it looks very heavy. Looks can be deceptive though. Check the depth of the pushrod cup on one of the good lifters to see how it compares to the new lifter. The cup should be sitting deeper in lifter on the old ones. Can you take a Micrometer or caliper and see if they both measure .875. If they measure the same and the cup sits at the same height then it should be a drop in repair. make sure to replace the pushrod. If the cup broke it has beat the pushrod up.
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Old 12-09-2008, 02:11 PM   #7
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Well just by sight, the old one's cup is still just a hair higher than the OEM but i aint sure how much, i'll check it, and get an accurate number tomorrow at work and get back with you. if the difference is off by only .100 or so, can i still us the new ones??
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88 Mustang GT
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2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-09-2008, 03:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 88bluethunder View Post
Well just by sight, the old one's cup is still just a hair higher than the OEM but i aint sure how much, i'll check it, and get an accurate number tomorrow at work and get back with you. if the difference is off by only .100 or so, can i still us the new ones??
You can use the new ones if thats the case but you would have to use a +.100 pushrod if the pushrod was the right length to begin with.
Place the new lifter in and bring the cam around on the base circle (lowest part) and put a dab of grease on top of the valve stem. Place a push rod and rocker arm on and bolt it down. Check to make sure the wheel on your roller rocker hits in the center of the valve stem with about .030-.040 preload in the lifter. If you not there you will need a differant length poshrods.
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Old 12-09-2008, 04:20 PM   #9
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thanx alot man, i'll give it a try this weekend. i gotta get this thing goin before i go on leave. I can always get a plane ticket, but drivin my car is always more fun. plus i gotta a little rivalry goin on with one of my buddies who's got a 94 331. he's got more motor, but less driving skill.. i'll repost if i have any further problems, again thank you.
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2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-10-2008, 01:07 PM   #10
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well i checked the differences between the two with a micrometer and the mytery lifters are at 2.302 and the Replacement ones are at 2.254 not much of difference but how will that effect this whole process??
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2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-10-2008, 01:27 PM   #11
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IMO i would make them all the same, i would feel uncomfortable putting two different lifters in. but im sure .048 doesnt make a big difference. just make sure you adjust your rocker properly just to make sure you dont get a tick.
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Old 12-10-2008, 01:38 PM   #12
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Your pushrod shoud be .050 shorter IF it was the right length before.

Place new lifter in the bore.
Place the lifter bar down to hold it still
Bring the cam onto the base circle
Put the push rod in
plave a light coat of grease on the valve tip
Carefully (without taking the grease off the valve tip) install the rocker.
Bolt it down without any shims.
If the lifter cup collapes .030-.040 and the roller on the rocker tip in on the center of the stem you are good to go. If the lifter goes deeper add shims until you get it right. If the the lifter cup is up against the snap ring or the roller is moved to the intake side on the tip of the valve then your pushrods are to short.

Of course an adjustable pushrod length checker would be faster but this should get you in the ball park. Just remember Lifter cup .030-040 -+ and the roller tip on the center of the valve.
Let me know what you find. With the right lifters I bet you are pretty much spot on when they go on without the shims.
install th
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Old 12-10-2008, 03:53 PM   #13
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Again thanx alot man!! i'm pullin it back in the shop this sunday and puttin it back together.. i'll let ya know..
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2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
Lockers and 5.13gears F&R
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Old 12-10-2008, 03:59 PM   #14
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Instead of grease on the valve tip I used a magic marker. It worked alot better than grease. You got them lifters from Ford?? Bet those were expensive.
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Old 12-10-2008, 04:23 PM   #15
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Install the FRPP replacement lifters and make sure you check for the proper valve train geometry (which includes determining what length PR's are needed).
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Old 12-11-2008, 06:34 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Instead of grease on the valve tip I used a magic marker. It worked alot better than grease. You got them lifters from Ford?? Bet those were expensive.
actually the guy i bought the car from had them along with a pretty good list of other parts to sell with the car. which is also a reason why this problem is occuring, cuz i bought somone else's project... if you only knew how much of his mistakes i've already fixed..
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2000 F350 7.3L PSD
10" Lift on 38's
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Intake, Exhaust,Guages, and TW Chip
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Old 12-11-2008, 06:34 PM
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