Whiteline Mustang products
09-19-2009, 09:14 AM
#1
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 329
Whiteline Mustang products
http://www.whiteline.com.au/docs/bul...TANG%20GPS.pdf
I am considering getting their anti dive kit for my mustang. Whiteline makes a lot of parts for the Subaru WRX. I used to have a WRX and used the same anti dive kit on that car and it did a great job of reducing brake dive and increased steering wheel centering and on center steering feel. They are kind of pricey, but the brake dive on my car has increased a lot since adding the BBK. Any thoughts?
I am considering getting their anti dive kit for my mustang. Whiteline makes a lot of parts for the Subaru WRX. I used to have a WRX and used the same anti dive kit on that car and it did a great job of reducing brake dive and increased steering wheel centering and on center steering feel. They are kind of pricey, but the brake dive on my car has increased a lot since adding the BBK. Any thoughts?
09-19-2009, 11:24 AM
#2
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: CA
Posts: 1,291
So, the car is stopping quicker and causing the front to dive?
If you're sure it's the control arms- then that seems like a nice product. But, that 'anti-dive' kit is just a set of urethane bushings. Energy suspension bushings are probably cheaper.
The other thing you may consider is increasing the front spring rates. I don't know what the Roush rates are, so they may be too soft.
If you're sure it's the control arms- then that seems like a nice product. But, that 'anti-dive' kit is just a set of urethane bushings. Energy suspension bushings are probably cheaper.
The other thing you may consider is increasing the front spring rates. I don't know what the Roush rates are, so they may be too soft.
09-19-2009, 02:39 PM
#3
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 1,700
Sir Isaac Newton pretty much says the front end is going to dive more with bigger brakes.
Having said that, the factory hydrabushings are fluid filled, and do flex. A cheaper and more easily installed option is the Steeda rear bushing inserts. If you get sick of the added NVH they create they are easy to pop back off. The whiteline pieces are nice, albeit overpriced due to being a new roduct and fitting in a niche market. I might use them on a race car, but not on the street.
Having said that, the factory hydrabushings are fluid filled, and do flex. A cheaper and more easily installed option is the Steeda rear bushing inserts. If you get sick of the added NVH they create they are easy to pop back off. The whiteline pieces are nice, albeit overpriced due to being a new roduct and fitting in a niche market. I might use them on a race car, but not on the street.
09-19-2009, 03:15 PM
#4
2nd Gear Member
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 329
When I used them on my WRX they didn't increase NVH much. But I am not sure how exactly they are going to improve anti dive other than the harder bushing. They only have .5 degree adjustment of caster and that is not going to increase anti-dive much. Only thing i can think is that maybe they raise the location of the rear mount to increase caster when the wheel travels up. Although it seems that this would have an effect on bumpsteer and make the car handle wierd.
09-21-2009, 03:25 AM
#5
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NSW
Posts: 1
G’day everyone,
Hope you don’t mind us popping in but someone told us there was a tech question re the anti-dive kit and suggested we might be able to help.
The KCA305 ADK is designed to perform 2 separate functions but both related to front handling performance outcomes. The most unconventional is the anti-dive or anti-lift kit (really the same thing) that works to remove the stock anti-geometry that the engineers built in for a more benign and less responsive front end.
It’s a function of weight distribution and throttle steer and by changing the location of the control arm pickup point via a revised mount bracket we allow the front suspension to respond more directly to changes in driver throttle input. This leads to less understeer and more direct steering response under braking and acceleration and makes it more responsive overall. The use of a low compliance engineered poly bush helps to reduce the difference between dynamic and static alignment behaviour which in plain English means trying to make sure that the changes we build in don’t get moved around when things get serious on the track or street.
Which leads to the next part as dynamic behaviour is particularly important for caster loss.... or lack of. You see, it’s not so much the absolute positive caster you get that matters as how much you’ve got left when you need it. The benefits of higher positive caster are pretty obvious now but the value starts to evaporate as you brake coming into the corner.... just when you need that extra caster for better turn-in and corner bite. Hence why the +1.0 degree extra caster built in to the kit when on the wheel aligner actually delivers close to an extra +2.0 on the road as the bush and revised mount hold it closer to the designed amount.
Well all that is well and good and low compliance means less comfort. Yes and no and that’s where we work really hard to try to minimise the difference. In fact, we think we’re pretty good at by now as we’ve been doing this sort of part for over 10 years now and we like to think that the compromises aren’t too bad.
Anyway, hope that helps explain some of the stranger stuff about this part and what it actually does. Very happy to answer any more question about this but in the meantime you might like to have a look at the this thread on www.racedotcom.com to read a little more about “anti” geometry in general and how it can be used to help performance handling http://www.racedotcom.com/showthread.php?t=27437
Cheers
Whiteline Jim
jim@whiteline.com.au
Hope you don’t mind us popping in but someone told us there was a tech question re the anti-dive kit and suggested we might be able to help.
The KCA305 ADK is designed to perform 2 separate functions but both related to front handling performance outcomes. The most unconventional is the anti-dive or anti-lift kit (really the same thing) that works to remove the stock anti-geometry that the engineers built in for a more benign and less responsive front end.
It’s a function of weight distribution and throttle steer and by changing the location of the control arm pickup point via a revised mount bracket we allow the front suspension to respond more directly to changes in driver throttle input. This leads to less understeer and more direct steering response under braking and acceleration and makes it more responsive overall. The use of a low compliance engineered poly bush helps to reduce the difference between dynamic and static alignment behaviour which in plain English means trying to make sure that the changes we build in don’t get moved around when things get serious on the track or street.
Which leads to the next part as dynamic behaviour is particularly important for caster loss.... or lack of. You see, it’s not so much the absolute positive caster you get that matters as how much you’ve got left when you need it. The benefits of higher positive caster are pretty obvious now but the value starts to evaporate as you brake coming into the corner.... just when you need that extra caster for better turn-in and corner bite. Hence why the +1.0 degree extra caster built in to the kit when on the wheel aligner actually delivers close to an extra +2.0 on the road as the bush and revised mount hold it closer to the designed amount.
Well all that is well and good and low compliance means less comfort. Yes and no and that’s where we work really hard to try to minimise the difference. In fact, we think we’re pretty good at by now as we’ve been doing this sort of part for over 10 years now and we like to think that the compromises aren’t too bad.
Anyway, hope that helps explain some of the stranger stuff about this part and what it actually does. Very happy to answer any more question about this but in the meantime you might like to have a look at the this thread on www.racedotcom.com to read a little more about “anti” geometry in general and how it can be used to help performance handling http://www.racedotcom.com/showthread.php?t=27437
Cheers
Whiteline Jim
jim@whiteline.com.au
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