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#8 plug wasn't sealing

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Old 06-14-2014, 12:37 PM   #1
moosestang
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Default #8 plug wasn't sealing

Anyone have problems with a plug not sealing? I thought I might have been down on power when I went to the track a few weeks ago, so decided to pull the plugs. #8 coil boot had that rust colored powder all over it. The plug felt tight when removing it, but it was clear that I was loosing compression past the plug.

Click the image to open in full size.

I stuck my camera down the hole to get a better look.


I just replaced these plugs less than 8 months ago. I took one of my old plugs and tightened/loosened it a couple of times and then gave it a few foot lbs more torque. Not sure how to clean the seat.
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Old 06-14-2014, 03:28 PM   #2
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I can't even find a chaser to fit this stupid thing! I was hoping there was a thread chaser that would also clean up the seat.
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Old 06-15-2014, 03:16 PM   #3
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Only reason that would happen is if water got to the threads from above or below.

How about a wire brush that size? Put some type of penetrating oil with the plug mostly in and let it seep. Brush a little bit and then call it good.

I would concerned with debris getting into the cylinder, but, I guess the worse piece that could get in there would be pieces of the metal brush. Maybe use plastic instead.

Try putting some anti sieze on it?
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Old 06-15-2014, 06:21 PM   #4
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Only reason that would happen is if water got to the threads from above or below.

How about a wire brush that size? Put some type of penetrating oil with the plug mostly in and let it seep. Brush a little bit and then call it good.

I would concerned with debris getting into the cylinder, but, I guess the worse piece that could get in there would be pieces of the metal brush. Maybe use plastic instead.

Try putting some anti sieze on it?
I thought about the anti seize. it should act as a mild abrasive.
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Old 06-15-2014, 07:15 PM   #5
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I think I'd try a bit of Scotch Brite on the end of a dowl of some kind. I'd also keep looking for some kind of tap or thread chaser to run down the threads. Ford recommends NOT using antisieze on plug threads. Good luck Buddy.
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:41 PM   #6
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http://www.homehardware.ca/en/rec/in...mdf/R-I6424997

When I did the plugs in my F150 I used a BBQ venture brush to clean the threads of the head.

I just sprayed some carb cleaner on the bristles and spun it into the threads until they were clean. A slight rinse with CRC QD into each hole and installed new plugs, no anti-seize and torqued to spec. I didn't worry about a little dusty dirt falling in the cylinder as I had used compressed air to clean the plug wells just before removing the plugs on their last thread turn out.

For safety: Test the brush before using it for sturdiness and possible bristle break down due to the chemical your using before inserting into the cylinder threads. You don't want to loose part of it into the cylinder.

Last edited by tw1234; 06-15-2014 at 11:45 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 06-16-2014, 04:38 AM   #7
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Another thing that might work is a brass bristle gun brush. Look at different caliber brushes and use one that seems about right.
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Old 06-16-2014, 12:18 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tw1234 View Post
http://www.homehardware.ca/en/rec/in...mdf/R-I6424997

When I did the plugs in my F150 I used a BBQ venture brush to clean the threads of the head.

I just sprayed some carb cleaner on the bristles and spun it into the threads until they were clean. A slight rinse with CRC QD into each hole and installed new plugs, no anti-seize and torqued to spec. I didn't worry about a little dusty dirt falling in the cylinder as I had used compressed air to clean the plug wells just before removing the plugs on their last thread turn out.

For safety: Test the brush before using it for sturdiness and possible bristle break down due to the chemical your using before inserting into the cylinder threads. You don't want to loose part of it into the cylinder.
That looks interesting. I might have to stop by lowes. I think a piece of sand or carbon off the previous plugs got jambed between the plug and seat causing it to sit a little cockeyed. No matter how much i blow out the holes, some **** always stays in there. I even turn the plugs out a few turns and blow the holes again. Living on a dirt road, there was always sand in my spark plug wells.


As soon as the motor cools off, i'm going to pull the cop and see if that blown-rust colored dust is all over the place again.
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Old 06-16-2014, 07:10 PM   #9
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plug boot looked good today, must have been a fluke. I'm assuming it's been leaking compression since the last plug change.
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Old 06-16-2014, 07:51 PM   #10
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An old trick to chase threads is to cut a vertical line in a bolt with a hacksaw in a couple of places. Not sure if you can do something similar with a spark plug itself.
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Old 06-17-2014, 12:23 PM   #11
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You can also use some compressed air to blow out the minor debris.

And I know people here say not to use anti-seize, but it seems like every other race car driver I talk to does. I used to check my plugs every other month or so. But I have become lazy and busy with family. They need replacing anyways. Maybe I'll put them on my to-do list this summer. Car runs just fine. 15-16 psi for two years doesn't seem to bother them at all.
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Old 06-17-2014, 01:26 PM   #12
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Quote:
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You can also use some compressed air to blow out the minor debris.

And I know people here say not to use anti-seize, but it seems like every other race car driver I talk to does. I used to check my plugs every other month or so. But I have become lazy and busy with family. They need replacing anyways. Maybe I'll put them on my to-do list this summer. Car runs just fine. 15-16 psi for two years doesn't seem to bother them at all.
I've heard to not use it as well.

The theory as explained to me was exactly as said above. It can act like a mild abrasive and can weaken the threads due to engine vibration and heat cycles that expand/contract the two metals at different rates acting like a sawing motion. The anti-seize being the sand paper in the mix.

That weakening could cause a plug blowout as was common on the earlier design 2v heads.

I've never heard of it actually occurring on a 3v though with anti-seize being the cause so at this point it might be called an urban legend.
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:04 PM   #13
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I've heard to not use it as well.

The theory as explained to me was exactly as said above. It can act like a mild abrasive and can weaken the threads due to engine vibration and heat cycles that expand/contract the two metals at different rates acting like a sawing motion. The anti-seize being the sand paper in the mix.

That weakening could cause a plug blowout as was common on the earlier design 2v heads.

I've never heard of it actually occurring on a 3v though with anti-seize being the cause so at this point it might be called an urban legend.
I'm pretty sure the 2v's had fewer threads than our heads.
We have at least 8 threads on the plugs. they may have had half as many!

I've used anti seize on my plugs since the first change at 12k miles. I didn't have any left this last change, but I'm sure it's still in the threads.
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:37 PM   #14
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The reason Ford recommends not to use the anti sieze is that if the plug gets stuck and you have to use a penetrant to loosen the carbon build up, the anti sieze can keep it from getting past the threads to the carbon.
If you do use something, you should reduce the torque some because it acts as a lubricant and you can get too much torque on the threads.
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Old 06-20-2014, 08:55 PM   #15
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The reason Ford recommends not to use the anti sieze is that if the plug gets stuck and you have to use a penetrant to loosen the carbon build up, the anti sieze can keep it from getting past the threads to the carbon.
If you do use something, you should reduce the torque some because it acts as a lubricant and you can get too much torque on the threads.
All true.

But I guess I have never had the problem of carbon build up since I pull the plugs regularly, run premium fuel, have always had custom tuning and use the anti-seize. They always come out like any other plug. No problems, no mess.

I would expect my cylinders to still have the hand done hash marks and the valves look brand new from the top. I've got almost 30k on the valve train.
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Old 06-27-2014, 08:40 PM   #16
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If you use any type of lubricant on plugs, you should reduce the torque because since there is less friction while tightening, you could over stress the threads. Make sense?
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Old 06-28-2014, 04:28 PM   #17
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it looks like simon might have been right about water. I was going to change all the plugs today and started with #8. The spark plug well had water in it. It looked like coolant. I think I either have a blown head gasket allowing water into the cylinder and pushed up past the threads(possible? seems unlikely) or there's a crack in the head that leads to the spark plug well and water jacket. There was no burnt spot on the plug like before. no liquid in any other cylinders.

The thing starts and idles fine, doesn't smoke! I'm planning to buy another car and pull the head off. if the head is cracked, i can't see just buying new heads, might as well do a new short block or long block.
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Old 06-28-2014, 09:11 PM   #18
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So there was no indication of any water coming from above? I'm not sure where it would come from, just a thought.
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Old 06-29-2014, 02:00 AM   #19
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So there was no indication of any water coming from above? I'm not sure where it would come from, just a thought.
No. It is either coming from right around the plug seat or from underneath. Nothing in the oil either and I couldn't see any bubbles in the coolant tank.
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Old 06-29-2014, 03:11 PM   #20
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Weird...Probably coming from a head gasket or something. I would let it go until problems get worse. It could be just fine for a long time.
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Old 06-29-2014, 03:11 PM
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