Falcon Question
01-23-2011, 04:04 PM
#1
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Falcon Question
I've been inactive in the world of classics lately and now I'm looking for a new project to get back in with. I spotted this Falcon that caught my eye and I was looking for some opinions and info on them because I don't know much other than they were the basis for the original Mustang.
The project is a '61 Falcon with a new C4 plus radiatior and what I'm going to assume is either a 144 or 170ci I6. Now I imagine it will have the same 4 lug wheels and 7.5in rear like a sixxer Mustang. Would anyone happen to know if its 3 on the tree or a floor shifter?
I've already looked up the general basis of a V8/T5 swap and it seems relatively the same as a 65/66 Mustang as well.
Anybody with experience or more knowledge on them fill me in please, wondering if this car would be a good project if I can pick it up on the cheap, opinions for price too. I was thinking of making it into something along the same vien of the Hotrod cheap paint job car down the road, http://image.automotive.com/f/techar...front_view.jpg
The project is a '61 Falcon with a new C4 plus radiatior and what I'm going to assume is either a 144 or 170ci I6. Now I imagine it will have the same 4 lug wheels and 7.5in rear like a sixxer Mustang. Would anyone happen to know if its 3 on the tree or a floor shifter?
I've already looked up the general basis of a V8/T5 swap and it seems relatively the same as a 65/66 Mustang as well.
Anybody with experience or more knowledge on them fill me in please, wondering if this car would be a good project if I can pick it up on the cheap, opinions for price too. I was thinking of making it into something along the same vien of the Hotrod cheap paint job car down the road, http://image.automotive.com/f/techar...front_view.jpg
01-23-2011, 06:57 PM
#2
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Location: Madison, Georgia
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If it has a bench seat it's probably on the tree. Not many cars back then had the floor shifter and bench seat together. I've seen it a few times on various cars, but not many.
Looks like a cool project, I think it was JMD's son (apologies if I'm incorrect) that did a falcon recently and it looked amazing. I think they're cool cars, especially if you want a sleeper kind of look.
That hot rod paint job looks fairly good and simple too.
Looks like a cool project, I think it was JMD's son (apologies if I'm incorrect) that did a falcon recently and it looked amazing. I think they're cool cars, especially if you want a sleeper kind of look.
That hot rod paint job looks fairly good and simple too.
01-23-2011, 07:30 PM
#3
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Yeah, I finally got a hold of the seller and its on the tree. Set up to go see it on Tuesday. It'll be nice to have another project after selling my '67 a little over a year ago, something different for a change but still familiar.
01-23-2011, 07:40 PM
#4
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I dig Falcons, my son did a 64, and I have a 60 waiting in the wings.
The 6 to 8 was easy on the 64, he kept the 4 lug, and the rear will last for as long as he kind of keeps his foot out of it, so far so good though. The car rides, drives, and stops great, and in reality, the 302 with aluminum intake and heads is not going to weigh that much more than the 6 that came out.
Stock, a three speed Falcon would have had a "three on the tree".
A 61 would not have come stock with a C-4, but with a Ford-O-Matic two speed. This can be verified if there are no tranny cooler lines (or an aftermarket cooler), as the Ford-o-matic was air cooled.
I see no issues with installing a 5 speed with regard to tunnel clearance etc, and a cable clutch or hydraulic clutch ala Mustang would be easy.
I think I might have read somewhere that the first generation Falcons (60-63) might have had a slightly more narrow engine compartment than their later brethren, but I am not positive about this, and even if this is true, I don't think it would be a big issue.
My son's 64
My 60
The 6 to 8 was easy on the 64, he kept the 4 lug, and the rear will last for as long as he kind of keeps his foot out of it, so far so good though. The car rides, drives, and stops great, and in reality, the 302 with aluminum intake and heads is not going to weigh that much more than the 6 that came out.
Stock, a three speed Falcon would have had a "three on the tree".
A 61 would not have come stock with a C-4, but with a Ford-O-Matic two speed. This can be verified if there are no tranny cooler lines (or an aftermarket cooler), as the Ford-o-matic was air cooled.
I see no issues with installing a 5 speed with regard to tunnel clearance etc, and a cable clutch or hydraulic clutch ala Mustang would be easy.
I think I might have read somewhere that the first generation Falcons (60-63) might have had a slightly more narrow engine compartment than their later brethren, but I am not positive about this, and even if this is true, I don't think it would be a big issue.
My son's 64
My 60
Last edited by JMD; 01-23-2011 at 07:45 PM.
01-23-2011, 08:02 PM
#6
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Wow, that is an amazing looking Falcon, I love how the body lines can be used for some nice two tone paint schemes.
Sounds like the route I'm planning, swap the engine but keep the 4 lug and play nice until an 8in swap. When reading up about the swap I think it was the 60-62 that had the narrower engine bay, the solution people came up with was to run hedman shorty headers on the 302, the stock ones were just too wide to fit.
I guess then she must have swapped the C4 in place of the two speed. Would I be wrong to assume that they would have the same bellhousing bolt pattern and input shaft because wasn't the 144, 170 and 200 basically the same engine and the 250 the same but with just a taller deck?
Sounds like the route I'm planning, swap the engine but keep the 4 lug and play nice until an 8in swap. When reading up about the swap I think it was the 60-62 that had the narrower engine bay, the solution people came up with was to run hedman shorty headers on the 302, the stock ones were just too wide to fit.
I guess then she must have swapped the C4 in place of the two speed. Would I be wrong to assume that they would have the same bellhousing bolt pattern and input shaft because wasn't the 144, 170 and 200 basically the same engine and the 250 the same but with just a taller deck?
01-23-2011, 08:03 PM
#7
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01-23-2011, 08:09 PM
#8
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: AR
Posts: 5,469
Wow, that is an amazing looking Falcon, I love how the body lines can be used for some nice two tone paint schemes.
Sounds like the route I'm planning, swap the engine but keep the 4 lug and play nice until an 8in swap. When reading up about the swap I think it was the 60-62 that had the narrower engine bay, the solution people came up with was to run hedman shorty headers on the 302, the stock ones were just too wide to fit.
I guess then she must have swapped the C4 in place of the two speed. Would I be wrong to assume that they would have the same bellhousing bolt pattern and input shaft because wasn't the 144, 170 and 200 basically the same engine and the 250 the same but with just a taller deck?
Sounds like the route I'm planning, swap the engine but keep the 4 lug and play nice until an 8in swap. When reading up about the swap I think it was the 60-62 that had the narrower engine bay, the solution people came up with was to run hedman shorty headers on the 302, the stock ones were just too wide to fit.
I guess then she must have swapped the C4 in place of the two speed. Would I be wrong to assume that they would have the same bellhousing bolt pattern and input shaft because wasn't the 144, 170 and 200 basically the same engine and the 250 the same but with just a taller deck?
When Mitch swapped out the 2 speed he was going from 6 to 8 so he got an entire unit including the bell, flexplate, and TQ, so I am not sure about their interchangeability, but I want to thik that the bells just look different than a c-4 bell, either 6 or 8.
Mitch's plan is to go with a V-8 fox Mustang rear (4 lug) once he shatters his.
Last edited by JMD; 01-23-2011 at 08:13 PM.
01-23-2011, 08:19 PM
#9
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I imagine that the shorty headers would work fine, Mitch used regular old Hedman mid length headers on his 64, they fit with room to spare. Maybe some 351 swap headers would fit the bill also...
When Mitch swapped out the 2 speed he was going from 6 to 8 so he got an entire unit including the bell, flexplate, and TQ, so I am not sure about their interchangeability, but I want to thik that the bells just look different than a c-4 bell, either 6 or 8.
Mitch's plan is to go with a V-8 fox Mustang rear (4 lug) once he shatters his.
When Mitch swapped out the 2 speed he was going from 6 to 8 so he got an entire unit including the bell, flexplate, and TQ, so I am not sure about their interchangeability, but I want to thik that the bells just look different than a c-4 bell, either 6 or 8.
Mitch's plan is to go with a V-8 fox Mustang rear (4 lug) once he shatters his.
That's a good idea with the Fox rear, didn't occur to me, be much easier to find than the old 8in by me.
