2006 GT Long Tube Header Problem
01-08-2015, 02:08 PM
#1
1st Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Illinois
Posts: 59
2006 GT Long Tube Header Problem
So I picked up the JBA Long tube headers with the JBA H pipe with high flow cats last spring and my car was running very poorly after I installed them and tuned my car.
I got the tunes from Bama with an SCT tuner. Now something interesting, when you are selecting options and indicating what aftermarket parts you have, JBA is not a listedn brand for long tube headers and neither is the High flow cats/ H pipe. So I always mark 'other' and add the description.
The first tune it ran not very good, I actually had less power then before...I got a new tune after that and it ran seemingly better...but after a month or so the computer spit out lean codes for one of the sides. I also noticed that my car had a ton of power and ran extremely well right after a flash, but then performance dropped.
I first checked out the O2 sensors and the front ones were completely black so I replaced them thinking that was the problem...a blocked O2 sensor would read lean. Then this kept happening so I begun testing other stuff, such as replacing fuel injectors. Eventually winter came and I don't drive my car in the winter anymore so I haven't had time to continue figuring out what the problem is.
Some possible symptoms...every once in awhile right after the car starts the engine idle will drop extremely low and act like its going to die but it levels out if I hit the gas pedal and rev it up. I also smell gas sometimes in the exhaust. The super weird symptom that my car always has noticeably more power and better MPGs right after a 'reflash' such as going back to stock, then going back to performance tune right away. Over the course of driving a few hundred miles it gets worse again. My theory is that it is running too rich, the tune is saying it really 'isn't', the extra gas sticks on the O2 sensors and then it blackens when the fuel gets burned due to the hot exhaust. Then the carbon covering the O2 sensor causes it to read 'lean' after some time of driving...so the computer reads that...the spark is retarded in the cylinder to 'protect' it from being too lean...causes loss of power...way too much fuel being unburnt already and now its even more...viscous cycle.
Anyway that is my crazy theory. Any thoughts?
I got to thinking about it again just to fish around for ideas on here
What are the odds that Bama would send me two bad tunes in a row, especially since the second time I explained to them the issues I was having. I haven't gotten the chance to try to get a new tune lately...I got a new computer and I hate installing the SCT Software...pain in the ***.
EDIT: Currently my car is on the stock tune until I deterime the issue. The only error codes for stock tune is Catylitic Converter Inefficiency and every once in awhile a lean code...but it usually goes away.
I got the tunes from Bama with an SCT tuner. Now something interesting, when you are selecting options and indicating what aftermarket parts you have, JBA is not a listedn brand for long tube headers and neither is the High flow cats/ H pipe. So I always mark 'other' and add the description.
The first tune it ran not very good, I actually had less power then before...I got a new tune after that and it ran seemingly better...but after a month or so the computer spit out lean codes for one of the sides. I also noticed that my car had a ton of power and ran extremely well right after a flash, but then performance dropped.
I first checked out the O2 sensors and the front ones were completely black so I replaced them thinking that was the problem...a blocked O2 sensor would read lean. Then this kept happening so I begun testing other stuff, such as replacing fuel injectors. Eventually winter came and I don't drive my car in the winter anymore so I haven't had time to continue figuring out what the problem is.
Some possible symptoms...every once in awhile right after the car starts the engine idle will drop extremely low and act like its going to die but it levels out if I hit the gas pedal and rev it up. I also smell gas sometimes in the exhaust. The super weird symptom that my car always has noticeably more power and better MPGs right after a 'reflash' such as going back to stock, then going back to performance tune right away. Over the course of driving a few hundred miles it gets worse again. My theory is that it is running too rich, the tune is saying it really 'isn't', the extra gas sticks on the O2 sensors and then it blackens when the fuel gets burned due to the hot exhaust. Then the carbon covering the O2 sensor causes it to read 'lean' after some time of driving...so the computer reads that...the spark is retarded in the cylinder to 'protect' it from being too lean...causes loss of power...way too much fuel being unburnt already and now its even more...viscous cycle.
Anyway that is my crazy theory. Any thoughts?
I got to thinking about it again just to fish around for ideas on here
What are the odds that Bama would send me two bad tunes in a row, especially since the second time I explained to them the issues I was having. I haven't gotten the chance to try to get a new tune lately...I got a new computer and I hate installing the SCT Software...pain in the ***.
EDIT: Currently my car is on the stock tune until I deterime the issue. The only error codes for stock tune is Catylitic Converter Inefficiency and every once in awhile a lean code...but it usually goes away.
Last edited by deltafool117; 01-08-2015 at 02:11 PM.
01-08-2015, 03:21 PM
#2
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: WV
Posts: 750
That sounds weird. I also have JBA's and their catted H-pipe, and an SCT tuner with Bama tunes. They sent me a tune for the headers after I requested it, loaded it up and it runs good.
I HAVE had one occasional, rare weird issue where if I'm starting from a stop, when I first go to leave and hit the gas the car bogs a bit at first, but recovers within a second or two and is fine after that. I've only had it happen four or five times and it was only this last summer (headers have been on the car for almost 2 years now). I didn't know what would cause that, I was getting the occasional CEL for the O2 sensors (which when cleared, sometimes won't come back on for more than a week) but I didn't figure an O2 error would cause that kind of issue.
I HAVE had one occasional, rare weird issue where if I'm starting from a stop, when I first go to leave and hit the gas the car bogs a bit at first, but recovers within a second or two and is fine after that. I've only had it happen four or five times and it was only this last summer (headers have been on the car for almost 2 years now). I didn't know what would cause that, I was getting the occasional CEL for the O2 sensors (which when cleared, sometimes won't come back on for more than a week) but I didn't figure an O2 error would cause that kind of issue.
01-09-2015, 09:21 AM
#4
So I picked up the JBA Long tube headers with the JBA H pipe with high flow cats last spring and my car was running very poorly after I installed them and tuned my car.
I got the tunes from Bama with an SCT tuner. Now something interesting, when you are selecting options and indicating what aftermarket parts you have, JBA is not a listedn brand for long tube headers and neither is the High flow cats/ H pipe. So I always mark 'other' and add the description.
The first tune it ran not very good, I actually had less power then before...I got a new tune after that and it ran seemingly better...but after a month or so the computer spit out lean codes for one of the sides. I also noticed that my car had a ton of power and ran extremely well right after a flash, but then performance dropped.
I first checked out the O2 sensors and the front ones were completely black so I replaced them thinking that was the problem...a blocked O2 sensor would read lean. Then this kept happening so I begun testing other stuff, such as replacing fuel injectors. Eventually winter came and I don't drive my car in the winter anymore so I haven't had time to continue figuring out what the problem is.
Some possible symptoms...every once in awhile right after the car starts the engine idle will drop extremely low and act like its going to die but it levels out if I hit the gas pedal and rev it up. I also smell gas sometimes in the exhaust. The super weird symptom that my car always has noticeably more power and better MPGs right after a 'reflash' such as going back to stock, then going back to performance tune right away. Over the course of driving a few hundred miles it gets worse again. My theory is that it is running too rich, the tune is saying it really 'isn't', the extra gas sticks on the O2 sensors and then it blackens when the fuel gets burned due to the hot exhaust. Then the carbon covering the O2 sensor causes it to read 'lean' after some time of driving...so the computer reads that...the spark is retarded in the cylinder to 'protect' it from being too lean...causes loss of power...way too much fuel being unburnt already and now its even more...viscous cycle.
Anyway that is my crazy theory. Any thoughts?
I got to thinking about it again just to fish around for ideas on here
What are the odds that Bama would send me two bad tunes in a row, especially since the second time I explained to them the issues I was having. I haven't gotten the chance to try to get a new tune lately...I got a new computer and I hate installing the SCT Software...pain in the ***.
EDIT: Currently my car is on the stock tune until I deterime the issue. The only error codes for stock tune is Catylitic Converter Inefficiency and every once in awhile a lean code...but it usually goes away.
I got the tunes from Bama with an SCT tuner. Now something interesting, when you are selecting options and indicating what aftermarket parts you have, JBA is not a listedn brand for long tube headers and neither is the High flow cats/ H pipe. So I always mark 'other' and add the description.
The first tune it ran not very good, I actually had less power then before...I got a new tune after that and it ran seemingly better...but after a month or so the computer spit out lean codes for one of the sides. I also noticed that my car had a ton of power and ran extremely well right after a flash, but then performance dropped.
I first checked out the O2 sensors and the front ones were completely black so I replaced them thinking that was the problem...a blocked O2 sensor would read lean. Then this kept happening so I begun testing other stuff, such as replacing fuel injectors. Eventually winter came and I don't drive my car in the winter anymore so I haven't had time to continue figuring out what the problem is.
Some possible symptoms...every once in awhile right after the car starts the engine idle will drop extremely low and act like its going to die but it levels out if I hit the gas pedal and rev it up. I also smell gas sometimes in the exhaust. The super weird symptom that my car always has noticeably more power and better MPGs right after a 'reflash' such as going back to stock, then going back to performance tune right away. Over the course of driving a few hundred miles it gets worse again. My theory is that it is running too rich, the tune is saying it really 'isn't', the extra gas sticks on the O2 sensors and then it blackens when the fuel gets burned due to the hot exhaust. Then the carbon covering the O2 sensor causes it to read 'lean' after some time of driving...so the computer reads that...the spark is retarded in the cylinder to 'protect' it from being too lean...causes loss of power...way too much fuel being unburnt already and now its even more...viscous cycle.
Anyway that is my crazy theory. Any thoughts?
I got to thinking about it again just to fish around for ideas on here
What are the odds that Bama would send me two bad tunes in a row, especially since the second time I explained to them the issues I was having. I haven't gotten the chance to try to get a new tune lately...I got a new computer and I hate installing the SCT Software...pain in the ***.
EDIT: Currently my car is on the stock tune until I deterime the issue. The only error codes for stock tune is Catylitic Converter Inefficiency and every once in awhile a lean code...but it usually goes away.
Alex
01-11-2015, 05:32 PM
#5
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Maui
Posts: 4,752
I HAVE had one occasional, rare weird issue where if I'm starting from a stop, when I first go to leave and hit the gas the car bogs a bit at first, but recovers within a second or two and is fine after that. I've only had it happen four or five times and it was only this last summer (headers have been on the car for almost 2 years now). I didn't know what would cause that,e.
There is a TSB about that. Its a throttle body deal or the fuel pump causing bubbling in the tank. I clean out my TB every two months and dont have this issue anymore. I have gotten it twice after a longer drive, say 40 minutes or more. Come to stoplight, light goes green I hit the gas and the car hesitates before it goes forward.
OP, its gotta be the tune or you have a hellova vacumm leak. Adding LTs while its great to get a tune its not life and death if you dont. I never got a new one after my LT install and my car ran fine. Hopefully Bama will help you sort this out. Check for vacumm leaks with some TB cleaner spray around the manifold, cai etc.. While its running spray it and if rpms change at all, you gotta leak.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars...-vacuum-leak-2
01-11-2015, 07:19 PM
#6
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Shreveport, LA
Posts: 48
Way more than it's worth when you can do it yourself with things you probably already have sitting around your shop.
Even a tiny vacuum leak can cause the vehicle to run on the fat side, but fooling the O2 sensors into thinking that there's a lean mixture coming out of the engine.
They can even do weird things like only leak under certain conditions. Anyhow, one (of a few) ways of trying to find a leak is to spray ether under the hood in very directed streams, as your engine idles.
Any vacuum line or gasket/diaphragm is fair game for testing, and dont forget the brake booster. Any leaks will show up as a change in idle quality.
Even a tiny vacuum leak can cause the vehicle to run on the fat side, but fooling the O2 sensors into thinking that there's a lean mixture coming out of the engine.
They can even do weird things like only leak under certain conditions. Anyhow, one (of a few) ways of trying to find a leak is to spray ether under the hood in very directed streams, as your engine idles.
Any vacuum line or gasket/diaphragm is fair game for testing, and dont forget the brake booster. Any leaks will show up as a change in idle quality.
01-12-2015, 10:57 AM
#7
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: WV
Posts: 750
Ghunt:
There is a TSB about that. Its a throttle body deal or the fuel pump causing bubbling in the tank. I clean out my TB every two months and dont have this issue anymore. I have gotten it twice after a longer drive, say 40 minutes or more. Come to stoplight, light goes green I hit the gas and the car hesitates before it goes forward.
There is a TSB about that. Its a throttle body deal or the fuel pump causing bubbling in the tank. I clean out my TB every two months and dont have this issue anymore. I have gotten it twice after a longer drive, say 40 minutes or more. Come to stoplight, light goes green I hit the gas and the car hesitates before it goes forward.
01-12-2015, 01:53 PM
#8
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: RI
Posts: 690
Because it takes some time for the PCM to relearn air fuel corrections after a reflash, it sounds like the OP's problem is an MAF transfer problem in the tune. Sometimes a one-size-fits-all MAF transfer function for a particular CAI/maf combo is close, but sometimes it isn't.
A MAF transfer function is basically this: the MAF outputs fom 0 - 5 volts and converts this into A/D counts. The transfer function is a table in the tune that equates a given voltage - A/D count reading to a given amount of air entering the engine. Tuning involves dialing in the correct amount of air for each of the A/D counts to achieve the desired air/fuel ratio. For example: 2.00 AD counts = 4 lbs/min air. The PCM uses those approximated amounts of air to determine how much fuel to inject. If the PCM "thinks" it is getting more air than it actually is, the engine will be rich, and vice versa. In closed loop, usually 2 min after starting, the O2's start trying to help fine tune the amounts of fuel needed to maintain that air fuel ratio.
A MAF transfer function is basically this: the MAF outputs fom 0 - 5 volts and converts this into A/D counts. The transfer function is a table in the tune that equates a given voltage - A/D count reading to a given amount of air entering the engine. Tuning involves dialing in the correct amount of air for each of the A/D counts to achieve the desired air/fuel ratio. For example: 2.00 AD counts = 4 lbs/min air. The PCM uses those approximated amounts of air to determine how much fuel to inject. If the PCM "thinks" it is getting more air than it actually is, the engine will be rich, and vice versa. In closed loop, usually 2 min after starting, the O2's start trying to help fine tune the amounts of fuel needed to maintain that air fuel ratio.
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