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1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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Old 03-30-2008, 01:00 PM   #21
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

Just turned them another 1/8 turn after soaking for 20 minutes. Still tough, but did not exceed 25 ft/lb torque. Now I'll wait 2 hours and give it a go.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:56 PM   #22
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

No way I will be screwing around with a plug change on my car after reading a few threads about this. Minewill be done at the dealer. I usually would not take a vehicle to the dealer for a plug change but I don't want to gamble with this.

Why are you guys risking changing the plugs yourself when you know of this potentially very costly or time consuming problem if the plug breaks?
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:02 PM   #23
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:16 PM   #24
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
Come on over and do mine for me, that way you can just pick up those springs
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:19 PM   #25
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: Stoenr

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ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
Come on over and do mine for me, that way you can just pick up those springs
LOL - you might wanna wait to see if I'm successful before asking that.
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Old 03-30-2008, 03:44 PM   #26
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
Maybe the dealer isn't quite as careful or patient but they do have written documentation on how to change the plugs to try to avoid breaking them. The best course of action would be to talk to the stealership you take it to and confirm what is going to happen if they break a plug.It sounds crazy to me that some dealers would make you pay. If you break it yourself then you definetly have to pay or spend a lot of time trying to fix it.
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Old 03-30-2008, 05:35 PM   #27
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
X2!....right now all I'm into this for is $60 worth of spark plugs $18 worth of antiseize, $5 worth of carb cleaner and a whole lot of aggravation. If the stealership did it and busted a couple spark plugs, you're looking at paying $400+ worth of repair costs....shoot, they may even want to pull the head! I personally don't want to crack open my engine. I'll get it out...without their stupid $289 rotunda tool and without pulling the head...and when I do I'll post pics of the culprit! Once again, this is not my daily driver. Thanks to everyone for their positive comments and support!
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Old 03-30-2008, 05:56 PM   #28
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: Hicompression

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ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
X2!....right now all I'm into this for is $60 worth of spark plugs $18 worth of antiseize, $5 worth of carb cleaner and a whole lot of aggravation. If the stealership did it and busted a couple spark plugs, you're looking at paying $400+ worth of repair costs....shoot, they may even want to pull the head! I personally don't want to crack open my engine. I'll get it out...without their stupid $289 rotunda tool and without pulling the head...and when I do I'll post pics of the culprit! Once again, this is not my daily driver. Thanks to everyone for their positive comments and support!
Here's what you need.

http://www.nextag.com/ASTRO-PNEUMATI...52/prices-html

If you can't use one to grab onto the strap, you could use the 45 degree ones to grip the inside wall of the plug and pull it out. Just stick it down in there, open it up and pull it out. How about a coat hanger with some some tape wrapped backwards around the end?
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:01 PM   #29
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Hicompression

Quote:
ORIGINAL: richmod

Because there's no way the dealer would be as patient and careful as I will, and thus they are more likely to break a plug. Since most dealers are still insisting that the customer will have to pay even if the dealer breaks it, I figure I'll play the averages and do it myself.
X2!....right now all I'm into this for is $60 worth of spark plugs $18 worth of antiseize, $5 worth of carb cleaner and a whole lot of aggravation. If the stealership did it and busted a couple spark plugs, you're looking at paying $400+ worth of repair costs....shoot, they may even want to pull the head! I personally don't want to crack open my engine. I'll get it out...without their stupid $289 rotunda tool and without pulling the head...and when I do I'll post pics of the culprit! Once again, this is not my daily driver. Thanks to everyone for their positive comments and support!
Hicompression - Man, I'm praying you can get that piece out. I just did this procedure and was freaking out until ALL plugs were out in one piece...with 110K I was really worried.
Good luck Bro!
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:51 PM   #30
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: moosestang

Here's what you need.

http://www.nextag.com/ASTRO-PNEUMATI...52/prices-html

If you can't use one to grab onto the strap, you could use the 45 degree ones to grip the inside wall of the plug and pull it out. Just stick it down in there, open it up and pull it out. How about a coat hanger with some some tape wrapped backwards around the end?
Yeah those might work if the darn ceramic insulator wasn't still broken off inside of the shield. There's really not enough room to grab the outside rim of the shield with those.
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:55 PM   #31
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Hicompression

Quote:
ORIGINAL: moosestang

Here's what you need.

http://www.nextag.com/ASTRO-PNEUMATI...52/prices-html

If you can't use one to grab onto the strap, you could use the 45 degree ones to grip the inside wall of the plug and pull it out. Just stick it down in there, open it up and pull it out. How about a coat hanger with some some tape wrapped backwards around the end?
Yeah those might work if the darn ceramic insulator wasn't still broken off inside of the shield. There's really not enough room to grab the outside rim of the shield with those.
That's what the tape and coat hanger is for. Is the ceramic attached to the metal shield? so does the ceramic fill up the whole shield? I guess I was thinking it was a small piece towards the top, but that doesn't really make any sense.
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Old 03-30-2008, 07:38 PM   #32
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: moosestang
That's what the tape and coat hanger is for. Is the ceramic attached to the metal shield? so does the ceramic fill up the whole shield? I guess I was thinking it was a small piece towards the top, but that doesn't really make any sense.
This is what I'm dealing with...this is the part broken off inside the head. I broke one of the other plugs on purpose to simulate what I have going on.


[IMG]local://upfiles/38521/9CC1A9160F4246B1AE7A59E34753B7D1.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]local://upfiles/38521/242476A199474A1DACDF6049EE0F7BAD.jpg[/IMG]
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Old 03-30-2008, 07:50 PM   #33
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

all you need is a thin piece of stiff wire. Fashion a hook on the end that will still fit through the hole in the ceramic and go fishing! Atleast it can't fall in to the cylinder from the looks of it.

thanks for the pic.

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Hicompression

Quote:
ORIGINAL: moosestang
That's what the tape and coat hanger is for. Is the ceramic attached to the metal shield? so does the ceramic fill up the whole shield? I guess I was thinking it was a small piece towards the top, but that doesn't really make any sense.
This is what I'm dealing with...this is the part broken off inside the head. I broke one of the other plugs on purpose to simulate what I have going on.


[IMG]local://upfiles/38521/9CC1A9160F4246B1AE7A59E34753B7D1.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]local://upfiles/38521/242476A199474A1DACDF6049EE0F7BAD.jpg[/IMG]
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:32 PM   #34
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

did they actually come out with a TSB for this issue?
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:57 PM   #35
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

how about this idea...take a rod the same diameter or smaller and coat it with epoxy and slide it in the hole util it bottoms out on the loop part...let it setup overnight and pull it out tomorrow...i think that would get the ceramic out
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:57 PM   #36
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

I'm thinking out loud here and it's tough to figure out without actually seeing it but - but, what if you plugged the hole so no chips can fall through the hole in the ceramic. Then, is it possible to screw a long screw into the ceramic so you can try to at least pull the ceramic out? I have no idea if you could thread something into ceramic as it would probably just break/crack but worth a thought.

Or, if you are still trying to pop the plug out of there like a cork maybe also still plug that hole so nothing can escape.

Good luck. I hope you figure it out. That's quite a challenge. I have 15k on my Mustang and I had the dealership pull the plugs already and add anti-sieze. My Champions should be here on Tuesday so I can install those. The dealer did say the plugs were a bit tight coming out but no issues. (and I'm pretty sure they just pulled them - I doubt they did it according to the TSB)

Let us know how you figure it out. I hope you don't have to pull the head. [:'(]
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Old 03-30-2008, 09:06 PM   #37
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

One question for those who have broken plugs before, was this the first time that you removed the plugs on the engine or had you swapped them out before?
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Old 03-30-2008, 09:10 PM   #38
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: alanlee112

I'm thinking out loud here and it's tough to figure out without actually seeing it but - but, what if you plugged the hole so no chips can fall through the hole in the ceramic. Then, is it possible to screw a long screw into the ceramic so you can try to at least pull the ceramic out? I have no idea if you could thread something into ceramic as it would probably just break/crack but worth a thought.

Or, if you are still trying to pop the plug out of there like a cork maybe also still plug that hole so nothing can escape.

Good luck. I hope you figure it out. That's quite a challenge. I have 15k on my Mustang and I had the dealership pull the plugs already and add anti-sieze. My Champions should be here on Tuesday so I can install those. The dealer did say the plugs were a bit tight coming out but no issues. (and I'm pretty sure they just pulled them - I doubt they did it according to the TSB)

Let us know how you figure it out. I hope you don't have to pull the head. [:'(]






It would just crack and you don't want chips down in there. You could use a welding rod with a ball of quick setting epoxy on the end of it.
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Old 03-30-2008, 10:07 PM   #39
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

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ORIGINAL: hotairgypsy

how about this idea...take a rod the same diameter or smaller and coat it with epoxy and slide it in the hole util it bottoms out on the loop part...let it setup overnight and pull it out tomorrow...i think that would get the ceramic out
[sm=goodidea.gif]That's a good idea...might have to try that...maybe it will pull the whole dang thing out.


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ORIGINAL: alanlee112
Or, if you are still trying to pop the plug out of there like a cork maybe also still plug that hole so nothing can escape.
[sm=goodidea.gif]Actually, this is a good idea and I've already tried it. Cylinder pressure was escaping out the hole when the car was running (and making quite a racket too...) so I cut the original electrode from what was left of the plug, put crazy glue on it and stuffed it back into the hole. I waited thirty minutes and the plug is now holding compression. Now...the question is, is can I grasp the electrode with a pair of needle nose pliers and pull on it as suggested above and pull the the whole thing out? To be continued tomorrow after work...
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Old 03-31-2008, 07:17 PM   #40
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Default RE: 1 Out of 8 Spark Plugs Broken After 96,000 Miles and Performing the TSB

Well...I fired up the car trying to blow the shield out today. No such luck. I even drove around the block with seven cylinders firing to see if putting the engine under load would help. Nada...the frustration factor just rose another notch.

Back to letting the shield soak in carburetor cleaner.
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Old 03-31-2008, 07:17 PM
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