Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE* - Page 2 - MustangForums.com

Go Back  MustangForums.com > Ford Mustang Tech > 4.6L (1996-2004 Modular) Mustang
Reload this Page >

Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

Notices
4.6L (1996-2004 Modular) Mustang Technical discussions on 1996-2004 4.6 Liter Modular Motors (2V and 4V) within.

Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

Reply

 
 
 
Old 10-25-2006, 09:57 AM
  #11  
xxkazp3rxx
6th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 5,893
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

I don't know who told you that, but they were mistaken. Gears in NO way effect your hp/tor ratings. All gears do is dictate how that power is supplied. You dyno a car in 4th gear with the 1:1 ratio, and they all run the same, regardless of the final gear ratio. There has been a lot of people that lose low end torque with cams, but a lot can be made up with a tune. I will say though, those numbers are ridiculous for basically a stock 4.6 2v. I think either you have the best tuner this side of the world, or there's something in that motor you don't know about.[&:]
ORIGINAL: Miliock

cams ususally take some torque no? I have a friend that has a full bolt on 01 GT. LTs, exhaust, intake, tb, plenum, etc. He put VT stage 1 cams in and loss some torque. With 4.30s (anything over 3.73 you lose #s on the dyno) he put down 295.6 rwhp (just a predator tune)....I don't remember the torque off hand, but I know he had a decent amount less with the cams. Car has gone 12.5 with rear seat delete.
xxkazp3rxx is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2006, 10:01 AM
  #12  
xxkazp3rxx
6th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 5,893
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

With a good set of cams, and those upgrades you can see 300rwhp... If you're going to do headers you would want longtubes - shorties don't really do much. Although, I don't think headers are worth it, unless you're doing the install. I think it should be the last mod you do. Are you planning to put a blower on it? You could take the $1200.00 you would spend on a new midpipe, headers, install and a new tune - and throw a small shot of nitrous on it, if you like playing with nitrous (75 shot maybe). Could also take that same $1200.00 and take your 285-295rwhp car (which is what you'd have), and buy some suspension and run a better time then someone without the suspension and 320rwhp. Just some food for thought.
ORIGINAL: scubasteve20

Eventually I'd like to see 300 rwhp and around 340 rwtq, I'm thinking cams,TB, plenum, UDP's, true CAI and shorties should get me there. What do y'all think??? I really want to keep it N/A... any suggestions? Thanks to all who provided insight on this project.

Steve
xxkazp3rxx is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2006, 01:44 PM
  #13  
Dan04COBRA
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location:
Posts: 14,917
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

I would put money on not seeing 300rwhp on a properly loaded dyno. Cams won't do much of anything for your peak HP or TQ, they will do their magic on flattening your HP & TQ curve. As for someone saying you might lose TQ with cams = no way. It'll move your torque's powerband around and could give someone the illusion that they lost TQ, when infact they have nearly 20-30ft lbs of torque in certain area's than before.

If you simply swapped a PI motor and made those numbers and actually DON'T have a 96-98 shortblock, then I would say it's safe to say your dyno run wasn't loaded properly &/or they inflated the numbers a bit. Without head work, you just won't see 300rwhp in the bottlenecked 2v heads, sorry.
Dan04COBRA is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2006, 06:30 AM
  #14  
scubasteve20
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location:
Posts: 41
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

Well, I actually did have a very good tuner. He worked on the 1012 rwhp GT TT posted in another section and does ~3-4 tunes in an average day. I beleive his dyno is fairly accurate and I'm 99% sure the motor is stock, I put it in myself and went over it with a fine tooth comb and nothing looked like it had been apart. If my numbers are right, I would love to know what is responsible for the power increase. The tune was with 93 octane but it still doesn't really add up to me. Let's see... 260 + ~10 exhaust + 2 K&N + ~20 good, high octane tune with good air quality= 292 * .85 for drivetrain loss = 248 rwhp. Maybe it does add up, I'm guesstimating on the above #'s but I can see how it's possible. What am I doing wrong? IDK. I appreciate everyone's inputs and suggestions,

Steve
scubasteve20 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2006, 12:34 PM
  #15  
xxkazp3rxx
6th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 5,893
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

Definatly over estimating your midpipe and catback, maybe 5rwhp. Except for the tune, your car is basically stock. The tune will add some power, but other then that. You should put with 5-10rwhp of a stock motor. I don't think i've ever seen a real life dyno show more then that on a basically stock motor (just a tune). I think if he really did pull that much power out of a stock 4.6 PI motor with just a tune, intake, midpipe and catback - EVERY GT owner should be going there. Also remember, he may be a great tuner, especially if he was the shop working on Joes TT GT (I love how everyone talks baout him like we know him lol), but everyone can make mistakes.
xxkazp3rxx is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2006, 02:55 PM
  #16  
red2k1gt
5th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: fl
Posts: 2,485
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

I've had my car dynoed there too and when i compared the #'s to another place when i had the exact same mods, I magically gained 10 rwhp. Speaking of the TT GT...have you seen the new #'s on his car?! Up to 1181rwhp now on 27.5psi. BTW Im in jacksonville too
red2k1gt is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2006, 03:48 PM
  #17  
2000GT4.6
6th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12,575
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*


ORIGINAL: amoosenamedhank

ORIGINAL: newb2000GT


ORIGINAL: amoosenamedhank

I'm by no means calling you a liar and I know my car is a little down on torque for some reason. I just don't get how with an almost stock car you make those numbers and I have a full bolt on car with cams and your actually making more torque then I am?

A little down? I would say you are way down on torque. Are you running a '96 motor in your '96? If so, I think your non-PI vs. his PI would be a significant difference. My PI ran 251 rwhp/288 rwtq on a Mustang Dyno with exhaust (X, catabck, no headers), JLT, and Steeda UDP's as a baseline before my SC install. You also need to rememeber that the same model dyno will read different numbers in different conditions.
I am using my 96 short block with a pi swap and shm stage 1 cams. I really don't get why I'm so low on torque compared to most peoples cars. I see mild bolt on gt's that have as much torque as I do. I really hope it's just the differences in the dyno otherwise I've been spending a lot of money for nothing. I guess all my torque problems will be fixed when i get the 5.4 up and running though
With boltons/cams I was only making 280 WHP but 292 WTQ, down from 302~ WTQ.

But that was with a terrible tune. The a/f was real lean down there, and the timing was screwed up. You should not loose much if any peak tq (or under the curve) with the stage 2s. A little, but not much.

Origninal poster: No chance on anything close to an accurate dynojet will ya make 300 WHP with shorties/exhaust/intake stuff and a set of cams. Shorties are nearly worthless on a n/a 2v GT. I have seen a couple of GTs making 29x with boltons/cams, but they are mostly flukes. Most people make around 285 to 290 with that setup.

For just having a x, catback, and a K&N your numbers are kinda high, even with a tune. I would say the dyno you are on is off a little, but not really that much. I can see a tune/midpipe/catback/filter making 15-20 WHP with a little luck and a good starting motor.
2000GT4.6 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2006, 06:03 PM
  #18  
newb2000GT
4th Gear Member
 
newb2000GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,093
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

On topic but in another direction: Why does everyone say "I really want to keep it NA"?

Does this mean they can't afford a power adder or is it some cult thing I am unaware of and they truly want to be slower? I guess if I had money to burn I would play around (reads: blow tons of cash) and see how much I can make on a NA 2V motor that has proven to have poor flowing heads and won't make a whole lot of power. Let's see, do I want the fastest NA muscle car that beats Hondas or the slowest SC'd car that beats LS1's? Hmmm, not really a tough choice in my book.

The reason I ask is that I started doing bolt-ons and realized I was not going to get anywhere near my goal of low to mid 300 hp range. So I stopped wasting money on bolt-ons and put the money into a blower. I've surpassed my goal and I'm enjoying it. In a year or two I will take the next step and go into the motor and see what happens.

Just always wondered why everyone wants to stay NA...
newb2000GT is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2006, 05:39 AM
  #19  
scubasteve20
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location:
Posts: 41
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*

Hmmm... This is getting kinda interresting. First off, I'm really not too concerned about how much the dyno says I'm getting, accurate or not. I'm much happier with the car now and it's a lot more fun. As far as keeping it N/A, I guess I would just like to have a fairly quick car without a power adder. Just personal preference. If somehow I could get close to 300 rwhp that would be great! I've done lots of engine work but this is the first 4.6 I've ever been inside of so I'm taking inputs from y'all as to what works & what doesn't. All I'm hearing so far is that it CAN'T be done... Is there anyone who knows how it CAN (reasonably)? I've even considered building up a stroker from the old block. Am I just dreaming??[X(] Thanks again for the input,

Steve
scubasteve20 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2006, 04:39 PM
  #20  
droptoppony
5th Gear Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 2,489
Default RE: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*


ORIGINAL: xxkazp3rxx

Definatly over estimating your midpipe and catback, maybe 5rwhp.
Aftermarket midpipes alone are worth 8-10rwhp on 96-98's! They come stock with 6 cat midpipes that are extremely restrictive. The 99-04 had a much better stock setup.
The numbers look about right to me with the dyno tune.
droptoppony is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Motor swap/dyno tune numbers *UPDATE*


Advertising
Featured Sponsors
Vendor Directory

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.