Mach 1 vs S197 mod for mod?

Sace · 10-04-2009, 08:48 PM

Does our motors make more power mod for mod then the 3V cars? I just posted a thread questioning what mods to do next to my mach. im currently putting down 308/321.. id like to get it up into the 320's.. so im browsing the forums looking for different mods when i start to see guys with S197's putting down 320+.. and they are not that heavily modded... i assumed that our 4v motors produced more hp per mod then the 3v motors? im sure 95% of people are going to say yes.. but i swear im seeing guys with basically the same mods as me.. only difference would be name brand of parts.. and they are putting down the same hp/tq as i am on a dynojet (same dyno i used) i know different dynos put down diff numbers and so on but from what im seeing the 3V cars makes the same hp per mod as our 4V's? i dont know if this is right or not? curious to know if this is right?

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Stone629 · 10-04-2009, 09:36 PM

Being that I've had two Machs, and now this S197, I have been wondering and trying to figure this out for awhile now. I never dynoed either Mach, so I don't know what they made at the wheels. I do have ETS for all three cars, and dyno results for my S197. First, let me repeat what my tuner guy told me. He said that the Machs don't make power like the 3v do mod for mod. He said that the S197 was so detuned from the factory that there is a lot left on the table and that the 3v heads actually flow better than the 4v. He is a professional and everything, but I still wonder about that one.
So far, I have done UD pulleys, CL CAI, Mac Mufflers, 4.10s, sts, and a custom dyno tune that resulted in 308rwhp/317rwtq on my S197. The car has done a best of 13.3 and 105 with a max trap speed of 106 on a 2.0 60'. This was done on a humid 95 degree day. In cooler air, I feel like I can squeeze a high 12 out of it at 108 or so, but I haven't yet, so.

Now the Machs. My automatic Mach ran 13.3 at 105 also, but with nothing more than a drop in KN filter and a catted X-pipe. Pretty impressive, imo.

My manual Mach had 4.10s, orx, kn filter, MGW, and flows. It ran a best of 13 flat, but did it at 109.9 mph. The manual Mach had serious, serious traction issues. I could get a 2.0 out of it, but it started spinning on every shift and I'm pretty sure it was slipping some while reving. From what I can tell, the Machs are faster mod for mod. The traps are a good indicator of HP, and my experience has been that while the 3v and 4v run similar ETs mod for mod, the Mach always traps higher.

Sace · 10-04-2009, 10:40 PM

thanks for that stone.. nice to hear from someone whos had both cars. my mach has basically what ur 5speed has with the addition of longtubes and a tune. id be very happy if i ran even wat u ran. yeah i always look at trap speed as it tends to show the cars potential instead of a drivers. 109.9 is a crazy good trap! if i got that high id be mad excited.. as for ur dyno numbers. i think that can almost settle it.. i have more power making mods id think n dynod roughly the same. did ur 5 speed mach feel faster then your 2009?

Stone629 · 10-04-2009, 11:14 PM

It felt much faster. It could be a difference in refinement making the S197 feel slower, but either way the Mach definitely felt much quicker. I couldn't get traction to save my life in the Mach in 1st or 2nd gear, but it did have 17 inch wheels and not as good of a suspension as the S197 (GT has 18s). I would love to try some lighter 17s on the S197 and see how it feels.

jvinson · 10-04-2009, 11:24 PM

where in nc are you

grif62 · 10-04-2009, 11:56 PM

i have been thinking about that too. I see the numbers of the 3v and Im kinda impressed by them. I always thought the 4v were supposed to be better. I know my sig says 13.5 at 106 but I went to the track not to long ago and I got the time slip. I got a 13.1 at 107.1, yes this is an auto and orlando speed world's track isnt the greatest track (needs to be prepped). I sck with computers I dont know how to change sig pic because my friend made this sig for me.

Stone629 · 10-04-2009, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jvinson

where in nc are you

Raleigh, on the Garner side.

SVTeeshirt · 10-05-2009, 12:18 AM

while thats a good question don't forgot the mach weighs less, therefore will move quicker with less power.

Stone629 · 10-05-2009, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SVTeeshirt

while thats a good question don't forgot the mach weighs less, therefore will move quicker with less power.

True. I think the S197 is about 150lbs heavier. Lots of curb weights floating around the internet, makes it hard to know which ones to go by.

mrtstang · 10-05-2009, 12:35 AM

While i have never owned either vehicle, i can tell from 2 of my friends, that mod for mod the Mach is faster.

My one buddy has a full bolt on 2006 gt with 4.10's that puts down 302 rwhp. My other buddy has a 2004 Mach 1 with full bolt ons and 4.10's that puts down 305 rwhp. Both are 5-speeds as well.

Basically, even though it can be a drivers race between these 2, the Mach will always start pulling my buddy's 06 around the 100 mph mark...always without fail!