parchisi

I went and competed at the Lone Pine Time Trial this weekend (a great event btw, high speed autocross and was hitting 100 mph on the straights) and ran into some TC issues.

I noticed that twice at the end of a run the traction control light would come on and stay on (with TC and advance track turned off of course). Also, when this happened, its like TC turned itself back on. Trying to come out of a hairpin in 2nd gear, it was cutting throttle like crazy and trying to immediately brake again the abs was unnecessarily cutting in and I almost went right through a wall of cones.

So to be clear, when this happened there were two lights illuminated. The regular light that comes on when you disable TC and AT, and the TC light. I think I remember reading something about this somewhere else but can't recall much about it. Needless to say it was a little annoying...any ideas?

Norm Peterson

Any chance you were into the ABS at any point?


Norm

Derf00

Forgive my ignorance, but the Advance Trac is the special Brembo package tune that turns off ALL nannies except for ABS?

parchisi

Yeah, very good chance of that. Near the end there was a section where I would max brake from a 100 mph straightaway into a slolom.

And Advance Trac is the stability control system which controlls skidding and sideways movement, as opposed to Traction Control which prevents wheel spin when you put foot to floor. There's three modes. AT and TC on (default when you turn car on), AT only (when you push TC button), and all electronic nannies off exc. ABS (while stopped, holding brake, push and hold TC button aprox. 8 seconds)

Derf00

hrm, so it's the special ESC tune then?

Yeah, I'm gonna have to bow out of this thread except for to learn about the problem/solution, carry on!

Norm Peterson

Fred, I don't know much about the electronic tech on the '11 either. But I've got this vague memory of reading where some car could switch one or more of the nannies back on following certain situations or driver actions. Figure it's a place to start and a direction to head off in . . .


Norm

parchisi

If that's the case, then this could be more than a little frustrating. I'm not sure if a tune can change the ESC parameters or not. I'm not one of those guys who turns it off for everyday driving out of some misguided machismo that I'm too good to make mistakes, but when I do turn it off, its for a reason and I want it to stay off.

Sleeper_08

I'm glad my 08 only has plain and simple Traction Control that can be tirned off with one button push

Unless I forget

Ansibe

I haven't seen this on my '11 5.0 Brembo yet. Even in winter when ABS comes on all the time with advancetrac off, I ever saw the stab control turn itself back on. All forces are much lower in winter conditions though. Maybe with advancetrac off; high G load; and ABS firing the computer (Big Brother) decides you are about to crash and tries to save you by turning advancetrac back on??

Anyway, I have not seen this in a very similar car which is used on the track. Maybe I should try harder!

Norm Peterson

As far as I know, it is specifically SCCA Solo-legal to electrically/electronically disable both ABS and traction control in Street Touring, and ABS, TC, and ESC in Street Prepared, but modifying the parameters and/or operation other than completely disabling the systems is not (it could become a competitive advantage not generally available). I think that means you can add your own switches between the appropriate sensors and the control unit or reprogram the unit to disregard those inputs entirely.


I disagree that it's "misguided" to think beyond the likelihood of "driver error" even in reasonably normal driving. If you'd ever had ESC intervene during driving that was admittedly hard but still well within the limits of tire grip you might feel a bit differently about ESC default = ON. A wall of cones does not represent anywhere near the threat that 70 mph Interstate traffic would if the electronics wouldn't let you dip into the power from the apex of a tight (usually decreasing-radius) cloverleaf for a clean merge.


Norm