hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
01-07-2007, 06:36 PM
#1
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hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
So i was kinda crunching numbers in my head last night while i was laying in bed and i came to the conclusion that for these cars, the n/a situation really isn't that bad of a way to go. It is safe to say that mid 14's are attainable with just bolt ons. Now say you are at about 200rwhp with simple bolt ons and a tune, and what...220rwtq? now we haven't gotten solid info on how much heads and cams will do for us here, but gash on the collective forums said with JUST his p&p heads he saw considerably more than 20rwhp on top of his i think he had what 194 or something like that...and he is auto i beleive. and then he continued to say that the hp improvements were impressive but the torque improvements were FAR more impressive, so lets say (and this is being conservative) he saw 30rwtq. Now this would put him around 215-220rwhp and 250-260rwtq. That could easily put a 4.0 in low 14's or high 13's. Now from there, gash did not even get cams. let's say another 10rwhp (maybe a bit more) for some nice, not too extreme cams, and maybe another 10rwtq(for a total of about 230rwhp and maybe 270rwtq). so now we have what should definately be a high 13 sec 4.0 (with gears and an lsd/locker and maybe some lca's and a bit of other launching stuff). Now crunching the numbers, some nice ported and polished heads should cost around 1k. Then with some cams from say, delk for i think they want 380 and some springs and supporting mods...lets say 1500 for p&p along with cams and supporting parts, then 1k for install from what the guys that have done the install have said...that's 2500, then add an intake/tune for about 3k total (lca's, gears/locker/lsd would be needed, but you would want to do this stuff with a blower too so we are gonna say 4k total for everything you would want, maybe a little bit more.) so we have 4k for probably a high 13 second 4.0 vs a mid-high 13 sec 4.0 from say the x-charger or the lower boosting blowers (not the hi-po's) which will mostly run mid-high 13's. those systems cost near 4k without locker/lsd and gears, so throw on another 500 if you install yourself which MOST don't so let's say another 700-800 bucks. so total for a high 13 sec 4.0, as far as i can see right now, it seems that going n/a would be the way to go. Now remember, this is all just speculation, but the way i see it, if these gains hold true, this is the way to go for me and some others as i don't need a low 13/12 sec car and i want to maintain MAXIMUM reliability while modding....throw in some input guys.
edit: forgot to add, there is the possibility of a stroker kit down the road with this option too or even just going with higher cr pistons.
edit: forgot to add, there is the possibility of a stroker kit down the road with this option too or even just going with higher cr pistons.
01-07-2007, 07:05 PM
#3
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
this is really starting to get to my head because the projected numbers from what gash said and what would most likely be the outcome would put you around the power numbers of a new edge gt which runs real low 14's. with shorter gearing, and some suspension work that would pretty much tell us that a 4.0 with this kind of power would easily hit 13's....i just wish gash could actually release numbers with his p&p instead of just being able to say "over 20rwhp and even more torque."
01-07-2007, 07:19 PM
#4
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
ORIGINAL: 8cd03gro
So i was kinda crunching numbers in my head last night while i was laying in bed and i came to the conclusion that for these cars, the n/a situation really isn't that bad of a way to go. It is safe to say that mid 14's are attainable with just bolt ons. Now say you are at about 200rwhp with simple bolt ons and a tune, and what...220rwtq? now we haven't gotten solid info on how much heads and cams will do for us here, but gash on the collective forums said with JUST his p&p heads he saw considerably more than 20rwhp on top of his i think he had what 194 or something like that...and he is auto i beleive. and then he continued to say that the hp improvements were impressive but the torque improvements were FAR more impressive, so lets say (and this is being conservative) he saw 30rwtq. Now this would put him around 215-220rwhp and 250-260rwtq. That could easily put a 4.0 in low 14's or high 13's. Now from there, gash did not even get cams. let's say another 10rwhp (maybe a bit more) for some nice, not too extreme cams, and maybe another 10rwtq(for a total of about 230rwhp and maybe 270rwtq). so now we have what should definately be a high 13 sec 4.0 (with gears and an lsd/locker and maybe some lca's and a bit of other launching stuff). Now crunching the numbers, some nice ported and polished heads should cost around 1k. Then with some cams from say, delk for i think they want 380 and some springs and supporting mods...lets say 1500 for p&p along with cams and supporting parts, then 1k for install from what the guys that have done the install have said...that's 2500, then add an intake/tune for about 3k total (lca's, gears/locker/lsd would be needed, but you would want to do this stuff with a blower too so we are gonna say 4k total for everything you would want, maybe a little bit more.) so we have 4k for probably a high 13 second 4.0 vs a mid-high 13 sec 4.0 from say the x-charger or the lower boosting blowers (not the hi-po's) which will mostly run mid-high 13's. those systems cost near 4k without locker/lsd and gears, so throw on another 500 if you install yourself which MOST don't so let's say another 700-800 bucks. so total for a high 13 sec 4.0, as far as i can see right now, it seems that going n/a would be the way to go. Now remember, this is all just speculation, but the way i see it, if these gains hold true, this is the way to go for me and some others as i don't need a low 13/12 sec car and i want to maintain MAXIMUM reliability while modding....throw in some input guys.
edit: forgot to add, there is the possibility of a stroker kit down the road with this option too or even just going with higher cr pistons.
So i was kinda crunching numbers in my head last night while i was laying in bed and i came to the conclusion that for these cars, the n/a situation really isn't that bad of a way to go. It is safe to say that mid 14's are attainable with just bolt ons. Now say you are at about 200rwhp with simple bolt ons and a tune, and what...220rwtq? now we haven't gotten solid info on how much heads and cams will do for us here, but gash on the collective forums said with JUST his p&p heads he saw considerably more than 20rwhp on top of his i think he had what 194 or something like that...and he is auto i beleive. and then he continued to say that the hp improvements were impressive but the torque improvements were FAR more impressive, so lets say (and this is being conservative) he saw 30rwtq. Now this would put him around 215-220rwhp and 250-260rwtq. That could easily put a 4.0 in low 14's or high 13's. Now from there, gash did not even get cams. let's say another 10rwhp (maybe a bit more) for some nice, not too extreme cams, and maybe another 10rwtq(for a total of about 230rwhp and maybe 270rwtq). so now we have what should definately be a high 13 sec 4.0 (with gears and an lsd/locker and maybe some lca's and a bit of other launching stuff). Now crunching the numbers, some nice ported and polished heads should cost around 1k. Then with some cams from say, delk for i think they want 380 and some springs and supporting mods...lets say 1500 for p&p along with cams and supporting parts, then 1k for install from what the guys that have done the install have said...that's 2500, then add an intake/tune for about 3k total (lca's, gears/locker/lsd would be needed, but you would want to do this stuff with a blower too so we are gonna say 4k total for everything you would want, maybe a little bit more.) so we have 4k for probably a high 13 second 4.0 vs a mid-high 13 sec 4.0 from say the x-charger or the lower boosting blowers (not the hi-po's) which will mostly run mid-high 13's. those systems cost near 4k without locker/lsd and gears, so throw on another 500 if you install yourself which MOST don't so let's say another 700-800 bucks. so total for a high 13 sec 4.0, as far as i can see right now, it seems that going n/a would be the way to go. Now remember, this is all just speculation, but the way i see it, if these gains hold true, this is the way to go for me and some others as i don't need a low 13/12 sec car and i want to maintain MAXIMUM reliability while modding....throw in some input guys.
edit: forgot to add, there is the possibility of a stroker kit down the road with this option too or even just going with higher cr pistons.
So if this is what you want I would go for it you would be the first going this complete route N.A.
01-07-2007, 07:25 PM
#5
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
im gonna try and squeeze some relative torque gains out of gash when the collective forums are back up, and if they are close to what i am looking for i am going to start.
01-07-2007, 08:06 PM
#7
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
http://www.mustangcollective.com/showthread.php?t=4982
check out flapjack. he has heads/cams from supersixmotorsports along with a procharger at 12psi. he made 364rwhp before heads and cams (holy ****!) and he said the difference was VERY noticable and he thinks it will be over 400rwhp. i guess his car is daily driven too, so if done right, it seems safe on the 4.0
check out flapjack. he has heads/cams from supersixmotorsports along with a procharger at 12psi. he made 364rwhp before heads and cams (holy ****!) and he said the difference was VERY noticable and he thinks it will be over 400rwhp. i guess his car is daily driven too, so if done right, it seems safe on the 4.0
01-08-2007, 12:22 AM
#8
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
u usually dont gain as much torque as u do HP on cams/heads just fyi, i know the real numbers, u are close on rwhp, but quite off on rwtq (hes on a mustang dyno too)
01-08-2007, 12:30 AM
#9
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
ORIGINAL: fazm
u usually dont gain as much torque as u do HP on cams/heads just fyi, i know the real numbers, u are close on rwhp, but quite off on rwtq (hes on a mustang dyno too)
u usually dont gain as much torque as u do HP on cams/heads just fyi, i know the real numbers, u are close on rwhp, but quite off on rwtq (hes on a mustang dyno too)
man even matthw from delk performance thinks with a proper head/cam package which he says he will do if someone wants him to, could make clost to 260. that is ****ing insane even if he is 10-15rwhp high. and
01-08-2007, 06:31 PM
#10
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RE: hmmm n/a build is starting to look good.
Someone at a local performance shop had the heads and cams done on his and the mechanic at the shop that did the install and dyno tune on in said they were able to get between 255 rwhp and 260 rwhp out of it. He didn't say how much torque though. I plan on going that route at some point, hopefully this spring. Later on in February or March I'm going to be getting all the details on the heads and cams install along with hp and tq numbers from t he performance shop before deciding on whether or not to do it this spring. I'll post the details then.