blackfoot

hey guys. i think its my first time posting in the classic section.. but i do browes it often.

anyways i have a 1970 convertible with a 302. and im rebuiding the motor.. im pretty much ready to put the timing cover back on when, when i decided to upgrade to double rollers and upgrade the cam..

i have a standard transmission with power brakes. its a 302 bored .30, with an edleborck torqer 289 manifold. with a 450cfm 4barrel carb. stock fordheads from 1969 (yet visually when comparing to another 302 i got sitting on the floor. the combustion chamber is A LOT smaller.)

i want to get a cam that will give me a nice lumpy idle and sounds stupid angry when i blip the throtle. im not looking for a serious performance gain, since this is not a race car.. i just want the sound...

a couple of people have already rec'd me to go with the smallest cam availeble for a 351w, or go with a 280 cam. and ill get what im looking for.

but those guys have never owned a 302 and were al into SBC's... i want to get a more reputable opinion from people who own old school fords

thanks
Drew

Starfury

Honestly, you're going about it the wrong way. Choosing a cam is mostly about performance, not sound. Looking for a cam because it 'sounds cool' isn't going to help performance if the rest of the engine isn't built to match the cam. If all you want is a lope, pull a vacuum line, it'll lope plenty.

The reason a cam is lopey is because it has a lot of valve overlap. The reason a cam has a lot of valve overlap is to move the power band up the rpm range where you can potentially make more power. If you don't have the ability to spin the engine up that high, orif the rest of the drivetrain isn't designed to operate at that rpm range,you're simply wasting performance just to have a lopey idle.

First question, what are your plans for this car? Is it a daily driver, or weekend warrior? What tranny/torque converter are you using? What rear gear ratio? How wellis the engine built? Stock rod bolts, or something better (ie. ARP)?

While you're working on answering these questions, I'd strongly recommend picking up a die grinder and a couple carbide and stone grinding bits and port matching the exhaust ports on the '69 heads. I'll provide instructions on how to do this if you're interested. The three hours or so this takes is probably worth 20hp, and will make much better use of any other performance upgrades you make.

blackfoot

i know all about overlap, there will be definatly a performance gain from the cams.. but im not looking to maximize the performance. since this is just a sunday car to pick the girl friend up in and take her to the movies. the exhaust and intake have already been port matched. like im not building a race car. i jsut want something that people will turn their head and be like "wow that sounds nice" and the reason not being the muffler. its got a 2.5" magnaflowheaderback with x-pipe bolted to hooker headers already.. which it does sound good. but like i said. i just plainly want it to sound better. and the only reason i pulled the engine is because #1 started to burn coolant(i was over heating and suspected the gasket) but anywho everything is all fixed up now. and like i said im about to put the timing cover back on. i work for ford. and i got a lot of resources. its just i want a few more recomendations before i decide on a cam shaft. and im not about to pull my vaccuum line. i got power brakes..

which also means my idle cant be too retarded because i wont be able to stop with little to no vaccume

the only thing ARP on my engine are the head studs.

Starfury

You're still going about it the wrong way, especially considering you have vacuum brakes that you want to function properly. Lopey cam = crappy vacuum = no power booster. If you know all about valve overlap, you should understand this already. You should also understand that a lopey cam sacrifices low-end driveability for high-rpm power. This may or may not work with your current setup. Cams should be purchased for optimum performance, and should be matched to the rest of the engine/drivetrain components. If you go out and buy a cam with lots of valve overlap, but you're running 2.80 gears and an 800rpm stall torque converter, you're going to have some serious driveability issues.

If you answer these questions, I'll try to come up with a cam you might like that will optimize power and driveability without reducing idle vacuum too much:

"What are your plans for this car? Is it a daily driver, or weekend warrior? What tranny/torque converter are you using? What rear gear ratio?"

67mustang302

+1

And that Torker intake sure ain't gonna help matters either. You're going to end up with a car that may stumble or possibly even stall when leaving a stop, have power brakes that won't work, and mileage so bad it'll just sit in the garage all year round. Not to mention the accelerator pump on the carb will have to be set pig rich, which is just gonna wash oil off the cylinder walls and cause piston ring/cylinder wall wear that much sooner.

blackfoot

lol you guys are giving me atitude. or it seems like it anyways...

i already mentioned i had a standard transmission.. no converter. the rear end has 3.73's..


and i already mentioned again in my second post, that this car only comes out once a week. sometimes twice. and its already a pig on gas. it costs me 20$ to get me to work and back a day. lol.. due to the nature of the car. i dont care about milage.

the plus side is that i dont coast to a stop with the clutch engaged. i always decelerate on engine compression and brakes at the same time. so no serious power brakes issue when im off the throtle

i dont mind sacrificing low end driveability... from my house to anywhere is all highway. so im always cruising around 3- 3500rpm.

blackfoot

imnotmy77stang

are you wanting to stick with stock springs? pretty much anything "fun" is gonna require stepping up the springs, but then too much pressure and you start getting into screw-in stud territory. my suggestion: the 218/228 .471/.471 summit grind. its less than 100 bucks with lifters, has a great idle quality, and shreds the tires off the line. that cam is about the max you can use on stockers as long as your springs are in good shape and you dont have shims under them from a valve job, but i'd still recommend getting some *slightly* stiffer springs. hell you dont even need to buy retainers if you can score 8 more intake style oem retainers from your local machine shop (should be a freebie)

silverblue66

Hi Blackfoot and welcom to the classic section.
It sounds to me like you would like comp cams thumper series. They advertize that they offer that muscle car lopey sound without sacraficing drivability and power. They are avaiable in hyd flat tappet or hyd roller for your application. Basically they are ground for "the sound" you want. Hope this helps.
Kip

blackfoot

thanks for the input

its not about shredding tires. but the information you gave is what im looking for, thanks again...

those tires on the car have been the same set for the last 5 years.. and theres only 8k on the odometer