Markups on Tuners & Cold Air Intakes
12-19-2014, 03:35 AM
#1
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,149
Markups on Tuners & Cold Air Intakes
Markups on Tuners & Cold Air Intakes
1st... let's agree I'm cheap...OK! That's why I'm retired & very comfortable financially! I actually don't mind spending money, but I often question how some things are priced so high.... for so little! I remember when I was in high school a pizza & cokes were the cheapest meal on a date..... but then that was just before the Civil War! (SMILE)
Of course manufacturers have to get returns on research, but how do they justify the prices on some Cold Air Intakes & Tuners??? Developing a tune is not creating a drug to fight Cancer! Some CAI units much like for a 2015 Mustang are a basically C&N type filter & a piece of plastic pipe with a couple of fittings at a tremendous price! It seems to me the CAI units & hand held tuners are way over priced at the $800. range! Am I wrong? Probably.... I often am!
Having "gringed/whined" about it, are there any manufacturers that provide a "Tuner & CAI Combo" at a more reasonable price! I don't need one with 5 custom tunes, but just a tuner with 4 to 5 "canned" tunes such as an Economy Tune, 87 Octane Street Power Tune, 91 Octane Street Power tune, Calif. approved 87 Street Octane Tune, & a 91 Octane Race Tune, etc.. Many guys just want a reliable canned tune for a stock 5.0L with or without a CAI on it! Manufacturers should be able to make a decent profit at far less than $800.! (My experience is "One size fits all/canned tunes" work pretty well if you are not trying to get the last drop of HP out of stock engine! I have an Edge Tuner for my stock F150 Ecoboost Pickup & it's great. I well understand that with engine modifications you may need a custom tune.)
In case I lost you in my rambling at 1:35 AM.... any suggestions for a Reliable "Tuner/CAI Combo" for less than the $800.00 range??
1st... let's agree I'm cheap...OK! That's why I'm retired & very comfortable financially! I actually don't mind spending money, but I often question how some things are priced so high.... for so little! I remember when I was in high school a pizza & cokes were the cheapest meal on a date..... but then that was just before the Civil War! (SMILE)
Of course manufacturers have to get returns on research, but how do they justify the prices on some Cold Air Intakes & Tuners??? Developing a tune is not creating a drug to fight Cancer! Some CAI units much like for a 2015 Mustang are a basically C&N type filter & a piece of plastic pipe with a couple of fittings at a tremendous price! It seems to me the CAI units & hand held tuners are way over priced at the $800. range! Am I wrong? Probably.... I often am!
Having "gringed/whined" about it, are there any manufacturers that provide a "Tuner & CAI Combo" at a more reasonable price! I don't need one with 5 custom tunes, but just a tuner with 4 to 5 "canned" tunes such as an Economy Tune, 87 Octane Street Power Tune, 91 Octane Street Power tune, Calif. approved 87 Street Octane Tune, & a 91 Octane Race Tune, etc.. Many guys just want a reliable canned tune for a stock 5.0L with or without a CAI on it! Manufacturers should be able to make a decent profit at far less than $800.! (My experience is "One size fits all/canned tunes" work pretty well if you are not trying to get the last drop of HP out of stock engine! I have an Edge Tuner for my stock F150 Ecoboost Pickup & it's great. I well understand that with engine modifications you may need a custom tune.)
In case I lost you in my rambling at 1:35 AM.... any suggestions for a Reliable "Tuner/CAI Combo" for less than the $800.00 range??
Last edited by Mr. D; 12-19-2014 at 03:42 AM.
12-19-2014, 08:44 PM
#2
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,155
What year/model is your car? Chances are a CAI will do nothing for you. They are just snake oil these days.
As far as the prices of CAIs, that just further shows they are useless pieces of junk. As you noted, they are just cheap pieces of plastic and a standard reusable filter. They something like a 600% markup on them and that is absolutely crazy for a simple tube.
I see a lot of these parts have huge markups, while many add ons are actually quite reasonable. The second worst offender is probably mufflers. $800? Crazy.
As far as the prices of CAIs, that just further shows they are useless pieces of junk. As you noted, they are just cheap pieces of plastic and a standard reusable filter. They something like a 600% markup on them and that is absolutely crazy for a simple tube.
I see a lot of these parts have huge markups, while many add ons are actually quite reasonable. The second worst offender is probably mufflers. $800? Crazy.
12-19-2014, 08:47 PM
#3
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 289
12-20-2014, 02:38 AM
#4
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,149
What year/model is your car? Chances are a CAI will do nothing for you. They are just snake oil these days.I'm thinking about buying a 2015 GT!
As far as the prices of CAIs, that just further shows they are useless pieces of junk. As you noted, they are just cheap pieces of plastic and a standard reusable filter. They something like a 600% markup on them and that is absolutely crazy for a simple tube.
I see a lot of these parts have huge markups, while many add ons are actually quite reasonable. The second worst offender is probably mufflers. $800? Crazy.
As far as the prices of CAIs, that just further shows they are useless pieces of junk. As you noted, they are just cheap pieces of plastic and a standard reusable filter. They something like a 600% markup on them and that is absolutely crazy for a simple tube.
I see a lot of these parts have huge markups, while many add ons are actually quite reasonable. The second worst offender is probably mufflers. $800? Crazy.
When I was a kid I modified the muffler & pipe on a racing bike! It sounded really mean, but didn't go a bit faster! Always remember, "To make money, Fishing Lures have to catch fishermen, not fish!"
Do you have any stests that support your opinion on CAI's?
12-20-2014, 06:05 AM
#5
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,044
I got an SCT 3 right before the SCT 4 came out from motorvationefi.com for $279.00 but the race team owner is my cousins husband. I also bought an Airaid "tube" from autoanything.com for $89.00, yes I look for bargains too.
12-21-2014, 01:48 AM
#6
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Join Date: Aug 2008
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I'd like to see an "independent" test showing before & after CAI only! Tuners are much easier to see the difference as an individual consumer. I suspect some are partly impressed by the difference in "intake noise" with a CAI, much like putting on a noisy muffler on a stock Japanese car. It must be going faster with all that racket!!!
Another interesting test would be a CAI with a K&N type filter compared to a K&N type filter alone.
To be clear, I'm not saying CAI's don't work, but it is obviously a very high profit item for what little you get. I'm old enough to remember cigarettes were proven no problem for decades, & vitamin C cured just about everything known to man, until the main proponent of Vitamin C (Dr. Julius Pauling) said most of his research was wrong (it's still good for your health in natural forms.) HEY....how come a deer can jump so high without breaking legs when it doesn't drink any milk???? Maybe we've been lied to.... by the Dairy Industry! Green leafy vegetables are a better source of calcium than milk without clogging your arteries! Maybe we've been lied to.... by the Dairy Industry! Chocolate cake & milk...yum! Everything in moderation... including moderation! LOL! UCLA did a long term study on them there "joint healing pills" sold by the billions & concluded they made no difference! Placebo affect? Zinc in cold remedies is actually proven to work! (WHO'S OFF TOPIC??? Help! I got carried away.... SORRY..... insomnia causes this! Science class is over! What's a CAI anyhow?? Good Night All!) LOL!
Last edited by Mr. D; 12-21-2014 at 01:55 AM.
12-21-2014, 04:02 AM
#7
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,155
There's a ton of tests out there about CAIs. Of course the vendors that make them have dyno tests that "prove" they help - but only at the very high end of the RPM range, and a small gain at that. I have not seen anything that indicates they help you accelerate faster.
There's also tests that show they are useless. One thing to consider is your throttle body remains the same size; no matter how big your intake tube is there is a choke point that restricts the airflow anyways.
Ford has maintained over and over that CAIs are useless for most Mustangs and the factory box is as good as it gets for naturally aspirated cars. This was discussed on an episode of Jay Leno's Garage where they were going over the Boss 302. A car like that would surely have an aftermarket CAI if they were beneficial, yes? And yet, it doesn't.
There's also tests that show they are useless. One thing to consider is your throttle body remains the same size; no matter how big your intake tube is there is a choke point that restricts the airflow anyways.
Ford has maintained over and over that CAIs are useless for most Mustangs and the factory box is as good as it gets for naturally aspirated cars. This was discussed on an episode of Jay Leno's Garage where they were going over the Boss 302. A car like that would surely have an aftermarket CAI if they were beneficial, yes? And yet, it doesn't.
12-21-2014, 09:38 AM
#8
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Treasure Coast, FL
Posts: 167
I recently talked myself into an aftermarket CAI w/the SCT-X4 & tunes, mostly because I got a pretty good price deal. And because my car is my daily driver, I won't be doing much else performance-wise to the engine to increase power. I just wanted to maximize its current, NA goodness.
Frankly, I'm not convinced the CAI did anything other than increase intake noise, as it is much louder than the stock box. I've had CAI's before and never experienced this much intake noise tho; it might be due to the heat extractor vents in the hood but it is, none-the-less, much noisier.
The manufacturer is a high quality company & in their ads they claimed X HP/torque increase w/their tune & CAI. Mine didn't come close to the claim, instead coming in @ a much lower level, albeit one I had been told/read was more realistic. From that aspect, they were just about on the numbers.
Ford makes a strong claim to their intake box as being very efficient & I almost believe them. Perhaps you can pick up a few ponies up top but if you aren't racing the car, and I don't, is that of any value to you, especially @ the cost of a CAI?
I haven't dyno-tuned my car yet- that's next. We'll see if the CAI shows something of value in that venue.
Lee
Frankly, I'm not convinced the CAI did anything other than increase intake noise, as it is much louder than the stock box. I've had CAI's before and never experienced this much intake noise tho; it might be due to the heat extractor vents in the hood but it is, none-the-less, much noisier.
The manufacturer is a high quality company & in their ads they claimed X HP/torque increase w/their tune & CAI. Mine didn't come close to the claim, instead coming in @ a much lower level, albeit one I had been told/read was more realistic. From that aspect, they were just about on the numbers.
Ford makes a strong claim to their intake box as being very efficient & I almost believe them. Perhaps you can pick up a few ponies up top but if you aren't racing the car, and I don't, is that of any value to you, especially @ the cost of a CAI?
I haven't dyno-tuned my car yet- that's next. We'll see if the CAI shows something of value in that venue.
Lee
12-21-2014, 07:44 PM
#9
4th Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,149
There's a ton of tests out there about CAIs. Of course the vendors that make them have dyno tests that "prove" they help - but only at the very high end of the RPM range, and a small gain at that. I have not seen anything that indicates they help you accelerate faster.
There's also tests that show they are useless. One thing to consider is your throttle body remains the same size; no matter how big your intake tube is there is a choke point that restricts the airflow anyways.
Ford has maintained over and over that CAIs are useless for most Mustangs and the factory box is as good as it gets for naturally aspirated cars. This was discussed on an episode of Jay Leno's Garage where they were going over the Boss 302. A car like that would surely have an aftermarket CAI if they were beneficial, yes? And yet, it doesn't.
There's also tests that show they are useless. One thing to consider is your throttle body remains the same size; no matter how big your intake tube is there is a choke point that restricts the airflow anyways.
Ford has maintained over and over that CAIs are useless for most Mustangs and the factory box is as good as it gets for naturally aspirated cars. This was discussed on an episode of Jay Leno's Garage where they were going over the Boss 302. A car like that would surely have an aftermarket CAI if they were beneficial, yes? And yet, it doesn't.
12-22-2014, 02:23 AM
#10
4th Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,149
I recently talked myself into an aftermarket CAI w/the SCT-X4 & tunes, mostly because I got a pretty good price deal. And because my car is my daily driver, I won't be doing much else performance-wise to the engine to increase power. I just wanted to maximize its current, NA goodness.
Frankly, I'm not convinced the CAI did anything other than increase intake noise, as it is much louder than the stock box. I've had CAI's before and never experienced this much intake noise tho; it might be due to the heat extractor vents in the hood but it is, none-the-less, much noisier.
The manufacturer is a high quality company & in their ads they claimed X HP/torque increase w/their tune & CAI. Mine didn't come close to the claim, instead coming in @ a much lower level, albeit one I had been told/read was more realistic. From that aspect, they were just about on the numbers.
Ford makes a strong claim to their intake box as being very efficient & I almost believe them. Perhaps you can pick up a few ponies up top but if you aren't racing the car, and I don't, is that of any value to you, especially @ the cost of a CAI?
I haven't dyno-tuned my car yet- that's next. We'll see if the CAI shows something of value in that venue.
Lee
Frankly, I'm not convinced the CAI did anything other than increase intake noise, as it is much louder than the stock box. I've had CAI's before and never experienced this much intake noise tho; it might be due to the heat extractor vents in the hood but it is, none-the-less, much noisier.
The manufacturer is a high quality company & in their ads they claimed X HP/torque increase w/their tune & CAI. Mine didn't come close to the claim, instead coming in @ a much lower level, albeit one I had been told/read was more realistic. From that aspect, they were just about on the numbers.
Ford makes a strong claim to their intake box as being very efficient & I almost believe them. Perhaps you can pick up a few ponies up top but if you aren't racing the car, and I don't, is that of any value to you, especially @ the cost of a CAI?
I haven't dyno-tuned my car yet- that's next. We'll see if the CAI shows something of value in that venue.
Lee
Roush superchargers have a CAI & different tune you can choose. It invalidates the warranty & adds HP. Hard to know what to believe since they all have a incentive $$$!
