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Mach 1 Section This section is for discussions relating to the reincarnation of the Mach 1 trimline.

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Old 08-12-2014, 10:59 AM   #1
roller252
 
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Angry Procharger problems!!

Hello to all. I am a new member posting for the first time.

I have an 03 Mach1 that I purchased a complete 3 core intercooled high output 2 system. Unfortunately, I have had nothing but difficulties trying to get the tune resolved from Procharger tech. All I get from the tech manager Jason is that it is my problem, and that I need to get an ugraded MAF and custom tune. He was then backed up by the Director of Service and Sales Carey. They offered me a "Generous" $150 to buy back my Diablosport I-1000 tuner and then I could go get my own Tuner and custom tune.

Well here is what happens to my car, as well as many others here on the net including corvettes (sister owns one), and Camaros. The car runs extremely smooth and pulls like a freight train right up to about 4500rpm where the car will fall on it's face(cough), and then start to re-accelerate and do the same fall on it's face until I let off the accelerator.

I was told by a knowledgeable guy locally that said it sounds as though maybe the knock sensors are being activated falsely(I think that is what he means).

Any help I can get would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 08-12-2014, 12:07 PM   #2
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Im not a pro charger expert, nor do I know much about them at all. But I am sure that your answers are going to be " take it to a dyno and get a custom tune " or at the very least, take it someplace that has a computer that can give real time sensor data.

I suspect the same as your local guy that the computer is getting false knock readings from the sensors. I don't think ford used a very good location for them on that car. You may be able to have them turned off, but it would make tuning a lot harder as far as timing goes. I believe there is a relocation procedure where you move them to the top of the head. Basically they pick up on the extra noise of your SC and perceive this noise as engine knock and the computer pulls timing out.

A friend of mine has a 99 with a kenne bell and was required to relocate the sensors to the top of the head as apposed to having them turned off in a tune.
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Old 08-12-2014, 02:12 PM   #3
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Default Thanks for the Information..

I appreciate you taking the time to respond. The re-location info was new for me, so I will be looking into that as well.

I forgot to mention, I have had it on a Dynamax Dyno with all of the operating A/F ratios at idle 13% and dropping to a low of 10.5% at 5500 rpm. So if anything, it is a little rich. On the dyno with a smooth run-up in 4th gear the car ran perfectly. We did not accelerate like you would on the street or track. Should have, but it acts just like a non-electronic ignition car when the timing was not right. So My thinking is, maybe it can be a timing issue due to the knock sensors being set off incorrectly?

The stock Mach put 420 hp to the wheels, so power output is as advertised on a conservative 10psi tune.
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Old 08-13-2014, 12:29 PM   #4
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Default Update

Made changes to posiiton (clocked) the MAF, made little difference. SO I made changes conservatively, added fuel first above 4000 rpm by 5% and it helped reduce the cough somewhat so I tried 10% and made no difference. So I went back to 5%, and made spark advance changes, first by adding advance above 4000 by 5 degrees, and it made it worse. So I tried the opposite and retarded advance above 4000 rpm by 7 degrees and That was what she needed.

The car runs well. I am sure that it can now be tweeked a little to make it better, but that will be for another day on the dyno.

Thanks for the positioning info. That could still be done to help matters.
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Old 08-14-2014, 10:36 AM   #5
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First rule of running a forced induction application. NEVER USE A CAN TUNE. Take it to a tuner and have it professionaly tuned. A pre made tune cannot account for differences from motor to motor, climates, etc etc etc etc. Supercharged applications need to be tuned by a tuner. Period. Messing around with clocking the MAF can severly change your AFR readings, u need to take it to a tuner or your gonna blow it up.
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Old 08-14-2014, 07:20 PM   #6
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Agreed, it needs a custom tune. ProChargers are great blowers!
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Old 08-15-2014, 10:05 AM   #7
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Default Must have missed it.

You must not have read that I had the car on the dyno checking the tune and numbers. The A/F is usually not the thing that will cause a car to cough when boost starts ramping up. That is usually a Timing issue. I asked Procharger repeatedly about the timing with NO response even addressing the timing. I am not a newb to cars or tuning, or racing. I know I will need a custom tune to maximize the potential of the system.

The tech manager told me hundreds of these kits have been sold for Mach's and cobra's without EVER having heard this problem. I have seen multiple posts on not only Mustang forums, but LS and corvette forums describing the exact same issue (falling on it;s face above 4500 rpm). Apparently, it is a widespread problem that Procharger never addressed.

IO was told by Procharger tech manager to (clock) the MAF as that can be critical. Everything I have read on the net says that clocking is only necessary from a POORLY designed tube routing system. Too many bends with no straight flow.

I will not advertise that my car has a Procharger in it. It is just a non descript supercharger.

If you just want a kit without real helpful support, go ahead and buy one. You will see what I mean if you have any issues they can't answer.
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Old 08-15-2014, 10:05 AM
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