jdmcbride

Not sure where you are getting a long tube headers/catted mid-pipe combo for an extra $150-$200 over shorties. It was going to be an extra $1,100 for me back in 2009 (maybe prices have come down considerably).

I wanted to keep my factory cats because I didn't want to wake the neighbors (or the dead) on my morning start ups - which is already pretty loud with my current set up. This is also my daily driver, so I didn't want the low-end torque loss associated with long tubes...



If you want/need obnoxiously loud exhaust, get long tubes with an o/r pipe - you will definitely see high RPM benefit, but will sound like Mad Max is coming down the road. Its a good sound, but not on a daily driver for me...

onederful100

BBK ceramic shorties 419
http://www.americanmuscle.com/bbk-sh...t-ceramic.html

BBK ceramic LT's 599, I paid 550 for mine.
http://www.americanmuscle.com/bbk-ce...ders-2005.html

thats less than 150 diff for me.

heres my dyno. check the very low torque curve. lol.



thats at only 7psi. attribute the gains with the low psi to the LT's.

jdmcbride

But how much is the matching BBK catted h-pipe? Another $500? With long tubes, you have to purchase the additional mid-pipe as the long tubes terminate further back. An o/r mid-pipe isn't as expensive ($200?) as a catted one, but then you will probably have to weld in resonators to get rid of the raspiness of going catless.

Nice curve... But the long tubes aren't responsible for your impressive torque curve, your Whipple supercharger is. LOL

I agree with you (as I've stated several times) that long tubes are beneficial when you are using FI. But they do not have any significant advantage over shorties on an N/A engine.

mayo

Dude that's kinda like selective shopping, don't ya think?
Still need that catted midpipe to pass emissions with the lt's.
Add $450 to your $600...your up to $1050+
Last time I checked kooks they were like $1200. My bbk's were $320.
The question is...is it worth another 900-1000 $$ to a guy with a non fi mustang pushing a max of 350hp???
Can't buy that...I personally would rather have the shorty and the cam for what the lt's would cost.

Kooks LT's $1250 vs Shorty WITH Cam $350 + $800 = $1150
Sh&t...I just saved you a hundred bucks, and I don't believe we even have to question which will have the bigger gains on a stock engine with tune/cai.
But I would bet you the cost of the dyno that the LT's are coming in second.

onederful100

i dont need cats where i'm at.
you wont get nearly the gains with only shorties and stock midpipe. you'll get 5 rwhp if you're lucky.

yes LT's need a matching mid pipe.

its not selective shopping, they are both BBK
my LT's and midpipe cost me 750.


and the torque curve is from the whipple, but you see anybody else making 460 rwhp on 7 psi with shorties?
i dont think so.

onederful100

and you are doing selective comparisons:
LT's and midpipe to only shorties
why dont you compare the price of the shorties and the catted long midpipe to the price of the LT's and midpipe?
that is a more fair price comparison.

onederful100

http://www.americanmuscle.com/0509-mustang-xpipe.html

shorties + o/r midpipe = $798
LT's + o/r midpipe = $848

thats comparing BBK to BBK

i'm not giving up yet.


but i do agree that with a NA motor, the LT's will not get you a significant increase in power.

mayo

I think that statement speaks to the MANY that do not SC their car, as opposed to the few (and lucky) that do.
If I was one of the lucky, believe me LT's would be ordered at the same time as the blower. I think what JD, myself and others are suggesting is that for non sc'ed cars it makes more sense to consider shorty's along with Cam's as opposed to lt's...and yea bro, anyway you slice it, lt's cost more. Dont forget that a mid is not needed with the shorty...total cost is header only. You simply cannot say that about lt's...more components are needed, along with some earmuffs for the neighbors.
To me it made more sense to use that money for something else (cam) as opposed to the little increase the lt's would yield vs shorties at this power level, not to mention eliminating the need for hi-flow cat's, that at this power level are as worthless as tit's on a wart-hog.
The shorties do work well with the cams. Any loss of low end torque that the cam produces is offset by the increase of torque the shorty provide...and if you don't believe me, just ask my 295/45's as they are getting their covers blowed off in second gear now with an a/t.

xkape

I see both arguments and approve of them both. I mean, I see what each of you are saying and you are both right. On one hand, why not get the best and do it once instead of getting shortys and later in life saying.. damnit, now I need lT's. But that's coming from a guy who has FI and thinks everyone will at some point. However, most will not get FI and the shorty argument becomes valid. It really just depends on what a person plans to do.

In the end, FI = LT's and N/A = Shorties. End of story.

SON OF 68

Well, like stated already, another argument trying to justify LT's and the cost difference is if you have a law that requires cats. Also, do you want that straight exhaust with no cats sound? For some, that's just too loud and trumpety (Is that a word?, lol). So if you're going to need or want cats, then it's a significant decision....Is the $1000+ worth what I'm gaining for what I use it for? Even with FI....