Official: GT350 will have 5.2 liter, 500+ HP flat-plane V8
11-20-2014, 12:58 PM
#31
Wait for the Voice of reason....Here it comes...
You know... the relationship with a dealer is really as far as you push it. On a professional level you bring them a car that is having problems... they are tasked with fixing it. There are some things they really don't need to know about your life and the things you do. So if you want to tell them I was going hard into an APEX at the local race track and then heard a loud bang and pop on the way out... then perhaps TMI applies. You could simply say I was on the parkway passing a Semi then I heard a Bang and Pop and now here I am.
Or...
Find a dealer that actually races or sponsors racing.... You might have to pay a premium and travel a bit, but they'll service your car. If you own a Scuderia and can afford the insurance... you can afford to pay the premiums for service. (Hint) if the Ferarri service center is not far from a racetrack... odds are they know the deal.
Or...
Buy a car where many of the components can be serviced/replaced/maintained by the owner and is more practical.
We can all have hobbies. When the hobby exceeds the cost of what we can afford...its time for a new hobby.
Just saying
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I'll add perhaps there is the defining term... One car is for a hobbyist/enthusiast. Like the GT30. While the other is for the collector/Racer. Like the z28.
In the End ....Odds are more of the prior will sell to the public because it will likely be more attainable and/or more practical to justify cost and that's the big win. And in the end as a Manufacturer...sales and volume....That's what recoups the invested R&D.
---
You know... the relationship with a dealer is really as far as you push it. On a professional level you bring them a car that is having problems... they are tasked with fixing it. There are some things they really don't need to know about your life and the things you do. So if you want to tell them I was going hard into an APEX at the local race track and then heard a loud bang and pop on the way out... then perhaps TMI applies. You could simply say I was on the parkway passing a Semi then I heard a Bang and Pop and now here I am.
Or...
Find a dealer that actually races or sponsors racing.... You might have to pay a premium and travel a bit, but they'll service your car. If you own a Scuderia and can afford the insurance... you can afford to pay the premiums for service. (Hint) if the Ferarri service center is not far from a racetrack... odds are they know the deal.
Or...
Buy a car where many of the components can be serviced/replaced/maintained by the owner and is more practical.
We can all have hobbies. When the hobby exceeds the cost of what we can afford...its time for a new hobby.
Just saying
---
I'll add perhaps there is the defining term... One car is for a hobbyist/enthusiast. Like the GT30. While the other is for the collector/Racer. Like the z28.
In the End ....Odds are more of the prior will sell to the public because it will likely be more attainable and/or more practical to justify cost and that's the big win. And in the end as a Manufacturer...sales and volume....That's what recoups the invested R&D.
---
Last edited by Cruzinaround; 11-20-2014 at 01:17 PM.
11-20-2014, 01:18 PM
#32
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clermont, FL
Posts: 2,952
You really shouldn't assume so much, it shows ignorance and single minded thinking.
Plus, you obviously don't realize how few and far between Ferrari dealerships are. Especially when you have 4 that need regular service done.
Plus, you obviously don't realize how few and far between Ferrari dealerships are. Especially when you have 4 that need regular service done.
11-20-2014, 01:28 PM
#33
Again you confuse being practical for ignorance. I couldn't imagine what the costs of Maintenance are for a Scuderia... I can only gleen from what is said about them and from the clients I deal with in the Insurance world it's neither affordable nor attainable for most people. So owning one and racing them is a choice. If you make that choice knowing what the scarcity is for the dealers and the proximity of them... then that was just poor research and homework on the part of that owner. I'm assuming that's not you since I know from your posts elsewhere you're more practical than that.
Assumptions are all I can make unless the other party flat out says... The Scuderia is mine. I didn't do the homework on the accessibility of dealers and repair service centers and I admittedly told them more than I should have.
Then It wouldn't be an assumption. However if you didn't share TMI with the dealer then I can only guess they are clairvoyant and have the power to see into your past?
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Assumptions are all I can make unless the other party flat out says... The Scuderia is mine. I didn't do the homework on the accessibility of dealers and repair service centers and I admittedly told them more than I should have.
Then It wouldn't be an assumption. However if you didn't share TMI with the dealer then I can only guess they are clairvoyant and have the power to see into your past?
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11-20-2014, 01:49 PM
#34
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clermont, FL
Posts: 2,952
Acceptable response. the cost of maintenance is far exceeded by the revenue made from the cars. And it isn't hard to figure out what the use of the cars is when they are titled to a driving experience and service is billed to the same. We also deal with Lamborghini, Audi, Porsche and Nissan and those guys are easier to deal with. especially Porsche and Nissan.
And yes I don't think I will ever buy a Ferrari, and it isn't about money, its there are better more reliable options out there.
And yes I don't think I will ever buy a Ferrari, and it isn't about money, its there are better more reliable options out there.
11-20-2014, 02:19 PM
#35
Now that makes sense. Ferarri also is pretty well known for being elitist in their business culture. They would likely be more accepting of a Person rather than a Business associated with those cars requiring maintenance. And in that suggestion would be a possible fix to remedy their unwillingness to perform repairs.
Just saying....
Or Your employer can just get a whole bunch of z28's.
If he wants to impress the working class... throw in a bunch of GT 350's
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Just saying....
Or Your employer can just get a whole bunch of z28's.
If he wants to impress the working class... throw in a bunch of GT 350's
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11-20-2014, 07:53 PM
#37
Todays GT500 and GT350 are built by Ford to be nice street cars nothing more nothing less. The aftermarket is what turns them into anything else.
The Z/28 IS a racecar. it is currently racing in the CTSC races on the IMSA circuit along with the 302R and M3. The Zeta chassis is extremely competitive and Stevenson Motorsports had a couple of wins this year. The difference is chevy built a racecar that is capable of street duty and is offering it for ~$73K that then has to have a cage installed (by Pratt-Miller per the rules) the rotors replaced with a steel unit and the interior stripped. this will end up with a cost of roughly $90-100K ready to race.
Ford offers the 302R which is not street legal but is ready to race with a few small changes depending on rule changes ( mostly shocks depending on series sponsor) for $100-120K.
Actually the Z/28 is a better buy since if you have a failure since the drivetrain is factory GM where as the 302R engine is built by RoushYates.
The GT350 is going to be a great streetcar for occasional autox but it will not make a great racecar in its stock form.
The 1LE package is subpar to the z/28 for racing. This is why the teams that are winning and running up front are running the z/28 and not the older Camaro GS-R (yes that is what the race prepped SS was called) with basically what became the "new" 1LE suspension package.
By putting that kind of pricetag on these factory built racecars (302R, z/28, 911rsr) they are marketed toward the professional racer and not the normal everyday guy.
This statement here just shows your ignorance on the subject. The same could be said about the 302R, 302S, and CobraJet. all these cars are in the $75-125K range directly from Ford available to anyone that wants one.
What you said about the Z/28 is correct: It is a racecar. The Camaro fans freely admit that it is a tract ready car that is also street legal where cars like the Boss302 and even the Boss Leguna Seca are street cars first but can be put on the track.
Just some tidbit factoid: Chevy only made a total of 500 Z/28 Camaros for MY 2014. Most of these were most likely snatched up by professional teams before the very lucky few non-races were able to score one.
The demand for the MY 2014 Z/28 was so high that Chevy announced that they will produce no less than 2500 Z28s for MY2015.
In line with that, well said about the 302R and Cobrajet: Cars that are specifically racecars only but can be bought by anyone who can pay the price and is lucky enough to be put on the waiting list. These cars are made primarily for dedicated racers, a very niche market, but they are available to anyone.
With that said, I am now curious if the GT350 will be made in such limited numbers like the CobraJets (around only 70 CJs made each MY) or the MY2014 Z/28 (only 500 made this MY).
Hopefully, the GT350 street version will be made in appreciable numbers, say no less than 2500 GT350s, and the racecar-only version would be the only one that is made in extremely limited numbers.
11-20-2014, 09:13 PM
#38
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Wilsonville Oregon
Posts: 293
I have owned every gen of Camaro & 5 Mustangs (2 gen 1 & 3 gen5). If you are a real car guy you can't deny the performance ability of the new Z/28 I just wish GM would of called it something else. I've owned a few Z/28s but I can't justify $75,000 for the current offering.
It will be interesting to see what the new Mustang GT350 is going to be; street car that does ok on track or track car that does ok on the street. You can't have both without changing parts. From what I've read the track pack on the new Mustang is a joke for track use but Ford knows most who get the track pack won't track their car. It's all about bench racing.
I looked at buying a new GT500 but dealers around me wanted $70,000+. If the GT350 isn't too pricy I might be replacing my 2013 Mustang GT soon.
It will be interesting to see what the new Mustang GT350 is going to be; street car that does ok on track or track car that does ok on the street. You can't have both without changing parts. From what I've read the track pack on the new Mustang is a joke for track use but Ford knows most who get the track pack won't track their car. It's all about bench racing.
I looked at buying a new GT500 but dealers around me wanted $70,000+. If the GT350 isn't too pricy I might be replacing my 2013 Mustang GT soon.
11-22-2014, 04:38 PM
#39
I have owned every gen of Camaro & 5 Mustangs (2 gen 1 & 3 gen5). If you are a real car guy you can't deny the performance ability of the new Z/28 I just wish GM would of called it something else. I've owned a few Z/28s but I can't justify $75,000 for the current offering.
It will be interesting to see what the new Mustang GT350 is going to be; street car that does ok on track or track car that does ok on the street. You can't have both without changing parts. From what I've read the track pack on the new Mustang is a joke for track use but Ford knows most who get the track pack won't track their car. It's all about bench racing.
I looked at buying a new GT500 but dealers around me wanted $70,000+. If the GT350 isn't too pricy I might be replacing my 2013 Mustang GT soon.
It will be interesting to see what the new Mustang GT350 is going to be; street car that does ok on track or track car that does ok on the street. You can't have both without changing parts. From what I've read the track pack on the new Mustang is a joke for track use but Ford knows most who get the track pack won't track their car. It's all about bench racing.
I looked at buying a new GT500 but dealers around me wanted $70,000+. If the GT350 isn't too pricy I might be replacing my 2013 Mustang GT soon.
Various blogs and rumors in the Camaro forums pegs the GT350 to compete against the $73-$75K Z/28, so my guess, unfortunately, is that GT350 buyers will be paying around $65K per unit.
If my earlier guesses are correct about Ford offering the GT350 in two flavors, a street version and a track dedicated version, I could see the street GT350 selling below the $60K mark (around $55K?).
The track dedicated version would thus be priced much closer, around a few K more than the Z/28m maybe around $75K-$80K (or more if the track version is track only and fully designed as a racecar from the ground up).
Last edited by JIM5.0; 11-22-2014 at 04:42 PM.