I should've known better - part two
10-03-2015, 11:44 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: california
Posts: 36
I should've known better - part two
Apparently the initial thread was locked for some reason.
https://mustangforums.com/forum/5-0l...wn-better.html
But for those of you who have a constructive interest in developments from Ford on my 2015 GT - it's still in the shop. I haven't heard from the dealership since Thursday morning but they said I should expect the car back Monday night.
For those of you who decided I am a "troll," I promise to post pdf copies of the dealership's service order paperwork when I get the car back. I apologize if my frustration translated into trolling, but I'm just irritated that my brand new car is sitting in the shop with inexplicable problems and parts on back order. That's all.
https://mustangforums.com/forum/5-0l...wn-better.html
But for those of you who have a constructive interest in developments from Ford on my 2015 GT - it's still in the shop. I haven't heard from the dealership since Thursday morning but they said I should expect the car back Monday night.
For those of you who decided I am a "troll," I promise to post pdf copies of the dealership's service order paperwork when I get the car back. I apologize if my frustration translated into trolling, but I'm just irritated that my brand new car is sitting in the shop with inexplicable problems and parts on back order. That's all.
10-04-2015, 06:08 PM
#2
S197 Section Modder-ator
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando FL
Posts: 13,373
It's obvious that your car is trouble according to your words...
And it could be a POS sure, but it's your Mustang, not ALL Mustangs.
And like a shrewd member mentioned in your first locked thread... Porsche and Lotus being reliable??
I wouldn't touch those brands with a 10 foot pole!
Check Webster for the word "reliable", you might learn something.
Also, German engineering is simply schit and it's been like that for a while now, used to be spot on (relatively) but not anymore and that's a fact.
Lotus, lol. More like the pinnacle of unreliability matted with the Prince of Darkness, his name is Lucas...
You're on a Mustang Forum and you expect the members to embrace you bashing of domestic cars because yours is problematic??
Last time I checked, Ford ranked way better than any European product when it comes to go from point A to point B. lol
And it could be a POS sure, but it's your Mustang, not ALL Mustangs.
And like a shrewd member mentioned in your first locked thread... Porsche and Lotus being reliable??
I wouldn't touch those brands with a 10 foot pole!
Check Webster for the word "reliable", you might learn something.
Also, German engineering is simply schit and it's been like that for a while now, used to be spot on (relatively) but not anymore and that's a fact.
Lotus, lol. More like the pinnacle of unreliability matted with the Prince of Darkness, his name is Lucas...
You're on a Mustang Forum and you expect the members to embrace you bashing of domestic cars because yours is problematic??
Last time I checked, Ford ranked way better than any European product when it comes to go from point A to point B. lol
10-04-2015, 06:20 PM
#3
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: california
Posts: 36
Your points are well taken. However, most of my Porsches are/were older (pre 1990). I really shouldn't have mentioned the other cars I've owned - it's irrelevant because as you said it's a Mustang forum. I am just astonished at the situation because I've only had the car for a month and at this point 25% of the time it's been in the shop. I'll let you guys know what they say, and I apologize for inadvertently fanning irrelevant flames.
Last edited by ChampInSD; 10-26-2015 at 12:42 PM.
10-05-2015, 05:17 PM
#4
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Alabama
Posts: 6
I hope not
I assume you didn't mean it that way, but I certainly hope others are NOT having the same experience. I'm looking to buy a Mustang, and I want to know they are reliable cars.
My only experience with German cars was a 1999 VW Passat GLS-V6, manual. I liked everything about the car except the reliability and ridiculous cost of maintenance. It never last me stranded, but had way to many semi-major problems. And it didn't help that the local VW dealership service department was incompetent. I've had great experience with the Hondas I've owned. I currently drive a 2010 Civic. But I'll probably never buy German again. I'm looking at Mustangs because I want a car with some personality and I NEED more power. Even so, I'm not really even considering a GT. I drove a 2016 V6, Ecoboost (both automatics), and a manual GT last Saturday. The smaller motors had ample power for my needs. The GT was a beast, but overkill on the power for me.
Anyway, I hope you get your issues worked out soon. Otherwise, do check out lemon laws. At some point they owe you the reliable, new car you paid for, even if they have to give you another brand new one.
My only experience with German cars was a 1999 VW Passat GLS-V6, manual. I liked everything about the car except the reliability and ridiculous cost of maintenance. It never last me stranded, but had way to many semi-major problems. And it didn't help that the local VW dealership service department was incompetent. I've had great experience with the Hondas I've owned. I currently drive a 2010 Civic. But I'll probably never buy German again. I'm looking at Mustangs because I want a car with some personality and I NEED more power. Even so, I'm not really even considering a GT. I drove a 2016 V6, Ecoboost (both automatics), and a manual GT last Saturday. The smaller motors had ample power for my needs. The GT was a beast, but overkill on the power for me.
Anyway, I hope you get your issues worked out soon. Otherwise, do check out lemon laws. At some point they owe you the reliable, new car you paid for, even if they have to give you another brand new one.
10-06-2015, 04:59 PM
#5
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 150
Given the number of these things they are pumping out it isn't surprising a turd is going to occasionally slip through. I'd tell the dealer they have 1 week to either have the car fixed and working, replaced with another car or returned your money. Adjust the grace period as you wish. I'd probably find a new dealer regardless of the outcome.
As for what you should expect: my GT has ~6 miles on the clock when I drove it off the lot. The next day it was on the race track doing hot laps to break in the motor. It's had the Ford Handling pack installed along with some other suspension goodies installed. I usually do a session or two a month on track with the car (I mostly race motorcycles). I've also taken the car to Arkansas to bash around the back roads up there.
The biggest issue I've had: the !#%@!#^#$ rear tires are just about done for and I've not yet made it to 5K miles on the clock.
That is what you should expect for your car. I drive it like a drunk horny teenager with something to prove and the car just keeps delivering. So should yours.
Now go tell the service manager to get your #!^#@!^ car fixed.
BTW - I disagree w/ the immediate assessment that the previous thread was trolling. Had I experienced something similar I'd be pretty frustrated too and looking for help and support. Cars aren't cheap and when they don't work right people have a right to be pissed.
As for what you should expect: my GT has ~6 miles on the clock when I drove it off the lot. The next day it was on the race track doing hot laps to break in the motor. It's had the Ford Handling pack installed along with some other suspension goodies installed. I usually do a session or two a month on track with the car (I mostly race motorcycles). I've also taken the car to Arkansas to bash around the back roads up there.
The biggest issue I've had: the !#%@!#^#$ rear tires are just about done for and I've not yet made it to 5K miles on the clock.
That is what you should expect for your car. I drive it like a drunk horny teenager with something to prove and the car just keeps delivering. So should yours.
Now go tell the service manager to get your #!^#@!^ car fixed.
BTW - I disagree w/ the immediate assessment that the previous thread was trolling. Had I experienced something similar I'd be pretty frustrated too and looking for help and support. Cars aren't cheap and when they don't work right people have a right to be pissed.
10-06-2015, 07:32 PM
#6
S197 Section Modder-ator
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando FL
Posts: 13,373
Your points are well taken. However, most of my Porsches are/were older (pre 1990). I really shouldn't have mentioned the other cars I've owned - it's irrelevant because as you said it's a Mustang forum. I am just astonished at the situation because I've only had the car for a month and at this point 25% of the time it's been in the shop. I'll let you guys know what they say, and I apologize for inadvertently fanning irrelevant flames. Hopefully others aren't having the same experience as I am. I bought the car because I really like it. I'm a long time autocrosser and I am looking forward to an opportunity to run this thing through the cones. But now I'm paranoid I've got a lemon on my hands and that obviously takes all the joy out of having a new car to play with.
Well, lots of us have other Brand cars that we also like and happy with but your thread title is giving away your pre conceived idea of domestic cars being junk and to your defense, it used to be that way but they improved greatly the last 10 years or so.
Detroit put out some real junk cars in the 80s and 90s... from the Chrysler K cars (30K miles only deal) to the Ford Tempos/Festivas to the GM Celebrity/Cavalier/Corsica, Pontiac Sunfire and so on. Cadillac with its 4100 engine line was also a joke.
Funny you mentioned pre 1990 Porsches... I owned a 1980 911SC back in the days and while it never left me stranded I had issues with it (ignition mostly) and it kinda pissed me of at the time since the Brand had a flawless reputation.
I check with other owners (bunch of annoying snobs, lol) and found out that my car wasn't exclusive in having gremlins.
It was still a blast to drive it around corners though.
Don't hang on to your Mustang if it turns out to be a lemon and make sure the dealer isn't part of the problem also, it happens more often than one think.
I run a local body shop and I had a customer that spent over $2000 with brake problems at the dealer on his 02 Camry...they replaced master cylinder/booster, proportioning valve, lines lol
I took the car to my local brake expert and the culprit was a froze up rear caliper which is common on that car and the dealer knew it, they just took him for a ride by replacing everything but the needed part. After that ordeal, he eventually sued and won.
So just beware of dealers too...
10-09-2015, 12:17 AM
#7
10-09-2015, 09:23 AM
#8
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 150
How do you expect to get any help or support with the tone of the first thread????? Just because your frustrated doesn't mean you can spray venom on a public forum strictly for Mustang owners! Singing the praise of foreign cars and saying you should have know better than buy a Mustang in your opinion wasn't stupid????
As a great man said "Why make an enemy when you can make an ally?"
People on forums are too quick to attack other people. It gets boring and really doesn't create anything useful.
10-09-2015, 09:39 AM
#9
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 960
Any time there is a new generation of product released, there will be problems. Bugs that need to get worked out, and can only be found out over the longer term. Testing/proving grounds can only do so much. I would agree that there is one problem causing the entire thing to unravel. How hard it is to find it depends on who is looking at it at the dealership. I am sure they are doing everything they can. That is, afterall, in their best interest to do. Finding these types of problems is NEVER an easy process. Takes a substantial amount of trial and error. There is no way to specifically test a control module outside of a controlled environment like an electronics lab. All any shop can do is check for input/output signals. If input is there, but no output, logic has it that the module in question is the problem. And as mentioned, all they can do is order a new one, install it, and see what happens. After having a shop for 11 years, I found out the general public is rather dumb when it comes to cars. "Just plug it in and see what it says" they think/say. Does not work that way at all. If it did, you would not need to bring it to a shop.
The type of technician that would get a job like this, is ideally, a total electronics nerd. Has a butt load of patience, logs EVERYTHING he does to every car and has a hotline to the factory service team. Smaller dealerships don't see enough cars to warrant 1 person to just 'figure things out'. I know several guys at various brands, and this is what they do. This is ONLY what they do. They don't do brake jobs, they don't replace engines. They just track down these really difficult problems, and end up being part of the large group of people that help create all those TSB's and superceded parts that we end up seeing.
So, be patient. But, also be firm in what needs to be done to keep you happy as a customer. Being a total douchebag will get you the finger behind your back as you drive away, and someone farting in your seats(or worse).
The type of technician that would get a job like this, is ideally, a total electronics nerd. Has a butt load of patience, logs EVERYTHING he does to every car and has a hotline to the factory service team. Smaller dealerships don't see enough cars to warrant 1 person to just 'figure things out'. I know several guys at various brands, and this is what they do. This is ONLY what they do. They don't do brake jobs, they don't replace engines. They just track down these really difficult problems, and end up being part of the large group of people that help create all those TSB's and superceded parts that we end up seeing.
So, be patient. But, also be firm in what needs to be done to keep you happy as a customer. Being a total douchebag will get you the finger behind your back as you drive away, and someone farting in your seats(or worse).
Last edited by SCCAGT; 10-09-2015 at 09:49 AM.
10-09-2015, 09:46 AM
#10
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,260
Any time there is a new generation of product released, there will be problems. Bugs that need to get worked out, and can only be found out over the longer term. Testing/proving grounds can only do so much. I would agree that there is one problem causing the entire thing to unravel. How hard it is to find it depends on who is looking at it at the dealership. I am sure they are doing everything they can. That is, afterall, in their best interest to do. Finding these types of problems is NEVER an easy process. Takes a substantial amount of trial and error. There is no way to specifically test a control module outside of a controlled environment like an electronics lab. All any shop can do is check for input/output signals. If input is there, but no output, logic has it that the module in question is the problem. And as mentioned, all they can do is order a new one, install it, and see what happens. After having a shop for 11 years, I found out the general public is rather dumb when it comes to cars. "Just plug it in and see what it says" they think/say. Does not work that way at all. If it did, you would not need to bring it to a shop.
The type of technician that would get a job like this, is ideally, a total electronics nerd. Has a butt load of patience, logs EVERYTHING he does to every car and has a hotline to the factory service team. Smaller dealerships don't see enough cars to warrant 1 person to just 'figure things out'. I know several guys at various brands, and this is what they do. This is ONLY what they do. They don't do brake jobs, they don't replace engines. They just track down these really difficult problems, and end up being part of the large group of people that help create all those TSB's that we end up seeing.
So, be patient. But, also be firm in what needs to be done to keep you happy as a customer. Being a total douchebag will get you the finger behind your back as you drive away, and someone farting in your seats(or worse).
The type of technician that would get a job like this, is ideally, a total electronics nerd. Has a butt load of patience, logs EVERYTHING he does to every car and has a hotline to the factory service team. Smaller dealerships don't see enough cars to warrant 1 person to just 'figure things out'. I know several guys at various brands, and this is what they do. This is ONLY what they do. They don't do brake jobs, they don't replace engines. They just track down these really difficult problems, and end up being part of the large group of people that help create all those TSB's that we end up seeing.
So, be patient. But, also be firm in what needs to be done to keep you happy as a customer. Being a total douchebag will get you the finger behind your back as you drive away, and someone farting in your seats(or worse).
you hit the nail on the head^^^ you have not lived until you have spent 20+hours on a warranty electrical concern that defies all logic and completely confuses the ford hotline engeneers, only to have a customer talk chit about your abilities. lol