ThrottleJunkie

I bought my 05 GT a little over a month ago with 9,800 miles on it. It was issued a factory buyback title because the charging system was weak. A couple days ago I installed a JLT CAI and SCT xcal 2. The tune was loaded but the car was not driven. I went to start the car up for the first time and the battery died. It then told me that the car went into failsafe mode. I then returned both the airbox and tune back to stock, which were the only mods on the car. I jumped the battery and all was well.

This morning the car didn't start very well at all but it ran. Later when I got home, I turned the car off and left the key in the ignition for no more than 10 minutes as I was expecting people and wanted to listen to the radio. The battery died again. It's not that the car had trouble starting, but it was absolutely dead. Nothing.

Now the car sits. I was given a 12 month/12,000 mile bumper-to-bumper warranty from Ford when I bought the car. The warranty papers state that the problem was repaired and that the issue is no longer existent.

A few questions:

1. Is there a chance that I messed something up when I used the tuner?
2. Will the tuner be able to be traced assuming all parts were returned to stock form?
3. If it can be traced, do I still have a case since the battery is still dying even after everything was returned to stock?
4. At what point do lemon laws come into play? I can't imagine something like that would totally ruin a car. If it's this bad then this was inevitable anyways.

The car only has 11,484 miles on it and it is already a massive headache.




This is all hypothetical, of course. I would never try to void my factory warranty.

Orion_240

once you start modifying your Mustang you are already trying to void the warranty!
None of us are going to understand why you would keep a car that has a "buyback title" unless you are trying to void the warranty and do a full modification of your Mustang.

If there is a known problem with the charging system and the battery keeps dying... why would you question the cause?

If you want to keep the car take it back to stock and take it back for full warranty work.
I don't know if the Lemon Law will apply in your state. Sometimes it only applies to new cars and the first owners but you'll have to research your state's laws.

Dragon Stang

Does this vehicle still have the original battery? If so, these batteries can only handle a complete discharge a few times with each time loosing more and more capacity. Unlike deep cycle batteries that are made to handle discharging. I suspect if you still do have the original, it is toast.

grampa_stang

Mine just died 4 days ago...same issue. Dead battery. I have a JLT CAI/tune. I had it towed to the dealer
and told them not to flash anything. They replaced my alternator and gave me a new battery.They had
to remove the CAI to get to the alternator and they didn't say a word. The CAI/tune has nothing to do
with the charging system.

btw - this is a common issue, so I wouldn't trip. Sure, I was pi$$ed..but I got her back the next day by noon.

Boozshey

Lemon Laws depending on the state only cover the vehicle towards unseen issues which prevent the vehicle to operate and usually only cover it for a period of time or to a specific mileage which is typically 500 miles...

But since you knew it was a buy back for the charging system, I would say that you bought it, knowing of the issue and that no lemon law would cover you.

Just get them to fix it under the extended warranty you now have.

ThrottleJunkie

I kind of feel that the car was mis-represented. They were very nonchalant about the car when telling me this stuff. Things like:

"The guy who bought it never drove it so naturally the battery died. He called up Ford and bitched and Ford listened but it really wasn't an issue. Any battery will die when the car isn't driven for a couple weeks."

"I have good news! I'm even gonna throw in a 12 month/12,000 mile warranty in case anything should happen!"

There's a few things fishy about this situation.

In Ohio, when a car is deemed a lemon and is repaired and resold, it is required to carry a 12 month/12,000 mile warranty. He made it sound like it was thrown onto this car to make the customer happy.

Also, not once was the word lemon mentioned. They used the term "factory buyback" which is legit but never said that was car was lemoned. If it were, I would never have bought it. I thought there was a distinct difference between a factory buyback and a lemon.

Furthermore, the car was listed on cars.com as having 4,3xx miles on it. When I test drove it it had 9,8xx miles. The salesman told me that the owner of the dealer "drove it for a few months to make sure everything worked." I don't think you need 5,000 miles to figure that out. This car was his daily driver for an extended period of time and I don't know how well it was taken care of during that time.

In Ohio, under Lemon Law, if a car is misrepresented then there is a case to get either a replacement or a full refund of the entire purchase price.

What do you guys think I should do?

bb816331

IDK man, it's covered so they are going to fix it regardless. I know it sux. I bought that 04 that was all jacked up, and luckily I put a stop payment from the bank and they never got their money. They had no choice but to pick the car up. But my car had zero warranty. Yours is covered...take it and have them fix it. Dealers are a-holes...theres a reason why they are called stealerships.

Boozshey

Looking into the law it says that the Dealer must be given a reasonable opportunity to correct the issue.

So it's back at that. They have to be able to fix it. With the charging system, they will change each component at individual visits. So it seems to be you still have to wait for that, and like I mentioned earlier, you still have to call them.

About the owner driving the car. Well it's his car and if he chooses to drive it and devalue it, that's his problem.

ThrottleJunkie

I think there's something that you guys are missing here.

the car was already Lemon'ed. It was issued a buyback title which is a nicer way of saying it's a lemon. The dealer failed to mention that to me. They said the first owner was an idiot who never drove it and ended up getting his money back.

In Ohio, one of the requirements for a car to be labeled a lemon is if the dealer has tried on 3 separate occasions to fix the problem and it still reoccurs.

We are past that entire step. The dealer already had ample time to fix the car and it apparently passed Ford's standards. Ford was wrong.

By Ohio Lemon Law I cannot simply ask for my money back. There are alternative ways, however, to getting a refund.

1. If the car was mis-represented by the dealer. Like I said, they were very nonchalant about the title issue and made it seem like they were "throwing in" that extra warranty "as a favor." They did not tell me that they were required to give me that warranty due to the car being a lemon. The mileage was also mis-represented. On the cars.com ad, it stated that the car had 4,313 miles. When I bought the car it had 9,877 miles. I would agree that it was a typo if there wasn't such a discrepency between the numerals.

2. Ohio law states that the dealer MUST fill out a Used Car Form and put it in the window of every single car before it can be displayed for sale. You all have seen it. In big font it reads "As Is - No Warranty" as well as a bunch of other stuff. This was never on the car. I was never shown nor given a copy of this document and the dealer certainly doesn't have proof that the document exists. This, inandofitself, is enough to have a court overturn any decision made by the dealer.

I have 2 witnesses that were there both for the test drive and the pickup that can say that the car was both mis-represented and that that form was never filled out.

Also, to go along with the first point, if the car is mis-represented then I can be entitled not just to a refund of the full purchase price, but "up to three times the damages caused by the dealership." That statement should probably make them fold right away.

I think I have a very strong case and I don't think it should be a problem to get them to take the car back. I think the last thing that they wanna do is go to court for a case they probably won't win.

I guess we'll find out in the morning when I call them. This happened late Friday so I haven't been able to talk to anyone since. Apparently they aren't open on weekends.

Qusus

Ok everything you said makes perfect sense and I'd reccomend getting your money back if the car really does have a charging problem.

However, keep in mind that the dead battery issue is VERY common for the S197 Mustang... in fact I've had this EXACT problem myself. When i bought my GT it had 850 miles on it and wouldn't start without a jump. Even after the jump the car still wouldn't start without jumping.

I had the battery replaced under warranty and turn off the radio manually everytime I get out of the car and it's never been a problem since.

I would first suggest simply getting the battery replaced under warranty, if that fixes the issue tehre's no reason to go through the process of a full refund.

Like I said, the battery issue is a VERY common problem and easily fixable. It might be just that. If it isnt... then definetely get your money back.