351C/Tranny going in a 70 coupe. Have questions.
03-31-2010, 03:54 PM
#1
351C/Tranny going in a 70 coupe. Have questions.
My husband has a built 351C that he pulled out of a 71 Coupe (It is NO LONGER stock.) Long story, but we bought the car for 1500. on eBay - motor alone is worth 5-6 grand, and it surprised the hell out of us. Our drag strip engine rebuilding friend is convinced that it will put out over 425 at the crank now
We have a 70 coupe with a stock 302, and hubz is wanting to drop the 351c into it since he prefers the body style of the 69-70's.
He has the original auto FMX tranny that bolts to the 351.
A. How much of a PITA is it to find a manual transmission that will bolt up?
B. Would it be better to have the FMX rebuilt with a shift kit?
C. Will an FMX even fit under a 70?
These are dumb questions, but yeah. We just don't know the answers. What he really wants to know is what alternatives does he have on the transmission issue. Are there any ordinary Ford transmissions that can be tweaked to work with it? Or are we stuck with the FMX? Also, he does not want to buy a crate tranny. He'd rather find something that can be rebuilt as we have access to free transmission rebuilding.
We have a 70 coupe with a stock 302, and hubz is wanting to drop the 351c into it since he prefers the body style of the 69-70's.
He has the original auto FMX tranny that bolts to the 351.
A. How much of a PITA is it to find a manual transmission that will bolt up?
B. Would it be better to have the FMX rebuilt with a shift kit?
C. Will an FMX even fit under a 70?
These are dumb questions, but yeah. We just don't know the answers. What he really wants to know is what alternatives does he have on the transmission issue. Are there any ordinary Ford transmissions that can be tweaked to work with it? Or are we stuck with the FMX? Also, he does not want to buy a crate tranny. He'd rather find something that can be rebuilt as we have access to free transmission rebuilding.
03-31-2010, 04:24 PM
#2
Yukon Cornelius
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: deep in the heart of dixie GEORGIA
Posts: 11,808
umm why is the motor worth 5-6k??? wtf?
A. How much of a PITA is it to find a manual transmission that will bolt up?
not that hard you can always use a stock 4spd toploader t5 or a tremec tko etc....
B. Would it be better to have the FMX rebuilt with a shift kit?
better than stock
C. Will an FMX even fit under a 70?
yes but id toss it and build a C4 because its lighter and easier to get parts for....or use a 4r70w
A. How much of a PITA is it to find a manual transmission that will bolt up?
not that hard you can always use a stock 4spd toploader t5 or a tremec tko etc....
B. Would it be better to have the FMX rebuilt with a shift kit?
better than stock
C. Will an FMX even fit under a 70?
yes but id toss it and build a C4 because its lighter and easier to get parts for....or use a 4r70w
03-31-2010, 04:38 PM
#3
I have no idea why its worth that much. What I do know is this: The story was the man restoring it was a performance parts distributor. The story was he put the top of the line internals in it, got it set in the engine bay, lacked the carb, and kicked over of a haght attack.
It sat for a year or so, with nothing but masking tape over the intake since no carb and air filter was ever put on. It needed to be gone through, cleaned, and reassembled.
Our guy that pulled it completely apart said if we had to buy the internals and pay to have the work done that was done to this engine, it would have cost us 5-6 grand. I should have specified that included labor, yes? The first thing he said to Kel, actually, after we pulled it and let him tear into it, was: You don't have a clue what you have here, do you?
Anyway. The C4 is what I thought it would need, but I don't know anything about transmissions.
I can ask Hubz what all was done to the engine. I know its ported, polished, balanced, blahblahblah, has a big *** cam, and the rebuilder was damn impressed, and that's saying a lot if this guy was impressed.
Also, I don't know how all this works because I'm not familiar with the older engine mods, but Kel is somehow putting a 4 barrel on a 2v (he's looking at a Demon carb). My dad has splained it to me, but its been about a year, and since then, I've forgotten. I know he has a different intake, (I thought it was a Holley, but duh) an Edlebrock, b/c it sat in our dining room floor for two months until I finally picked it up and carted it out to the shop on my own. Now its on the 351 where it belongs.
I need to take pix this evening. I think its on the engine stand in the shop nao.
It sat for a year or so, with nothing but masking tape over the intake since no carb and air filter was ever put on. It needed to be gone through, cleaned, and reassembled.
Our guy that pulled it completely apart said if we had to buy the internals and pay to have the work done that was done to this engine, it would have cost us 5-6 grand. I should have specified that included labor, yes? The first thing he said to Kel, actually, after we pulled it and let him tear into it, was: You don't have a clue what you have here, do you?
Anyway. The C4 is what I thought it would need, but I don't know anything about transmissions.
I can ask Hubz what all was done to the engine. I know its ported, polished, balanced, blahblahblah, has a big *** cam, and the rebuilder was damn impressed, and that's saying a lot if this guy was impressed.
Also, I don't know how all this works because I'm not familiar with the older engine mods, but Kel is somehow putting a 4 barrel on a 2v (he's looking at a Demon carb). My dad has splained it to me, but its been about a year, and since then, I've forgotten. I know he has a different intake, (I thought it was a Holley, but duh) an Edlebrock, b/c it sat in our dining room floor for two months until I finally picked it up and carted it out to the shop on my own. Now its on the 351 where it belongs.
I need to take pix this evening. I think its on the engine stand in the shop nao.
Last edited by Batenswytch; 03-31-2010 at 04:42 PM.
03-31-2010, 05:49 PM
#4
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marquette Mi
Posts: 3,566
Pretty much any trans that will bolt to a 302 will bolt to a Cleveland, but some wont live long behind it. The FMX is ok and will work, they have a cast iron center section and are a bit heavy, but otherwise they are a healthy trans. Not a whole boatload of parts available but you can get most anything you need for it.
The FMX will fit in all Mustangs and Cougars from 67-73 without any problem, I havent stuffed one in a 64-66 yet so I will leave those out. I figure it isnt a big issue though.
The main difference is the, radiator outlet/inlet, exhaust and how tall the carb sits on the Cleveland, other than that its nearly a bolt in deal where a 302 resides 67 up.
Oh and 425 at the crank is silly easy with a Cleveland.
The FMX will fit in all Mustangs and Cougars from 67-73 without any problem, I havent stuffed one in a 64-66 yet so I will leave those out. I figure it isnt a big issue though.
The main difference is the, radiator outlet/inlet, exhaust and how tall the carb sits on the Cleveland, other than that its nearly a bolt in deal where a 302 resides 67 up.
Oh and 425 at the crank is silly easy with a Cleveland.
03-31-2010, 06:28 PM
#5
HEY THUMPIN! How's the pit of despair coming along?
351c's are nothing we're familiar with, so 425 sounds amazing to us. We're 302 people. Everything I've read on the 351 2v's that came out in the 71's is... less than enthusiastic. I believe the word anemic gets used repeatedly, so when the rebuilder started talking it up? We were impressed. I wonder how that will perform in the lighter 70?
Rmodel: I mentioned the C4 - think he's wanting a C6.
Was going to provide pix but I'll be damned if he's not even gone out to Kevin's and picked it up. *facepalm*
He said he wants to get a couple of boats moved out of the shop before he goes and gets it.
351c's are nothing we're familiar with, so 425 sounds amazing to us. We're 302 people. Everything I've read on the 351 2v's that came out in the 71's is... less than enthusiastic. I believe the word anemic gets used repeatedly, so when the rebuilder started talking it up? We were impressed. I wonder how that will perform in the lighter 70?
Rmodel: I mentioned the C4 - think he's wanting a C6.
Was going to provide pix but I'll be damned if he's not even gone out to Kevin's and picked it up. *facepalm*
He said he wants to get a couple of boats moved out of the shop before he goes and gets it.
04-01-2010, 10:17 AM
#6
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marquette Mi
Posts: 3,566
The PoD is waiting for me to finish a well rusted 65 GTO, it should get more attention this summer. It might end up with a 408ci Cleveland with 4v heads, that would make it a fun ride for sure.
Yeah a stock 2v is unimpressive but it really doesnt take much to make a Cleveland scary. Cam and intake swap with a set of headers is usually all it takes on a 2v. The 4v can often just use the cam and headers, but it doesnt hurt to swap an aluminum intake on it to lighten things. Sure the 2v heads flow less than some aftermarket W heads, but there isnt a stock W head that can hang with a 2v, and even some aftermarket heads cant hang with a 4v. For using factory parts the Cleveland is hard to beat.
The 70 isnt that much lighter than a 71, but it will still move pretty well. The C6 is bulletproof from the factory, but it also takes more power to spin and it weighs a lot more than a C4, they are also quite a bit tougher to find. Not many small block vehicles got them, most were in 351 HO/CJ Tornios and Rancheros since the Mustang/Cougar got the FMX. The FMX isnt bad, it just isnt popular.
Yeah a stock 2v is unimpressive but it really doesnt take much to make a Cleveland scary. Cam and intake swap with a set of headers is usually all it takes on a 2v. The 4v can often just use the cam and headers, but it doesnt hurt to swap an aluminum intake on it to lighten things. Sure the 2v heads flow less than some aftermarket W heads, but there isnt a stock W head that can hang with a 2v, and even some aftermarket heads cant hang with a 4v. For using factory parts the Cleveland is hard to beat.
The 70 isnt that much lighter than a 71, but it will still move pretty well. The C6 is bulletproof from the factory, but it also takes more power to spin and it weighs a lot more than a C4, they are also quite a bit tougher to find. Not many small block vehicles got them, most were in 351 HO/CJ Tornios and Rancheros since the Mustang/Cougar got the FMX. The FMX isnt bad, it just isnt popular.
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