Twin Turbo or Supercharger
07-04-2005, 12:28 AM
#51
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: United States
Posts: 3,451
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
Scjar. Don't worry about them. If you want some help on it. I would be more than happy. I guess according to these people, curious people are stupid.
Do you have any messengers? (aim, msn, icq, yahoo)
Do you have any messengers? (aim, msn, icq, yahoo)
07-04-2005, 01:22 PM
#53
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 52
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
one more question on this...
^ by someone on the prev page.
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
also, just to throw some more price into the thread... i just put a vortec on my car, i went from 255HP to 370HP, at around 9 psi...
now with the SC kit, i also needed to get larger fuel injectors (30 pounds) a larger mass airflow sensor, and a larger fuel pump because the little fuel pump booster thing i got with the kit wasnt able to pump enough because the pump in the tank couldnt pump enough... so all of that wound up costing an extra 1500 (tune included, dont know howmuch it was with just the parts.)
and about how much work it takes to put it on, i put the SC on with my dad over the weekend, took about 12 hours. It probably would have gone quicker, but i bought the ithing used from a 97 car (only had 4000 miles on the SC), and it has a little different model and is placed in a different spot (i have a 98 car), so i didnt have the right size hoses for some things and had to search a little for the right stuff, but we got it working...
just some more info to throw in there
You don't need forged internals with either setup. You could run 12psi safely with both. Both are reliable if you keep your oil changed & do the proper startup/shutdown. You'll get quite a bit more power out of the twin turbo at the same reliability & psi.
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
also, just to throw some more price into the thread... i just put a vortec on my car, i went from 255HP to 370HP, at around 9 psi...
now with the SC kit, i also needed to get larger fuel injectors (30 pounds) a larger mass airflow sensor, and a larger fuel pump because the little fuel pump booster thing i got with the kit wasnt able to pump enough because the pump in the tank couldnt pump enough... so all of that wound up costing an extra 1500 (tune included, dont know howmuch it was with just the parts.)
and about how much work it takes to put it on, i put the SC on with my dad over the weekend, took about 12 hours. It probably would have gone quicker, but i bought the ithing used from a 97 car (only had 4000 miles on the SC), and it has a little different model and is placed in a different spot (i have a 98 car), so i didnt have the right size hoses for some things and had to search a little for the right stuff, but we got it working...
just some more info to throw in there
07-04-2005, 02:01 PM
#54
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: United States
Posts: 3,451
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
ORIGINAL: cp51
one more question on this...
^ by someone on the prev page.
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
also, just to throw some more price into the thread... i just put a vortec on my car, i went from 255HP to 370HP, at around 9 psi...
now with the SC kit, i also needed to get larger fuel injectors (30 pounds) a larger mass airflow sensor, and a larger fuel pump because the little fuel pump booster thing i got with the kit wasnt able to pump enough because the pump in the tank couldnt pump enough... so all of that wound up costing an extra 1500 (tune included, dont know howmuch it was with just the parts.)
and about how much work it takes to put it on, i put the SC on with my dad over the weekend, took about 12 hours. It probably would have gone quicker, but i bought the ithing used from a 97 car (only had 4000 miles on the SC), and it has a little different model and is placed in a different spot (i have a 98 car), so i didnt have the right size hoses for some things and had to search a little for the right stuff, but we got it working...
just some more info to throw in there
one more question on this...
You don't need forged internals with either setup. You could run 12psi safely with both. Both are reliable if you keep your oil changed & do the proper startup/shutdown. You'll get quite a bit more power out of the twin turbo at the same reliability & psi.
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
also, just to throw some more price into the thread... i just put a vortec on my car, i went from 255HP to 370HP, at around 9 psi...
now with the SC kit, i also needed to get larger fuel injectors (30 pounds) a larger mass airflow sensor, and a larger fuel pump because the little fuel pump booster thing i got with the kit wasnt able to pump enough because the pump in the tank couldnt pump enough... so all of that wound up costing an extra 1500 (tune included, dont know howmuch it was with just the parts.)
and about how much work it takes to put it on, i put the SC on with my dad over the weekend, took about 12 hours. It probably would have gone quicker, but i bought the ithing used from a 97 car (only had 4000 miles on the SC), and it has a little different model and is placed in a different spot (i have a 98 car), so i didnt have the right size hoses for some things and had to search a little for the right stuff, but we got it working...
just some more info to throw in there
07-04-2005, 08:08 PM
#55
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location:
Posts: 158
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
I hope I didn't give anybody the impression that I was whining. I was just speakin my mind. Im new to the sport, and have a list of questions a mile long. Everything is worth asking in my opinion.
07-09-2005, 12:00 AM
#57
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
ORIGINAL: Birdieman4
If you are going to forge the bottom end of your motor, go TT's. If you plan on leaving your bottom end stock, go with a blower. ...It's just that simple.
If you are going to forge the bottom end of your motor, go TT's. If you plan on leaving your bottom end stock, go with a blower. ...It's just that simple.
07-09-2005, 02:15 AM
#58
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: bay area
Posts: 1,370
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
ORIGINAL: Birdieman4
The bottom line to that argument is that the, say, 25 hp loss IS NOT SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH to justify doing the TT setup over the blower set up, unless you are going to forge the bottom end. Anyone who spent a lot more $ in installation and tuning with a tt setup to gain 25 hp (keeping the internals stock) is an idiot. It's not practical; it's not logical. Nanaki is dead on. NO ONE can argue this point, because there isn't a practical or logical argument here. I have been beating a dead horse on this subject for months on this forum. Some people don't get it.
What you aren't understanding is for the supercharger it takes power to make power. If you go dyno what the car is putting down to the wheels & the # comes out to 400hp think of how much the supercharger is taking to run. You could be at 450hp & thats without thinking of the drivetrain & accessory loss, but because of the power taken away to run the systems you don't know the actual power the engine is seeing, you know what it is after all of your accessories, supercharger, & drivetrain have taken some of the power away. With the turbo what loss you have because of it will show up at wheels.
Basically what I'm saying is if you have both a supercharger & turbocharged engine of the same specs lets say they are both putting out 500hp not including belt & drivetrain losses. After you factor in the drivetrain loss & accessories (not including the supercharger) lets say they are both down at 450hp. Now factor in the power losses to drive the systems. The turbocharger takes very little power to produce boost, while the supercharger takes quite a bit. So the turbo engine would be at 430hp & the supercharged engine would be at 400hp. So as you can see in both engines, THE ENGINES are seeing 500hp, but the dyno shows 430hp (turbo) & 400hp (super)
Basically what I'm saying is if you have both a supercharger & turbocharged engine of the same specs lets say they are both putting out 500hp not including belt & drivetrain losses. After you factor in the drivetrain loss & accessories (not including the supercharger) lets say they are both down at 450hp. Now factor in the power losses to drive the systems. The turbocharger takes very little power to produce boost, while the supercharger takes quite a bit. So the turbo engine would be at 430hp & the supercharged engine would be at 400hp. So as you can see in both engines, THE ENGINES are seeing 500hp, but the dyno shows 430hp (turbo) & 400hp (super)
.. I think the best answer in a boost a pump.. but I cant get anyone to tell me the part number or where to get it.. even ATI tell me to talk to the dealer.. and hes been trying to call them.. help
07-09-2005, 02:50 AM
#59
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location:
Posts: 3,020
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
Birdieman4 = you got to stop wasting time over here and get back on the 05 side.. I need you to find the solution to my fuel issues with the prochager .. I think the best answer in a boost a pump.. but I cant get anyone to tell me the part number or where to get it.. even ATI tell me to talk to the dealer.. and hes been trying to call them.. help
07-10-2005, 09:47 PM
#60
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: United States
Posts: 3,451
RE: Twin Turbo or Supercharger
ORIGINAL: cp51
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
now what is the difference between 8 psi from a turbo and 8 psi from an SC? both are 8 psi going into the intake...
ORIGINAL: Macman
If you didn't forge and went sc, would you be getting the same power as the forged tt combo? Not quite the same leauge. I believe either sc or tt can make the same power depending on how much time and money you have. It just depands on your application.
If you didn't forge and went sc, would you be getting the same power as the forged tt combo? Not quite the same leauge. I believe either sc or tt can make the same power depending on how much time and money you have. It just depands on your application.
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