Getting blown! Also question about Tuner
01-17-2011, 11:16 AM
#21
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,062
Here is your conclusive cold weather info, right off the Vortech website. Left side, near the top:
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...008516v5.0.pdf
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...008516v5.0.pdf
IMPORTANT COLD WEATHER INFORMATION
In order to achieve the low noise level of Vortech
superchargers, Vortech specifies manufacturing
procedures that call for minimal internal clearance.
These precise tolerances however are not
conducive to temperatures below 25° F . Therefore,
storing the vehicle in a heated garage and/or
employing the use of an engine block
heater/aftermarket engine blanket is required when
the vehicle is subjected to a "cold startup" in
ambient temperatures below 25° F . Failure to
comply with this may result in immediate
supercharger failure and invalidate the
supercharger warranty.
In order to achieve the low noise level of Vortech
superchargers, Vortech specifies manufacturing
procedures that call for minimal internal clearance.
These precise tolerances however are not
conducive to temperatures below 25° F . Therefore,
storing the vehicle in a heated garage and/or
employing the use of an engine block
heater/aftermarket engine blanket is required when
the vehicle is subjected to a "cold startup" in
ambient temperatures below 25° F . Failure to
comply with this may result in immediate
supercharger failure and invalidate the
supercharger warranty.
01-17-2011, 05:00 PM
#22
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Pole
Posts: 6,716
I am kind of worried about the whole starting the car in winter thing. I have been reading a lot of different threads on that issue and can't really seem to get a straight answer.
The general consensus of what I found was that the car should be fine trough the winter but it's a really bad idea to start if it gets in the negative temps. I read a few people said they had taken their car through multiple winters with a Vortech, one guy was more specific (Chicago winter) and said they never had any problems, just let the car warm up first.
It doesn't usually go below 20 degrees here, typically it's 25-40 degrees but there are some days where it gets close to zero, but rarely negative.
I was thinking of switching to a 0w30 oil since it flows better in the cold but I also read the issue isn't with the oil flowing, it actually has to do with some parts in the blower that may not function properly at low temperatures which can cause a failure.
I really want to make sure and do everything possible to not grenade the engine.
The general consensus of what I found was that the car should be fine trough the winter but it's a really bad idea to start if it gets in the negative temps. I read a few people said they had taken their car through multiple winters with a Vortech, one guy was more specific (Chicago winter) and said they never had any problems, just let the car warm up first.
It doesn't usually go below 20 degrees here, typically it's 25-40 degrees but there are some days where it gets close to zero, but rarely negative.
I was thinking of switching to a 0w30 oil since it flows better in the cold but I also read the issue isn't with the oil flowing, it actually has to do with some parts in the blower that may not function properly at low temperatures which can cause a failure.
I really want to make sure and do everything possible to not grenade the engine.
I took my kit off last October. It's going back on March.
My $0.02
No fun at all?
Faster than stock sounds fun...And I'd assume he'd still be faster than his current setup...See OP sig
Agreed!
With an Auto, OP, I'd agree that 3.73s may work best, but I've never been in a blown auto...I'll let stealth and Flap tell you, their they experts here...
Sounds super fun for all, except my tire fund...
I'd be scared also...There's a lot that could go wrong, and you seem to be on the border of too cold...I assume it's a DD...As for the oil, I *believe* the throwback is the same as the Vortech in that it's self contained, meaning changing the oil viscosity in your engine oil won't affect the S/C at all...And I'd stay with the wieghted oil the S/C recomends...
I'd say if you can afford it, go intercooled, and if not save up for it...Either way I'd suspect you'd be faster than your curtrent setup, which is fun...That cold alert scares me, and for the $$ of the IC'd version a TS or roots may be better for your application, especially with auto...
No fun at all?
Faster than stock sounds fun...And I'd assume he'd still be faster than his current setup...See OP sig
Agreed!
With an Auto, OP, I'd agree that 3.73s may work best, but I've never been in a blown auto...I'll let stealth and Flap tell you, their they experts here...
Sounds super fun for all, except my tire fund...
I'd be scared also...There's a lot that could go wrong, and you seem to be on the border of too cold...I assume it's a DD...As for the oil, I *believe* the throwback is the same as the Vortech in that it's self contained, meaning changing the oil viscosity in your engine oil won't affect the S/C at all...And I'd stay with the wieghted oil the S/C recomends...
I'd say if you can afford it, go intercooled, and if not save up for it...Either way I'd suspect you'd be faster than your curtrent setup, which is fun...That cold alert scares me, and for the $$ of the IC'd version a TS or roots may be better for your application, especially with auto...
If I had known about that damn M90 going on sale, I would be gotten it!
It would mostly likely have saved me a motor in the process.
Plus, the auto LOVES low end torque. The M90 and Saleen have plenty of it.. the centris love high RPM, which is fine for drag racing but kinda crappy around town.
Brenspeed called me back this morning & got it upgraded to the intercooled kit.
According to them it should be fine in the weather here as long as you let the car warm up... hopefully that is correct. The only story I read about one blowing up from this was in -40 temps.
Ill definitely be trying to keep the boost down til I have enough cash to comfortably be able to buy a new block. I'm sure I will have to upgrade the wheels, tires, brakes now as well to fully enjoy the car.
According to them it should be fine in the weather here as long as you let the car warm up... hopefully that is correct. The only story I read about one blowing up from this was in -40 temps.
Ill definitely be trying to keep the boost down til I have enough cash to comfortably be able to buy a new block. I'm sure I will have to upgrade the wheels, tires, brakes now as well to fully enjoy the car.
If it doesn't get into the negatives, I wouldn't worry about it. I heard it was customers in Canada that were blowing up their Vortechs one winter and they got tired of repairing them under warranty, so they came up with the 'winter warming notice" to cover their butts. You can contact either Vortech or Paxton and they'll give you the full story... they'll pretty much just tell you to put a heating pad over night, along with a shop light to keep it warm. Thats fine, but what about when you go to work or school when you have no access to an outlet?? I thought about ways to keep it warm, but just said screw it.. took it off for the winter!
01-17-2011, 05:58 PM
#23
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 536
Correct, its the INTERNAL gearing and components that are the issue. It has less to do with the oil (being self lubricated), and more about how the casing expands as with the compressor blade, gears etc. that require specific tolerances and measurements. I thought because it all increased exponentially, it would be fine.. I guess not lulz I can try and dig up a few threads on some other sites if I have time. Mustang Vortechs/Paxtons aren't the only ones with the problems. Viper owners, Toyota owners etc. with centris also have issues with these kits in the cold.
I took my kit off last October. It's going back on March.
Imagine running your current set up (CAI, tune, Gears) and running 13.2s/13.4s, and running the same with the V3 when it's hot lulz... so no, not very fun at all
If I had known about that damn M90 going on sale, I would be gotten it!
It would mostly likely have saved me a motor in the process.
Plus, the auto LOVES low end torque. The M90 and Saleen have plenty of it.. the centris love high RPM, which is fine for drag racing but kinda crappy around town.
lulz yeah, but if it's cold enough.. it won't start, it'll just explode and take out the bearings and compressor wheel along with it. No joke.
If it doesn't get into the negatives, I wouldn't worry about it. I heard it was customers in Canada that were blowing up their Vortechs one winter and they got tired of repairing them under warranty, so they came up with the 'winter warming notice" to cover their butts. You can contact either Vortech or Paxton and they'll give you the full story... they'll pretty much just tell you to put a heating pad over night, along with a shop light to keep it warm. Thats fine, but what about when you go to work or school when you have no access to an outlet?? I thought about ways to keep it warm, but just said screw it.. took it off for the winter!
I took my kit off last October. It's going back on March.
Imagine running your current set up (CAI, tune, Gears) and running 13.2s/13.4s, and running the same with the V3 when it's hot lulz... so no, not very fun at all
If I had known about that damn M90 going on sale, I would be gotten it!
It would mostly likely have saved me a motor in the process.
Plus, the auto LOVES low end torque. The M90 and Saleen have plenty of it.. the centris love high RPM, which is fine for drag racing but kinda crappy around town.
lulz yeah, but if it's cold enough.. it won't start, it'll just explode and take out the bearings and compressor wheel along with it. No joke.
If it doesn't get into the negatives, I wouldn't worry about it. I heard it was customers in Canada that were blowing up their Vortechs one winter and they got tired of repairing them under warranty, so they came up with the 'winter warming notice" to cover their butts. You can contact either Vortech or Paxton and they'll give you the full story... they'll pretty much just tell you to put a heating pad over night, along with a shop light to keep it warm. Thats fine, but what about when you go to work or school when you have no access to an outlet?? I thought about ways to keep it warm, but just said screw it.. took it off for the winter!
You can get houses/condos out there dirt cheap. 1300~ish sq ft houses built within the past 5-10 years for $75,000 (less then $500 a month...). I am paying $900 a month for a 2 bedroom apt here... it's a nice apartment but I hate paying $900 a month.
Kind of worried the home values will be starting to go up this year, so hopefully I'll be able to do it this year. The Northwest Area of LV seems reasonably safe from visiting but could be wrong.
01-17-2011, 06:09 PM
#24
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Pole
Posts: 6,716
^^ Better in LV than way up here lol it was -6 yesterday and dropping.
The houses up here are pretty damn expensive, but the good thing is that you can get a decent house and buy land with it, and shoot trespassers on your property.. bad thing is, it's in the middle of nowhere and about an hour from the City, which is more like a big town lulz
I would't worry about the winter issue if I were you. Are you doing the install yourself??
If so.. pics please!
The houses up here are pretty damn expensive, but the good thing is that you can get a decent house and buy land with it, and shoot trespassers on your property.. bad thing is, it's in the middle of nowhere and about an hour from the City, which is more like a big town lulz
I would't worry about the winter issue if I were you. Are you doing the install yourself??
If so.. pics please!
01-18-2011, 01:13 AM
#25
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 536
I wish I had the knowledge to install it myself... unfortunately I don't think it will cut it. The hardest thing I've installed is my Cold Air Intake... and I tried to take the door off and replace my door lock actuator and failed... got all the way down to the actuator and couldn't get it off... 
$170 later stealership fixed the lock for me.
$170 later stealership fixed the lock for me.
01-18-2011, 01:37 AM
#26
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Pole
Posts: 6,716
Don't worry about it. Theres nothing wrong with getting it installed for you
When you say "upgraded your order", did you go ahead with the Paxton H.O. 2200? or just upgrade with an intercooler? Theres a difference between the throwback kit (1200 Novi) and the larger Novi 2200.. just curious. Either one has enough to make more than the stock block can handle, but the 2200 maxes out at 650+whp...
When you say "upgraded your order", did you go ahead with the Paxton H.O. 2200? or just upgrade with an intercooler? Theres a difference between the throwback kit (1200 Novi) and the larger Novi 2200.. just curious. Either one has enough to make more than the stock block can handle, but the 2200 maxes out at 650+whp...
01-18-2011, 12:40 PM
#27
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Overland Park, Kansas
Posts: 536
I went with the full Novi 2200 HO Kit. All I am looking for is somewhere UP to 450 whp. I don't want to get too crazy with the numbers til I have supporting mods.
650 whp would be nice though :P
650 whp would be nice though :P
Last edited by gburke1; 01-18-2011 at 12:42 PM.
01-18-2011, 03:42 PM
#28
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,482
wow, that's an amazing fact I was not aware of...so it is stock (tune/cai = stock) at heavy use, high temps, ect...back to the S/C drawing board...
01-18-2011, 04:37 PM
#29
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Pole
Posts: 6,716
if you're running those numbers on a non-intercooled supercharger, your ego is gonna be hurting
I know I've run a 13.8 before on my V3...
01-19-2011, 08:16 AM
#30
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,482
yea, it'd hurt, I agree...I went driving yesterday (unusual for Tuesday) and really paid attention to my shifting points...I found that though I thought I was driving *spiritedly* I never shifted above 3.5K rpms, and that one shift was entering a freeway...Even with the MT, I think a centri would not suit me well, and I better go TS/roots...I am actually happy to have made that decision finally, lol, but now back to the original discussion, will a whipple non IC'd be a bummer? I noticed you ran a 12.5...was that perfect conditions? It's a long way from 13.8ish...
Gburke, A novi 2200 is gonna bew sweet, and I can wait to see pics, both of delivery and installed!
Gburke, A novi 2200 is gonna bew sweet, and I can wait to see pics, both of delivery and installed!