Kazoom

I forgot to mention again that I also have 2 sets of these 32V heads. Which I am modding to boss intake ports for bigci, 428ci engines.

67mustang302

Still a waste of money when you look at $ per power produced. Sure, 4V heads have superior flow characteristics IN SOME AREAS(which is widely overlooked....pushrod heads actually have flow quality advantages at lower rpm).

Is it unique? Yeah. But for the same mount of money you could build a pushrod engine of the same size that makes more power.

That's the point people are trying to make. For what it costs to get those 32V heads and the stuff to make them work, you could get a set of bitchen TEA ported heads and a turbo kit, and make 50-100% more power on pump fuel.

And in regards to the same old *** argument that ALWAYS come up....if OHC tech is so much more badass, then why are the pushrod Corvettes out today the rape-o-saurus rexes of their respective automotive class?

tinman

If the closed minded type of thinking we have by some people on this subject had prevailed 55 years ago we would still be running flathead Fords with 284 C.I.D. and .410 lift camshafts.
The world is always changing around us and we must change with it.
I'd bet that if those heads really catch on, in a better economy, they would get cheaper fast.

Kazoom

I guess some just want to keep there heads in the sand and cry about what other people spend there money on LOL, I do not need to prove anything about how much better 4 valve tech is as... Mihovitz has allready done this with his small 280ci 32v stock ford engine beating 500+ci hemi's and I will bet he will be doing 5.90's by end of year with his stock 32v head mill.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86uLw...eature=related

tinman

Kazoom; I think you are seeing the results of class warfare here with the heads.
The 'I can't/don't have any so they are no good.....
I also know that the Twisted Wedge heads I have were designed 20+ years ago and the Vic Jrs. probably 10-12 years ago.
I'll still go run my car with one or the other of them and have fun doing it......

Kazoom

Hi tinman, I do find it funny that posting about these 32V heads gives some guys out there a total crap FIT for some reason, corral forum is no diffrent. When they cant argue with the 4V tech then some of them start crying about the price. Which seems like some of them are being big hypocrits as some of these same guys are the ones complaining to buy american, duh... well I did and they still cry lol. I was bored with my 2 valve stuff and wanted to get into the tech of the 4v pushrod stuff as it has been out there in bikes since 1913? and Olds had/did some really neat 4v stuff in the 60's also, the W-43 engine for one example is close in design to the arao stuff. I wish there was more competition out there for 4V pushrod stuff but for right now dominion/arao seem to be the main ones unless I start making my own version.

A VERY neat Olds W-43 4valve vid... notice the side ways big 4V C style intake ports on the W-43!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJMcpixWLO0

Also the ranting at the begining of this thread is funny also as I wish some could use some common sence as...

How is it possible for Dominion / Arao to still be in business for MORE than 20 YEARS in cali and STILL be in business today IN cali today if they were ripping off guys for over 20 years and they have been and still are registered with sema and have been at the sema shows for years including this year if they are such big crooks lol...

DATED... MAY 5, 2011

http://www.themustangnews.com/conten...block-mustang/

tinman

Ford also had some SOHC 302 experimental stuff back in that same era.
BTW, common sense don't necessarily rule this board, LOL.....
You must remember that the 'adverage' poster on here does bolt-on type modifications and there car may run mid 13's........

67mustang302

I don't think people are trying to argue against the better capability of 4V heads, they do a lot of things better than a pushrod head can. But 2 facts still remain, 1 is that pushrod heads can do a few things very well and are a lot more efficient than people give them credit for. And 2 is that in the end, there's a point of diminishing returns with cost...when you can get more performance for less money, what's the point of spending more money for less performance?

Yeah, if you have the money to spend and want to do it, that's great. It's actually how Formula 1 operates, which is why they're on the cutting edge of development in many areas and are effectively prototyping stuff we might not see for 10-20 more years.

I work in the engineering world in oil/natural gas. Pretty much EVERYTHING is driven by a cost vs efficiency ratio. The huge natural gas engines(and by huge I mean engines that produce over 5,000hp at 300rpm from 10's of thousands of cubic inches) are all pushrod. The engines have to meet emissions, so combustion efficiency matters for emissions as well as fuel consumption. And while OHC would help to reduce emissions and fuel consumption, the cost associated with building and maintaining them simply is not enough to justify it. The money is better spent elsewhere.

The same is true with automotive engines, it's a matter of cost vs efficiency and avoiding going past the point of diminishing returns. Everyone builds an engine on some kind of budget, so the goal is the most amount of performance for the least amount of money invested. Whatever it takes to get there.

The general point that people are making isn't against 4V heads, but the extreme costs involved in using a limited production 4V head on an engine never designed for it. ?If your goal is to run 4V heads, then yes you'll use them. But otherwise, when you can go faster for less money, most people ask why spend the money.

Kazoom

Tinman, I have been looking for info on this 70's? 4 valve sbf conversion, I heard there were advertisements in old pantera brochures/adds, I really wish I could find more info but I did find some pics of a very trick globle 32V conversion kit for the SBF, I got to wonder if this kit was the same one advertised back then.







67stang, I agree with the points you made about the pushrod engines, this is why I wanted to get into the 4 valve pushrod tech as it was also designed for pushrod engines, its been used in diesels for many years. Some the benifts over a ohc with a pushrod design is you can use/get more lift using the rocker design and a swirl effect an be induced into the cyl with the rocker adjustments. It is not about the cost as you could use the same argument about almost everything in our lifes (exotic cars, mansion homes, crazy stereos and so on) and we would still be driveing model T fords if what you said was true. Its about the 4v tech for me and thats why I got into it, at this point arao are the main guys right now unless I start to make my own version. It is no diffrent right now then when guys wanted the first cell phones that came out, you paid the cost/price and thats it. Again this is my hobby and I am interested in the TECH of the pushrod 4 valve design not the cost, there is way to much missinformation on this 4v pushrod tech on some forums and thats why its good to get more info out.

Kazoom

I am also heavy into mr Feulings 4 valve pushrod hd heads, learned alot from his stuff and have a few sets inc some of his 90's prototype race heads which share some of the same tech as the arao stuff.





Feuling also use modded versions of these heads on a 135ci VW 4v prototype engine that made over 400+hp

http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php?topic=10891.0




arao also has there version of these.

http://www.araoengineering.com/Harley/harley_eb.htm