351w Timing gear help.
04-06-2012, 09:20 PM
#1
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 337
351w Timing gear help.
Hi guys i'm in need of some help and was hoping someone could chime in.
I have a 351w that had a gear drive timing set. cam is a hydraulic flat tappet. I've taking the advice of some fellow forum members and ditched the gear drive for a cloyes double roller setup.
K i installed my lower crank gear no problem slide right on, but when i install my cam gear and torque down the cam bolt everything jams up motor wón't spin. Remove the cam bolt and everything is ok. So i'm assuming camshaft end play.
Now I had to cut my dowel pin to work with my new set up. As i was using the fuel pump eccentric before. I removed it now and using electric pump.
Now there was no spacer behind my cam gear as i have been reading there might be. I did though have a brass washer, which is installed.
I measure my old gear to new one and there is a noticeable difference. Now meantioning that when i install the old gear drive cam gear into the cam thrust plate it fits nicely inside.
where as my new cloyes gear is sloppy in the cam thrust plate. any thoughts or opinions?
What can i take material off of or what would you guys recommend to get more endplay?
Thx for any advice in advance.
I have a 351w that had a gear drive timing set. cam is a hydraulic flat tappet. I've taking the advice of some fellow forum members and ditched the gear drive for a cloyes double roller setup.
K i installed my lower crank gear no problem slide right on, but when i install my cam gear and torque down the cam bolt everything jams up motor wón't spin. Remove the cam bolt and everything is ok. So i'm assuming camshaft end play.
Now I had to cut my dowel pin to work with my new set up. As i was using the fuel pump eccentric before. I removed it now and using electric pump.
Now there was no spacer behind my cam gear as i have been reading there might be. I did though have a brass washer, which is installed.
I measure my old gear to new one and there is a noticeable difference. Now meantioning that when i install the old gear drive cam gear into the cam thrust plate it fits nicely inside.
where as my new cloyes gear is sloppy in the cam thrust plate. any thoughts or opinions?
What can i take material off of or what would you guys recommend to get more endplay?
Thx for any advice in advance.
Last edited by Ze2222; 04-06-2012 at 09:31 PM.
04-08-2012, 09:38 PM
#3
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 337
Hi. Sorry about that. I tried to be as clear as possible. I took some pictures and will better describe my problem lol sorry.
Basically once i have my timing gears on (center cam bolt not installed) motor spins freely.
But when i torque the center cam bolt to spec. Motor jams up. I can't even spin it. I'm thinking camshaft endplay well for lack of i mean.
Motor previously had a direct gear drive make unknown. Hope this helps clarify anything. If i missed something plz let me know i'll clarify. Kind of stuck at this point.
Basically once i have my timing gears on (center cam bolt not installed) motor spins freely.
But when i torque the center cam bolt to spec. Motor jams up. I can't even spin it. I'm thinking camshaft endplay well for lack of i mean.
Motor previously had a direct gear drive make unknown. Hope this helps clarify anything. If i missed something plz let me know i'll clarify. Kind of stuck at this point.
04-08-2012, 09:46 PM
#4
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 337
Sorry for all the question guys, this is my first gas performance engine. I've rebuilt diesel engines but none performance. Anyways on pics 302 and 303 you can see the cam endplate over the cam gear.
One pic is the cam endplate over my cloyes double roller cam gear and its sloppy inside.
Other pic is the cam endplate over the geardrive cam gear and it fits nicely into the cam endplate. Sorry if my terminology isn't up to par. Is it surpose to be sloppy?
Due I need to grind some off the cam end plate or cam gear to get more endplay? Should there be a spacer or am i just doing something retarded lol.
Also on a side note. I had to use a gear puller and heat to get crank pulley off. The new cloyes on slides on with some pushing. It doesn't have to be a pressed fit as well does it?
sry if the pics are not that good. taking from iphone.
One pic is the cam endplate over my cloyes double roller cam gear and its sloppy inside.
Other pic is the cam endplate over the geardrive cam gear and it fits nicely into the cam endplate. Sorry if my terminology isn't up to par. Is it surpose to be sloppy?
Due I need to grind some off the cam end plate or cam gear to get more endplay? Should there be a spacer or am i just doing something retarded lol.
Also on a side note. I had to use a gear puller and heat to get crank pulley off. The new cloyes on slides on with some pushing. It doesn't have to be a pressed fit as well does it?
sry if the pics are not that good. taking from iphone.
04-09-2012, 12:10 AM
#5
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Arizona
Posts: 4,103
Are you using the 2 thin head bolts to hold the plate on?
There should be 2 thin head bolts that hold the plate on, if you are trying to use regular bolts everything will jam up.
BTW, it shouldn't have taken heat/puller to get that crank gear off. I think something was burred up on the crank.........
There should be 2 thin head bolts that hold the plate on, if you are trying to use regular bolts everything will jam up.
BTW, it shouldn't have taken heat/puller to get that crank gear off. I think something was burred up on the crank.........
06-27-2012, 11:47 AM
#9
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1
Ze2222 I saw this post as I was browsing through searching for some info on gear drives and I joined the forum to try and help with your problem.
Sometimes the thrust plates are out of tolerance and need surface ground to keep them from binding with different timing sets. Check it with a micrometer, I had one that bound up when I torqued the new cam gear on, I measured it and it read .2515" I ground it to .2942" and it spun free. Also, you should check to make sure your little bronze spacer doesn't have any burs on it, and make sure you grease that bronze spacer before installation so it doesn't gall up on you.
Any local industrial machine shop should have a surface grinder to bring that down to size for you.
I'm not sure if that was your problem or not but i hope this helps!
Sometimes the thrust plates are out of tolerance and need surface ground to keep them from binding with different timing sets. Check it with a micrometer, I had one that bound up when I torqued the new cam gear on, I measured it and it read .2515" I ground it to .2942" and it spun free. Also, you should check to make sure your little bronze spacer doesn't have any burs on it, and make sure you grease that bronze spacer before installation so it doesn't gall up on you.
Any local industrial machine shop should have a surface grinder to bring that down to size for you.
I'm not sure if that was your problem or not but i hope this helps!
07-25-2012, 11:38 AM
#10
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Indy
Posts: 1,353
No, no one looks in here lol. We're kinda on our own. My stroker had the same issue and it turned out to be the bolts. I literally went to Lowes and got the strongest grade 8 bolts they had, they work fine. Just don't be like me and over torque the bolts. Drill/tapping that hole was a mess
