Mr. D

To the Noble Defenders of the Roush Pedigree, let me make it clear, I am not referring to some used, junker Mustang a kid puts decals on in his father's garage.... and hopes it will stay together until your check clears! Come on...... I am talking about "a Mustang modification done by an authorized Roush Dealer" under Roush specs with a "Roush/Ford warrantee" backed by both Roush and Ford! It's Roush quality! HELLO! Roush wants it that way or they wouldn't have Roush Dealers making warranted Ford/Roush builds! Duh! If it comes down to two Mustangs that are exactly the same but mine was done at the Roush factory with a serial number plate and yours was done by a lowly Roush authorized dealer.... then Nanny Nanny Boo Boo because mine is better! Come on! How sad is that state of affairs, and that is where we are for the purpose of defending Roush factory serial numbered cars.... that need no defending!

They are all Ford Mustangs simply with added Roush parts, period! There are no Roush automobiles to call a Roush! Look at your vehicle registration and auto insurance card! The word Roush does not appear! Their value stands on the mods done not a "Blue Blooded serial number" sold with the modifications! Some cars built at Roush Authorized dealers that were far, far superior.... although of course some would undervalue them solely based on their lack of a serial number plate. It's the mods Dude, not the serial number!

Many Ford dealers take new GT's and send them to authorized Roush Dealers and then sell them to customers as a Roush modified car with full Ford warrantees. Interesting huh? One of the main reasons I had a new GT built by a Roush Dealer is that the serial numbered cars on the local dealers where models with body mods and very little performance mods at a high price. Of course, I completely agree "BUYER BEWARE AND UNDERSTAND THE VALUE OF MODS AND IF THEY WERE ADDED UNDER ROUSH SUPERVISION WITH DOCUMENTATION IS CRITICAL OR YOU WILL GET CHEATED BY CROOKS!"

Many may not know that a Roush Authorized Dealer must install mods exactly like the Roush factory, or risk losing Roush authorization and Ford warrantees. Example: The dealer I use will not alter anything from Roush specs. in the installation risking their contract with Roush and the Ford warrantee. Doesn't that tell you something? The key issue related to value and warrantees is paperwork showing that a Roush Authorized Dealer did the mods under a Roush agreement.

As far as Shelby of Las Vegas, I guess they lied to my face and the Mustangs I saw being modified with superchargers, suspensions, etc. in Las Vegas where some kind of trick done with mirrors! Go visit them and watch them work! Common sense would tell anyone that Shelby of Las Vegas would not ship them to the factory at a great cost when the build can be done right there and a number plate added. (Of course the serial number plate is necessary so that a Roush Mustang sold at a dealer is standardized as to Roush advertising in print and online! A Mustang without a serial number is not the advertised package, from Roush and is a separate build not advertised for obvious marketing reasons.)

The bottom line is a Roush is simply a Ford Mustang with Roush performance or styling parts added. There is no such thing as a Roush automobile! You, and others with serial numbered cars simply don't get to dictate which Mustangs are "up to your standards and you will allow them to be called a Roush, while others don't make it!", simply based on the geographic location the same exact parts were added, and a little number plate based on creating Roush profits. It just is inaccurate as related to quality and value! Many non serial numbered Roush authorized Dealer Mustangs are equipped far better than some of the serial numbered cars sold at a Ford Dealership. If the serial number plate is the big deal, and obviously more important than the actual equipment on the car we might as well just start clubs based serial number plates, and forget the quality of the Mustangs! If a owner has to rely on the serial number plate for added value, something is wrong in with his car! The value should be based on the (1.) condition of the car and (2.) the Roush mods added and documented either by the factory or an authorized Roush dealer, not a 50 cent plate on the car! If Roush and Ford combine to warrantee an authorized Roush Dealer Build it can be called a Roush Mustang! Common sense says that Ford would not honor their new car warrantees on these Roush Authorized Dealer Builds if they were not a considered a Roush Mustang! I had a bearing go out in my Mustang and the Ford Dealer replaced the transmission because it was covered by Ford as a Roush Build just like a Factory Build. The Ford Dealer took a few days to verify the build as a Roush build! that's good enough for me! Owners of Roush Factory serial numbered cars don't get to dictate which cars can be referred to as a Roush Mustangs! The value of the car is based on the build done by either the Roush Factory or an Authorized Roush/Ford warrantee supplying dealer!

I wish the Factory serial number snobbery would end and you guys could see that a Roush Authorized Dealer build with Ford/Roush warrantee should be also considered a Roush!

Good luck with that one! Right? LOL! I know, "Nanny Nanny Boo Boo, I've got a serial number so my car's a real Roush.... and yours isn't!" Does it do 0 to 60 in 4.6 seconds like mine, or just have body mods a serial number?

I've wasted my typing with most here, but maybe a few wanting to get a Mustang will be helped by some clear information! In some cases, you can get a hell of a lot more car from a Roush Authorized Dealer Build than the Ford Dealer if you want more choice in the Roush Mods added, and don't notice any performance added by the serial number plate! Like it or not, it's the truth!

Lighten up O' Noble Defenders of the Roush Pedigree! No one's against Factory Roush Mustangs! They're great! I'm just trying to get you to stop "dictating" which Roush/Ford warranted builds can be called a Roush! If they are warranted by Ford and Roush they should be called a Roush! Roush doesn't have a problem with it, so why are we measuring our decks?


Here's an example of a Roush Package on a Ford lot with no real Roush performance just appearance mods while another Mustang build by a Roush Dealer with real performance mods does not qualify for the Roush name? I guess it's the serial number! I'd rather have no serial number and Roush performance for the less money, but that's just me!

ROUSH® Stage 1 Mustang. Packaging all American styling and a full range of signature ROUSH-only options, the Stage 1 is sure to turn heads.

Exterior identifiers for the Stage 1, or RS1 for short, include a ROUSH front windshield banner, Stage 1 upper grille badge, ROUSH "R" fender badges, Stage 1 decklid badge, rear faux gas cap "R" badge and finishes off with a Jack Roush signature graphic on the rear decklid.

The main contents of the Stage 1

This changes the front look of the car with the ROUSH designed upper grille, high-flow lower opening (grille eliminator), corner fascia aero pockets with driving lamps and front chin splitter. At the rear of the car sits the ROUSH three-piece rear decklid spoiler giving the car a sleek look without obstructing the view out the rear window. Moving towards the back are the ROUSH rocker panel and rear fascia side splitters to give the car an aggressive, low stance. Rounding out the tail end is the new ROUSH rear aero valance featuring race-inspired diffusers made to seamlessly fit the ROUSH’s dual chambered, chrome exhaust tips.

Interior styling touches on the Stage 1 include ROUSH embroidered floor mats, ROUSH center console button, Stage 1 dash medallion, Jack Roush signature graphic on the dash and under the hood is a serialized Stage 1 plaque Whoopee!

PNYXPRESS

OK
Authorized ROUSH dealer doesnt mean shat. It just means that dealer is authorized to sell NEW Roush vehicles, just like a svt dealer or a saleen dealer or even a srt dealer.

You cannot walk into just any dealership and buy one, you can however, take your car to the a nonroush ford dealer and they will install the roushcharger w/warranty. because FORD installed it.

Mr. D

I guess I wasn't clear!

I'm not talking about Ford Dealers! I'm talking about Authorized Roush Shops that can do builds using all the available Roush mods and creating a Mustang with a Ford/Roush warrantee. They don't sell automobiles at all! Both the Roush Factory and Roush Authorized Dealers start with a Ford Mustang and add Roush created parts! You just choose to say when the Roush Factory does it you have a Roush, but when an authorized Roush Shop does it you don't have a Roush! In both cases, if it is simply legally and logically undeniable that you have a Ford Mustang with added Roush parts! It is silly to call one a Roush and not the other since legally their is no such thing as a Roush manufactured automobile! Why would a bunch of different Roush aftermarket body works parts bolted on to a Ford product be any different than a bunch of Roush mechanical high performance parts? A Roush does not exist as a different automobile. They are simply Ford Mustangs with after market parts! You just value the bolted on body parts calling it a Roush, while I value the high performance parts calling it also a Roush!

How is a Roush supercharger and the CAI, etc. mods that go with it, plus a Roush suspension and exhaust system etc., etc. make a Mustang less a Roush than the all the Factory add on superficial stuff listed below? What's the good of a Roush with no added performance! The Roush builds of an Authorized Roush Shop at least perform like Jack Roush's original Mustangs! The mods below I agree are fine for looks if you like them, but they hardly make a car more a Roush than $15 to $20K of performance modifications!

ROUSH designed upper grille, high-flow lower opening (grille eliminator), corner fascia aero pockets with driving lamps and front chin splitter. At the rear of the car sits the ROUSH three-piece rear decklid spoiler giving the car a sleek look without obstructing the view out the rear window. Moving towards the back are the ROUSH rocker panel and rear fascia side splitters to give the car an aggressive, low stance. Rounding out the tail end is the new ROUSH rear aero valance featuring race-inspired diffusers made to seamlessly fit the ROUSH’s dual chambered, chrome exhaust tips. But.... its got a serial number plate which is the important thing for a real Roush high performance Mustang! Come on! That's snobbery!

Here's the engine of an "Edelbrock '56 Chevy".... although it just is called Chevy by DMV! LOL!



If you get past the sales pitches, they are all just production cars with added after market parts, so we shouldn't look down our noses at those without a simple serial number plate. It's just marketing! Maybe the value should be based on the car attributes and mods, not the serial number plate! I think I'll just get a plate off a wrecked Roush and put it on my car and watch its value double! Just kidding, that's what we do agree on! That's dishonest, but good luck in court unless the seller tells the buyer it was a serial numbered car when it isn't!

Note: My car is never because called a Roush because it isn't even a Roush clone! It's just what I like and had built! It stands on it's own based on the way it runs! People can call it anything they want as it screams by at a timed 4.6 Sec. (0 to 60) at half the cost of a Roush or Shelby!

You have a nice looking car, although I'm more old school as you see! Wanta race for pink slips unless.... you've got something hiding I don't know about? LOL! Just kidding! We disagree, but have fun with your Mustang! That's all that counts! I've been around too long building cars to be impressed with names! Show me what its got and how it runs. The only thing I'd add to my car is a 5.0L Coyote for extra power and since it has 10K miles on it, that won't happen! The extra power isn't worth the cost of a new car and all the supercharger mods! Besides, I like the '08 styling better than the new ones... which I like too!

Be happy! Life's too short for anything else!

Mr. D

LilRoush

Seriously, you need to stop with all of this ranting. It's been explained to you over and over what you have. I don't even bother reading all of the posts anymore. It's the same old broken record.

A 99+ Roush has a serial number. End of story.
You don't have one.
You have a Mustnag GT with Roush parts installed by a Roush dealer to ensure the warrenty.
Why can't you understand that?

Your example of an "Edlebrock" Chevy is so far off base that it's not even funny.

Also, no new cars go from a Ford dealer to Roush then back to a dealer as a Roush. That's not how it works. Get your facts straight.

Your SC'd car is less than a Roush because you have one part of a fully developed package.... oh and no serial number.

In post #71, I love that you just used a Roush Stage 1 as an example of a dealer build and call it nothing special. Guess what... it's a REAL ROUSH and your's isn't! That is the car people buy when they want a Roush and make it there own with vairous other parts. My 2000 #5004 was a Stage 1 (V6). It was 2 cylinders less than your almighty 4.6L supercharged V8 car and would mop the track with it without breaking a sweat.

Yes, I'm getting an attitude now. Why? Because you are clearly ranting about your short comings in a car and feel the need to throw it all in our faces. You're a squeaky wheel in need of attention. Every time you post, you make certain to show you don't listen when people are trying to educate you about high end Mustangs and you continue to present invalid reasoning behind your points.

Why are you not happy with what you have? Why try to bash serialized cars just because you don't have one? I promise you everyone here would offer you a hand shake and a pat on the back if you just understood your car is GT with a Roush blower, and it's of less market value than an authentic serialized Roush. Your **** poor attitude is killing how nice your car is.

LilRoush

I'm quoting this for special EPIC FAILURE OF FACTS.

Guess what, mine is insured as a ROUSH. In fact, both of mine were insured that way. Stop making up 'facts' to defend you point of view.
When my 2000 was stolen and stripped, it was covered as a ROUSH. When I got a check for it, it wasn't for a V6 2000 Mustang, it was for the value of damage done to a (wait for it.....) ROUSH. Why you ask? Because the wheels (even used) were of more market value than a similar year V6 Mustang. Why? Because the name means something. If it didn't, you would be so stuck on the fact that you have that name under your hood as well.

Just for fun, my SVT is the same way. I mean it's just a Ford, and there's nothing really special to call it an SVT, right? Oh wait, that serial number / build number means something. I keep forgetting that. (sarcasm)

Mr. D

Come on! You know better than this! Of course the model of a Mustang is included in the insurance description, or they would know what they have to replace. What I said, as you know, is there is no Roush Car manufactured. So are you telling me your insurance says Roush, BUT not Ford Mustang? State and Federal governments do not recognize Roush Automobile Manufacturer! Look it up! You are driving a Ford Mustang with Roush equipment! You just don't recognize them as a Roush if the equipment was added by an authorized dealer because you think it lowers the value of your Mustangs! It doesn't! If fact some Factory Roush cars might hurt values because of lack of performance!

My point in the whole discussion, is that owners like you have taken it on themselves to decide what is a Roush, and what is not a Roush! The variance between what the Roush Factory turns out as a modified Roush Mustang is a wide set of mods. I simply think it is petty and silly for guys with a serial numbered cars to say that is all that can be called a Roush, when some Roush Authorized Shop are doing builds far more in to the reputation of performance the Jack Roush Mustangs of old were know for! Many factory Roushs are all about being pretty and have forgotten Jack Roush Performace!

I have no criticism for factory Roush modified Mustangs because they are great cars and of more value! My problem is the "Roush Serial Number Club" feels the needs to say to a guy that buys a new GT 5.0L he picked up from a Roush Authorized Dealer with $15 to $20K of Roush mods and a warrantee based on contract between Ford and Roush to create these builds cannot ever be called a Roush! How insecure and petty!

How would you guys like it if I said, "I don't care if your Mustang has a cool serial number plate, but if it doesn't have sufficient Roush high performance parts it is not a Roush! It is a Stock Ford Mustang with bolted on Roush appearance parts! It's like in the 50's when we said, "If it doesn't go, chrome it!...... or bolt on some Roush body appearance parts!"

The difference is I don't think anyone should be telling any "Mustang Owner with a Ford/Roush warrantee in his hand" that is his 575 HP GT with $20,000 in Roush performance mods ...... is not a Roush and yours is just because it came from the factory with a new grill and some pretty bolt on appearance mods! [U] Ford and Roush warranted that build under contract and both Ford and Roush will stand behind that build! AND THAT MEANS IT IS A ROUSH MUSTANG FOR WARRANTEE PURPOSES BECAUSE THAT IS HOW IT IS TREATED! (Unless they are ignorant as many are!)
If the build you have was done by an Authorized Roush Shop and warranted by both Ford and Roush, it's a Roush Mustang built at a Roush authorized dealer that will be warranted by both Ford and Roush! I know because my car is such a Roush build and it was backed by Ford and Roush. Repairs of any Roush parts was back billed to Roush and parts on the original GT were billed to Ford!

It's just too bad some guys with Roush Mustangs are so insecure as to have to do the kids club thing of "My Mustang is a Roush Mustang.... and yours isn't! Of course with Mustangs with basically Roush decals I get it. With very nice, expensive Roush Authorized warranted shop builds it makes us all sound like we are little kids trying to keep some people out of a club! Quality of a Roush should be the issue.... not where the build was done!

Anyhow, no one is going to change their mind so let's agree to disagree!

Mr. D

Come on! You know better than this! Of course the model of a Mustang is included in the insurance description, or they would know what they have to replace. What I said, as you know, is there is no Roush Car manufactured. So are you telling me your insurance says Roush, BUT not Ford Mustang? State and Federal governments do not recognize Roush Automobile Manufacturer! Look it up! You are driving a Ford Mustang with Roush equipment! You just don't recognize them as a Roush if the equipment was added by an authorized dealer because you think it lowers the value of your Mustangs! It doesn't! If fact some Factory Roush cars might hurt values because of lack of performance!

My point in the whole discussion, is that owners like you have taken it on themselves to decide what is a Roush, and what is not a Roush! The variance between what the Roush Factory turns out as a modified Roush Mustang is a wide set of mods. I simply think it is petty and silly for guys with a serial numbered cars to say that is all that can be called a Roush, when some Roush Authorized Shop are doing builds far more in to the reputation of performance the Jack Roush Mustangs of old were know for! Many factory Roushs are all about being pretty and have forgotten Jack Roush Performace!



The difference is I don't think anyone should be telling any "Mustang Owner with a Ford/Roush warrantee in his hand" that is his 575 HP GT with $20,000 in Roush performance mods ...... is not a Roush and yours is just because it came from the factory with a new grill and some pretty bolt on appearance mods! [U] Ford and Roush warranted that build under contract and both Ford and Roush will stand behind that build! AND THAT MEANS IT IS A ROUSH MUSTANG FOR WARRANTEE PURPOSES BECAUSE THAT IS HOW IT IS TREATED!
(Unless they are ignorant as many are!)

Here's the real test!! If the build you have was done by an Authorized Roush Shop and warranted by both Ford and Roush, it's a Roush Mustang built at a Roush authorized dealer that will be warranted by both Ford and Roush! I know because my car is such a Roush build and it was backed by Ford and Roush. Repairs of any Roush parts was back billed to Roush and parts on the original GT were billed to Ford!

It's just too bad some guys with Roush Mustangs are so insecure as to have to do the kids club thing of "My Mustang is a Roush Mustang.... and yours isn't! Of course with Mustangs with basically Roush decals I get it. With very nice, expensive Roush Authorized warranted shop builds it makes us all sound like we are little kids trying to keep some people out of a club! Quality of a Roush should be the issue.... not where the build was done!

Anyhow, no one is going to change their mind so let's agree to disagree!

Cruzinaround

This is spot on for all practical reasons.

If you add that the Roush OE parts installed by Roush and purchased through Roush have Serialized ID that also identify what was OE Roush installed or what was Aftermarket upgrade then you can still argue...either way its covered under a warranty backed by Roush.

OP..... if your seller can supply all the invoicing for the labor and the Roush parts.... you'll still have coverage for all the modifications.

Not a loss, but perhaps if you can get past where it was assembled and then finally modified.... you'll see you came out ahead.

---

LilRoush

False. Like most of your posts this is not correct. ROUSH decided to make their cars, not the owners.

I could pick apart almost every line in your post and point out why it's wrong. You flip flop faster than I can keep track of. First your car is just like a real Roush. Then real Roushs aren't worth anything. Now actual Roush cars hurt other actual Roush cars because they lack performance. Come on.

You are the only one insecure about your car here. All you've done is start to get into personal attacks against me. Who's really the one acting like a child?

As stated form the beginning of your ranting: You have a GT with Roush parts. You have no serial number, ergo it's not a Roush. Why is this such a hard concept for you to grasp?

It's just this simple:
Roush serial number = Real Roush.
No Roush serial number with Roush parts added on after the fact = Mustanng with Roush parts.

If Roush didn't want them seperated out that way, they would not put a serial number on it nor keep track of how many they make.

Mr. D

Wow! Sorry if my opinions upset you! You choose to misunderstand most everything I say and you misrepresent the points I'm making to defend your position! Defending your car is not necessary! Christianity isn't under attack either!

See if you can get the points if I try to state them clearly:

1. As I have said many, many times my Mustang is not like your Factory Roush! It is also, not a clone of a Roush Factory serial numbered car,... nor would I want it to be! Get it! Many of us don't want a Factory Roush package with an emphasis on body and trim modifications! We want a Authorized Shop Roush with all the "performance modifications and warrantee" that retains the stock Ford Mustang Body. Roush fills that product with the Authorized Roush Shop! (NOT a Ford Dealer!)

2. Roush does not make a car..... period! It simply customizes Ford manufactured Mustangs! According to the Federal Government, Roush is not a car manufacturer, nor does it claim to be. Roush serial numbers denote a Mustang modified (not manufactured) by Roush! The fact that Roush issues serial numbers to cars modified in packages in the Roush Factory is marketing likely to protect the secondary buyer from clones by lesser quality by crooks! Therefore "Buyer beware" if you want to buy a Roush Factory package and check the serial number for sure.

3. Ford Mustangs are also modified by Authorized Roush Shops under Roush specs. and with a Roush/Ford warrantee. Ford will honor these Roush builds in every way, then back charging Roush for costs related to Roush modifications such as a failure of the supercharger.

Again, Roush "customizes" already manufactured automobiles. It does not manufacture a Roush automobile! A Roush is not a type of car, but a Ford Mustang customized by the Roush Company. Federal and State law does not consider Roush and automobile manufacturer.

SO, DOES THIS MEAN THE ONLY TYPE OF "ROUSH CUSTOMIZATION" IS THE ONE FROM THE ROUSH FACTORY WITH A SERIAL NUMBER? I SAY, "NO!"

I maintain that if both Ford and Roush honor these sometimes very extensive builds done by a "Roush Authorized Shop" with a Ford/Roush warrantee than they are a Roush Mustang simply of a different type than a Roush from a serial numbered factory build. The owners of these Roush/Ford warranted Mustangs quality builds should not be criticized if they refer to their car as a Roush. Of course they should not claim they are a factory Roush serial numbered Mustang especially for resale purpose as they are not!

I suggest you would feel quite different if you had bought a brand new Mustang GT and an Authorized Roush Shop had done $15,000 to $20,000. of Roush modifications with a Ford/Roush warrantee and he was told he could not call his car a Roush! The negative approach of calling such builds "Just a Mustang with some Roush parts on it"..... could also be applied to a Factory Roush Mustang since Roush does not manufacture a car! It simply modifies an already manufactured car. They just do a much better job than a lot of other customizers you can find on cable TV shows and at SEMA!

(It's just this simple: If Ford and Roush accept the warrantees of these Authorized Roush Shop builds as they do, then they are a Roush! The warrantee is the proof of that fact! You don't get that kind of warrantee if you simply put some Roush parts and decals on you car in your own garage!)

The terms "Factory Built Roush" with serial number" and "Authorized Shop Built Roush with documentation" would be far more accurate, honest and respectful to Mustang owners! No one with half a brain will mix up the two terms if they do just a little research.

We should concentrate on respecting each others cars and choices rather than creating a hierarchy of Roush Mustangs based on resale values or where they were built! If you don't understand this post... I give up and see you at the Cruise Night! Life's Too Short!

I'm throwing down my microphone and turning off the theatre lights!