Complaint Letter
11-17-2005, 05:54 PM
#11
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3
RE: Complaint Letter
Points well taken. However:
1) I was not trying to be dishonest or deceitful, but anyone who tells me that when they purchase a vehicle on any plan and have a trade-in, they are offered good money for their trade-in is lying
2) I have bought several cars in the past on A-Plan, including a couple of ordered cars WITH a trade-in, and in either case was I never told that the price we agree upon for the trade is "subject to change". As long as there is no more excessive damage or changes to the vehicle (other then a few more miles on the odometer) at the time of the order, the quote I got is what I will get upon delivery of the new vehicle. They were simply giving themselves an out on the price we agreed upon, and I can almost guarantee that when the car came in, and I brought them my trade-in, they would of told me either they will give me considerably less, or not accept the trade-in at all.
3) If Ford doesn't respond, then fine, they don't have to, and honestly, I don't expect them to. However, a dealership is FORD'S representative (you can't go to Detroit and buy one from Henry Ford himself), so I would hope they would take an interest on what their dealers do to their reputation, for you hear and read other stories about people who have a bad experince buying a car. More often then not, they don't go to another dealer, they go another manufacture, for they are unaware that all dealers and salesman are not the same, and put the blame for their experience on the manuafacture.
4) I will take my business elsewhere, and you're right, I'll either sell the car myself or just keep it. It's just amazing that a dealership would treat someone like that, especially when the auto market (Ford included) is hurting as bad as it is.
5) How can you say that I'm "whining" that I didn't get my way? That's complete BS. There is nothing wrong with voicing an opinion, especially when dealing with a situation when you are getting ripped off, plain and simple. If you experienced what I did, I guarantee you would be ticked too.
6) If I were in their shoes, I would honor the price we agree to, it's just good business. However, I would put it in writing that if the trade-in comes in and has any more damage then it already has, or has excessively more mileage, then the deal is subject to re-negotiation. NEVER would I sell or buy ANYTHING like this without it being in writing. Why? Read #2 above.
7) The 2006 GT's are by far the best Mustang to roll out of Detroit in a very long time (and yes, I have owned several generations of them, and can honestly say that). But, I'm not interested in buying this car or any car for that matter when the deal is open-ended, and I can live without one and be just as happy. I'll just hold on to the Firebird a little longer and if/when I do decide to buy another, it will be without a trade-in, playing games with a dealer is not my idea of fun.
8) If the Firebird requires more then just a recharge, then fine. However, trying to rip me off $1400 is crap. I can replace the ENTIRE A/C system for less then that.
9) Any dealer not willing to sell ANY car on A-Plan price is not worthy of my business, it simply shows that they care less about their employees and only care about screwing their customers.
10) The bottom line is this: dealers of course like and want to make money on a sale of a new vehicle, the finance percentage rate you pay, the extended warranties etc. But let's be honest, dealers really make their money in the back in service, for as everyone knows, at some point you will need to bring it in for repair, whether it is in warranty or not, and charge you a hefty premium. Most people are willing to pay the costs for they were treated "fairly" at the point of sale, so they feel obligated to give the dealer their business, and have a warm-fuzzy feeling about the whole experience.
1) I was not trying to be dishonest or deceitful, but anyone who tells me that when they purchase a vehicle on any plan and have a trade-in, they are offered good money for their trade-in is lying
2) I have bought several cars in the past on A-Plan, including a couple of ordered cars WITH a trade-in, and in either case was I never told that the price we agree upon for the trade is "subject to change". As long as there is no more excessive damage or changes to the vehicle (other then a few more miles on the odometer) at the time of the order, the quote I got is what I will get upon delivery of the new vehicle. They were simply giving themselves an out on the price we agreed upon, and I can almost guarantee that when the car came in, and I brought them my trade-in, they would of told me either they will give me considerably less, or not accept the trade-in at all.
3) If Ford doesn't respond, then fine, they don't have to, and honestly, I don't expect them to. However, a dealership is FORD'S representative (you can't go to Detroit and buy one from Henry Ford himself), so I would hope they would take an interest on what their dealers do to their reputation, for you hear and read other stories about people who have a bad experince buying a car. More often then not, they don't go to another dealer, they go another manufacture, for they are unaware that all dealers and salesman are not the same, and put the blame for their experience on the manuafacture.
4) I will take my business elsewhere, and you're right, I'll either sell the car myself or just keep it. It's just amazing that a dealership would treat someone like that, especially when the auto market (Ford included) is hurting as bad as it is.
5) How can you say that I'm "whining" that I didn't get my way? That's complete BS. There is nothing wrong with voicing an opinion, especially when dealing with a situation when you are getting ripped off, plain and simple. If you experienced what I did, I guarantee you would be ticked too.
6) If I were in their shoes, I would honor the price we agree to, it's just good business. However, I would put it in writing that if the trade-in comes in and has any more damage then it already has, or has excessively more mileage, then the deal is subject to re-negotiation. NEVER would I sell or buy ANYTHING like this without it being in writing. Why? Read #2 above.
7) The 2006 GT's are by far the best Mustang to roll out of Detroit in a very long time (and yes, I have owned several generations of them, and can honestly say that). But, I'm not interested in buying this car or any car for that matter when the deal is open-ended, and I can live without one and be just as happy. I'll just hold on to the Firebird a little longer and if/when I do decide to buy another, it will be without a trade-in, playing games with a dealer is not my idea of fun.
8) If the Firebird requires more then just a recharge, then fine. However, trying to rip me off $1400 is crap. I can replace the ENTIRE A/C system for less then that.
9) Any dealer not willing to sell ANY car on A-Plan price is not worthy of my business, it simply shows that they care less about their employees and only care about screwing their customers.
10) The bottom line is this: dealers of course like and want to make money on a sale of a new vehicle, the finance percentage rate you pay, the extended warranties etc. But let's be honest, dealers really make their money in the back in service, for as everyone knows, at some point you will need to bring it in for repair, whether it is in warranty or not, and charge you a hefty premium. Most people are willing to pay the costs for they were treated "fairly" at the point of sale, so they feel obligated to give the dealer their business, and have a warm-fuzzy feeling about the whole experience.
11-17-2005, 06:26 PM
#12
I ♥ Acer
Join Date: May 2004
Location:
Posts: 2,435
RE: Complaint Letter
You did have a bad experience but the trade in thing is fair as far as they can't guarentee what your car would be worth when your Mustang were to come in. Car values drop daily. As far as a discount goes, most dealers in my area are marking up the GTs. I paid sticker for mine but that just seems to be what these cars are going for now. Hopefully you find a dealer that will do you right and get you the car you want at a fair price for you and the dealer.
11-17-2005, 06:40 PM
#13
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3
RE: Complaint Letter
True, but I havn't bought a Ford in over 8 years, and first time back to Ford my dumb luck I pick a lousy dealer. Also, I understand that cars drop in value, but even in 12 weeks, it won't drop that much, but the fact that stung me is how I was told that they wouldn't put it in writing, either the price we agreed upon or the price with a disclaimer that the price will be what difference it drops from yesterday until the day I pick up the new one.
11-17-2005, 07:21 PM
#14
MF Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 3,441
RE: Complaint Letter
A lesson I learned from my father.
Always deal on cash price for the car your buying (Not payments)... once you have your "Deal" THEN and only then do you spring the "What would you give me for my car?" question.
Generally - if you deal with a trad in up front, the dealer just allocates into the price of the car your buying the cost of the car your trading and you never get as good a deal as you could have.
Writing to FORD about a dealership is an exercise in futility!... Ford doesn't care about the dealers. Dealers are independant and not beholding to Ford.
Always deal on cash price for the car your buying (Not payments)... once you have your "Deal" THEN and only then do you spring the "What would you give me for my car?" question.
Generally - if you deal with a trad in up front, the dealer just allocates into the price of the car your buying the cost of the car your trading and you never get as good a deal as you could have.
Writing to FORD about a dealership is an exercise in futility!... Ford doesn't care about the dealers. Dealers are independant and not beholding to Ford.
11-17-2005, 07:25 PM
#15
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 230
RE: Complaint Letter
I suppose I should feel fortunate that I ordered my 2006 GT for $500 over invoice. I just did it yesterday. I would never pay MSRP for a car, even the best stang ever produced, from any STEALERSHIP.
11-17-2005, 11:06 PM
#17
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: West Los Angeles
Posts: 5,390
RE: Complaint Letter
It's really important to remember a few things>>>
*Never discuss a trade-in until you have the price on the new car worked out! Breaking that rule set you up for a string of disappointments!
*You will NEVER EVER get what you'd like on a trade in! Write that one down in concrete in front of every dealership! They take the LOW blue book price and then deduct about $1500-2000 which they say they need to make up for the expense it'll take to offer the trade-in as a "certified" used car. This might be reasonable. There is so much competition for new cars today that used cars have go to be cherry. How much would it cost to get your trade-in into mint condition? Do it and then sell it as a private party!
I tried to remain unbiased and so I have to say that the dealer didn't have to sell you the hottest car in the market right now at A-Plan. They'd rather hold onto it and sell it for sticker, even if it takes a while.
They did screw up by not offering to place on order on a new Gt with yourt A-plan and then throwing in maybe a deal on some dealer-installed options.
Sorry your experience what so bad. Have you ever bought a Honda? They treated me great!
*Never discuss a trade-in until you have the price on the new car worked out! Breaking that rule set you up for a string of disappointments!
*You will NEVER EVER get what you'd like on a trade in! Write that one down in concrete in front of every dealership! They take the LOW blue book price and then deduct about $1500-2000 which they say they need to make up for the expense it'll take to offer the trade-in as a "certified" used car. This might be reasonable. There is so much competition for new cars today that used cars have go to be cherry. How much would it cost to get your trade-in into mint condition? Do it and then sell it as a private party!
I tried to remain unbiased and so I have to say that the dealer didn't have to sell you the hottest car in the market right now at A-Plan. They'd rather hold onto it and sell it for sticker, even if it takes a while.
They did screw up by not offering to place on order on a new Gt with yourt A-plan and then throwing in maybe a deal on some dealer-installed options.
Sorry your experience what so bad. Have you ever bought a Honda? They treated me great!
11-17-2005, 11:12 PM
#18
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 334
RE: Complaint Letter
First, I can understand and agree with the dealership about the trade-in. Nobody will ever guarantee you a trade-in value for a later date, even if it is for tomorrow.
Second, the dealer did indeed treat you like crap so you should take your business else where. It is obvious from their attitude they are not in the business to sell vehicles.
Third, do NOT give your business to ANY dealership that would refuse to sell even a GT at any Ford plan price. A sell, from an order, is a sell and the dealership losses absolutely NOTHING. The only kind of dealerships that would refuse to “order†you a GT on any Ford plan have no intentions of ever taking care of their customers nor do they care for repeat business. I can understand a dealership not wanting to sell a GT at one of the Ford plans that they have in stock but to refuse to order one just proves they are out to soak the customer.
There are “hundreds†of dealerships that are indeed willing to sale a GT at any of the Ford plans “if†you order it. I have 3 Ford dealers near me and all 3 told me they would order me a 2006 GT at X-plan price.
Call around and take your business to a true customer oriented dealership, one that accepts ALL Ford plans regardless of what the vehicle is, so long as the vehicle is eligible for one or more of the Ford plans. The GT is eligible for ALL Ford price plans.
It’s amazing how many dealerships, those that don’t accept Ford plans, stay in business since they don’t have any body with an education or degree in “business†at the dealership. If someone did have an education or degree in “business†they would know that customer satisfaction is what makes the dealership money, not soaking them…
Second, the dealer did indeed treat you like crap so you should take your business else where. It is obvious from their attitude they are not in the business to sell vehicles.
Third, do NOT give your business to ANY dealership that would refuse to sell even a GT at any Ford plan price. A sell, from an order, is a sell and the dealership losses absolutely NOTHING. The only kind of dealerships that would refuse to “order†you a GT on any Ford plan have no intentions of ever taking care of their customers nor do they care for repeat business. I can understand a dealership not wanting to sell a GT at one of the Ford plans that they have in stock but to refuse to order one just proves they are out to soak the customer.
There are “hundreds†of dealerships that are indeed willing to sale a GT at any of the Ford plans “if†you order it. I have 3 Ford dealers near me and all 3 told me they would order me a 2006 GT at X-plan price.
Call around and take your business to a true customer oriented dealership, one that accepts ALL Ford plans regardless of what the vehicle is, so long as the vehicle is eligible for one or more of the Ford plans. The GT is eligible for ALL Ford price plans.
It’s amazing how many dealerships, those that don’t accept Ford plans, stay in business since they don’t have any body with an education or degree in “business†at the dealership. If someone did have an education or degree in “business†they would know that customer satisfaction is what makes the dealership money, not soaking them…
11-18-2005, 12:54 AM
#19
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 737
RE: Complaint Letter
Car dealers are quickly leading themselves to extinction. Todays profit is all that matters, a customer is just another target.
Writing to Ford will NOT do ant good unless the dealer is doing unethical things with Ford. When I bought my F150, they offered a free oil change if I let them fill out my customer survey- well I changed my own oil, and bet they heard from Ford(hope so) from the 'comments' I attached to my survey- 'stuffing the ballot box' aint too cool.
Sooner or later the big three will have to realize who the customers are or go out of business...next to lawyers, I bet car dealers are 2nd most despised people in America- not all are bad, but enough are that they dont do the parent company any good- ford might as well sell direct. I do feel for dealers in one way- warranty repair rates are unfair to all concerned from what I hear- even the best dealers are getting kinda screwed on warranty work- especially techs- likely why it seems so hard to find a great service department.
If ford makes a quality mistake, why must the dealer take the hit for it?
When my car got smashed at delivery, I called fords customer care number trying to get some info on what to do, she put me on hold and called my dealer, told them she 'needed a number' to knock off the price...friggin stupid. Carrier did the damage, ford should have hit them up for the loss, instead they expected the dealer to eat it. that day I saw that dealer support is even worse than customer support... theres a lot of big problems in fords system- they have some really great people in certain areas, and some really neat products, but dealer network is riddled with bad guys, the communication between Ford and the dealer and the customer is all but non-existant.
Sooner or later hopefully ford will realize the guy financing this car for YEARS is the guy they need to keep happy- we buyers want someone accessible who cares AND can do something at fords end, reliable dealer service departments that WILL get reprimanded by Ford for not fixing it right the first time, dealers that are on equal footing- this way pricing leverage wont get the most sly dealers growth- customer satisfaction will.
Lastly, this allocation bull$hit on sold orders needs to go- Ive ranted for hours(I type slow) over at blueoval about this crap- look in the management thread/sold order priority sticky up top. Kzinti over there listed some great ideas about ordering, wish theyd make him at least a marketing consultant if not manager for north america...Currently some guys way up at ford appear to be wanting to change some stuff, know of at least one who believes scheduling all the retails first would be a good thing- my guess is that static from
big dealer networks would never stand for that though...ford needs to tell dealers to pound dirt- sales first, lot filling allocations later. Hopefully guys like him will win out and fix this little flaw in the system that has created many a upset customer.
Quit thinking of the dealer as the customer- this one thing is what has made buying a friggin car such a pain in the a$$.
Maybe Ford should just sell the cars like saturn- no price quibbling BS, all on equal ground, all else equal, customer service would equal growth- thats how it needs to be. Customers first, dealers are just delivery/service points- they should by franchise agreement be required to accept plan orders, be restricted from selling over sticker. If going to the dealer werent such a crappy experience, maybe theyd make more money in volume than by trying to bleed each and every customer for every penny possible. time will tell.
their long term survival will depend on if they realize it needs fixed.
Writing to Ford will NOT do ant good unless the dealer is doing unethical things with Ford. When I bought my F150, they offered a free oil change if I let them fill out my customer survey- well I changed my own oil, and bet they heard from Ford(hope so) from the 'comments' I attached to my survey- 'stuffing the ballot box' aint too cool.
Sooner or later the big three will have to realize who the customers are or go out of business...next to lawyers, I bet car dealers are 2nd most despised people in America- not all are bad, but enough are that they dont do the parent company any good- ford might as well sell direct. I do feel for dealers in one way- warranty repair rates are unfair to all concerned from what I hear- even the best dealers are getting kinda screwed on warranty work- especially techs- likely why it seems so hard to find a great service department.
If ford makes a quality mistake, why must the dealer take the hit for it?
When my car got smashed at delivery, I called fords customer care number trying to get some info on what to do, she put me on hold and called my dealer, told them she 'needed a number' to knock off the price...friggin stupid. Carrier did the damage, ford should have hit them up for the loss, instead they expected the dealer to eat it. that day I saw that dealer support is even worse than customer support... theres a lot of big problems in fords system- they have some really great people in certain areas, and some really neat products, but dealer network is riddled with bad guys, the communication between Ford and the dealer and the customer is all but non-existant.
Sooner or later hopefully ford will realize the guy financing this car for YEARS is the guy they need to keep happy- we buyers want someone accessible who cares AND can do something at fords end, reliable dealer service departments that WILL get reprimanded by Ford for not fixing it right the first time, dealers that are on equal footing- this way pricing leverage wont get the most sly dealers growth- customer satisfaction will.
Lastly, this allocation bull$hit on sold orders needs to go- Ive ranted for hours(I type slow) over at blueoval about this crap- look in the management thread/sold order priority sticky up top. Kzinti over there listed some great ideas about ordering, wish theyd make him at least a marketing consultant if not manager for north america...Currently some guys way up at ford appear to be wanting to change some stuff, know of at least one who believes scheduling all the retails first would be a good thing- my guess is that static from
big dealer networks would never stand for that though...ford needs to tell dealers to pound dirt- sales first, lot filling allocations later. Hopefully guys like him will win out and fix this little flaw in the system that has created many a upset customer.
Quit thinking of the dealer as the customer- this one thing is what has made buying a friggin car such a pain in the a$$.
Maybe Ford should just sell the cars like saturn- no price quibbling BS, all on equal ground, all else equal, customer service would equal growth- thats how it needs to be. Customers first, dealers are just delivery/service points- they should by franchise agreement be required to accept plan orders, be restricted from selling over sticker. If going to the dealer werent such a crappy experience, maybe theyd make more money in volume than by trying to bleed each and every customer for every penny possible. time will tell.
their long term survival will depend on if they realize it needs fixed.
11-18-2005, 01:08 AM
#20
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 378
RE: Complaint Letter
I thought it was interesting how hard the bookeeper who was doing the numbers/papers pushed the extended warrenty onto us. When figuring out payments and how long ...funny how you HAD to buy the extended warrenty if you went with the longest years. Anyway because she pushed certain interest rates and this warrenty stuff at us we said give us a chance to check our own bank and lets see what they come up with. Well the bank gave us a better interest and loan so went with our bank. First time I've ever heard we HAD to buy the extended warrenty to get the longer years loan even with excellent credit for 30 years!