Upgrading an S281SC - Page 3

06Saleen3V · 10-27-2009, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IWinULose

I have the GT500 fuel system, and 60lb injectors on the list. Mind you, the car is bone stock, I just have a very fast closet. So, with all those mods, the car can't be tuned safely?

EDIT: By the way, I DO have 39lb injectors now, but wanted to go to 60s when I started installing everything.

Ok, that makes more sense now. I would go with a 3.4" pulley, the GT500 pumps, 60# injectors, and the cams. Ask the tuner to run a very conservative tune. YOU WILL NEED A DYNO TUNE.

you should see close to 500-510rwhp at around 8psi

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IWinULose · 10-27-2009, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 06Saleen3V

Ok, that makes more sense now. I would go with a 3.4" pulley, the GT500 pumps, 60# injectors, and the cams. Ask the tuner to run a very conservative tune. YOU WILL NEED A DYNO TUNE.

you should see close to 500-510rwhp at around 8psi

Unlike most of you, I am lightyears away from any kind of reputable shop. My goal was to install everything this winter then take the car to PAS as soon as the weather breaks and have it tuned. It's 300 miles away, so I can't run down there every week. I would just forge the bottom end and be done with it, but I run into the shop problem again. I have very limited options on getting anything done where I reside.

06Saleen3V · 10-27-2009, 01:00 PM

I would not run all that stuff without a dynotune...just a warning

IWinULose · 10-27-2009, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 06Saleen3V

I would not run all that stuff without a dynotune...just a warning

No, i wouldn't install a midpipe on an SC car without a tune. I am a better safe than sorry kind of person. Since I don't have as much experience as most of you, I am asking the questions. The car will get the dyno tune at Performance Auto Sport before I drive it.

06Saleen3V · 10-27-2009, 01:25 PM

you can run an o/r midpipe without a tune..a CEL might turn on, but if you have a handheld tuner, you can turn it off

06Saleen E · 10-27-2009, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 06Saleen3V

This is incorrect. Anytime you modify the car to bring in more fuel or more air, you need a retune, especially at the power level he is at. While it may be true that you need to adjust the voltage, you also need to adjust the tune.

Mickey,

It is actually correct, but let clarify and be more specific. What I meant to say was if you are replacing ONLY the TB, meaning swaping the Factory GT with the Shelby GT 500 (going from twinn 57 to twin 65mm) you do not need a retune. Since the amount of air flow restriction our friend is going to see is very minimal with the upgrades that he's planning on doing. When I added the bolts on to my E car I didn't change the TB at the begining (had factory TB twin 57mm on). With the bolts on that I put on I went ahead and tuned the car to get it perfect, then about two months later I added the GT 500 TB and followed exactly what this guys did http://www.bbkperformance.com/popup/...-video-152.wmv . Didn't have to retune the car and was putting 500whp to the tires. If you go to this link it actually tells you that you don't need a retune, but it is very important that you adjust the TPS. http://www.bbkperformance.com/produc...ttle-body.html. When you are running less than 500hp to the tires you don't see too much restriction on the Factory Mustang GT TB, once you go over that range you should consider upgrading to the likes of a GT500 TB. On a similar approach Justin at VMP tunning has done some R/D and discovered that the GT500 do not have too much restriction up to when you reach about 550 rwhp. Once you go beyond that you should consider upscaling your TB.

This is just a matter of velocities and friction head lossess within the air conduits. The amount of air passing through @ 550rwhp or less is ok for a GT 500 TB. Per BBK's and my own personal experience and some other guys that I've worked with we never needed to retuned the car when going from a Factory Mustang Gt to a Ford Racing TB (62mm) or Shelby GT 500 TB (65mm). As I said TB ONLY. Now if you go whipple TB or other large TB like the twin 75mm that KB has I'd say tunning may need to be done.

As far as the mods he's doing he must retune the car, because there are other parameters added to the equation. But my point was if he's only swaping the TB and nothing else, no tunning requried IF he's swaping from factory to GT500 or twin 65mm TB.

06Saleen3V · 10-27-2009, 02:19 PM

I never said it is not important to adjust the TPS, I stated that you need to retune on top of that. It is always better to retune the car when modifying things that change airflow and fuel, Angel. Just because it does not say you need a tune, doesnt mean that is the case. Think about this, a company sells a throttle body that costs over $400 with very little gain. If they then stated you needed a retune as well, you are out $900 for a part with very little gain. Do you think they would sell anything? No, they wouldnt. That's fine though, it's your choice. Safety is a primary concern for me when modding my car, it is up to you whether or not you decide to retune.

If we believed everything we read from vendors and companies online, a lot more of our cars would be blown up. I get my information from hours upon hours of online reading from people with personal experience, not from descriptions of manufacturers.

06Saleen E · 10-27-2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 06Saleen3V

I never said it is not important to adjust the TPS, I stated that you need to retune on top of that. It is always better to retune the car when modifying things that change airflow and fuel, Angel. Just because it does not say you need a tune, doesnt mean that is the case. Think about this, a company sells a throttle body that costs over $400 with very little gain. If they then stated you needed a retune as well, you are out $900 for a part with very little gain. Do you think they would sell anything? No, they wouldnt. That's fine though, it's your choice. Safety is a primary concern for me when modding my car, it is up to you whether or not you decide to retune.

If we believed everything we read from vendors and companies online, a lot more of our cars would be blown up. I get my information from hours upon hours of online reading from people with personal experience, not from descriptions of manufacturers.

As I said before I agree that with the a/f adjustments you need to tune, there is no way around it. I am going with over 20yr doing this thing. For me experience helps to determine how things are done and still considering safety. I wanted to show as an example the link because it is easy and helps folks understand how to adjust (calibrate) TB. That's why I clarified with the TB only and from Mustang Gt to Shelby GT 500 at around 500whp it is not a safety issue nor a concern form me or the people that I've worked with. Because we do it on a consistent basis. See that I only specified TB between 57 to 65mm.

IWinULose · 11-07-2009, 08:58 PM

Ok, I have a few more questions that you all may be able to answer for me.

Once I install everything, will my car be able to start and run efficiently enough to load into the trailer?

What gap should I put on the HT0s?

I am awaiting a call from Mark at PAS to get his suggestions on the 3.2 or 3.4 pulley, and the tensioner.

Hopefully going to get the rest of my parts ordered this week or next, and begin the installation of everything in early December. I am pretty excited about it.

06Saleen3V · 11-11-2009, 11:15 AM

3.2" pulley with your mods and cams = blown motor