s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
11-27-2006, 07:44 PM
#1
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s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
Hi all,
I've been looking at alot of blower web sites, and I have a question. When they say a blower will produce X hp, they mean on a stock car. correct? If the car has ported heads and blower cams, wiil the blower be able to produce more hp now that it does not have to work as hard pushing the air through the bigger port/valves?
example if the FRPP blower is rated @ 55hp/6psi 100hp/9psi on a stock 98 motor, would those nums increase if the same blower was used with ported heads and blower cams?
As always any info will be appreciated
I've been looking at alot of blower web sites, and I have a question. When they say a blower will produce X hp, they mean on a stock car. correct? If the car has ported heads and blower cams, wiil the blower be able to produce more hp now that it does not have to work as hard pushing the air through the bigger port/valves?
example if the FRPP blower is rated @ 55hp/6psi 100hp/9psi on a stock 98 motor, would those nums increase if the same blower was used with ported heads and blower cams?
As always any info will be appreciated
11-27-2006, 07:56 PM
#2
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
anything that is going to let the car breathe more is going to help the engine and teh blower will make more power propotionately. after i had cams, tb/pl, full exhaust, the non-cooled V2 with the stock pulley added an extra 135rw on a conservative tune, which is right about adding 50%, which i beleive vortech says it will. So a stock sc should be good for x %, and the better your engine breathes the more that % will be if you can follow me. Stock 02 gt was 225 rw, then 50% added due to the blower would be 337 rw which is believeable. Before i put my blower on, it dynoed at 272ish, then the blower went on and it is 405ish (again pretty conservative tune out here for the heat til i can cool it). so that percentage is the same, but 50% of 272 is more than 50% of 225 obviously. not sure if that helped 
11-27-2006, 07:58 PM
#3
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
yes but not by extraordinary numbers...The heads would promote more and better flow, the aggressive cams would allow more time for boost to enter the combustion chamber and reworked heads would promote a cleaner burn...not sure on the actual hp differences, but it does promote better efficiency
11-27-2006, 08:03 PM
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
ORIGINAL: ponysnake99
yes but not by extraordinary numbers...The heads would promote more and better flow, the aggressive cams would allow more time for boost to enter the combustion chamber and reworked heads would promote a cleaner burn...not sure on the actual hp differences, but it does promote better efficiency
yes but not by extraordinary numbers...The heads would promote more and better flow, the aggressive cams would allow more time for boost to enter the combustion chamber and reworked heads would promote a cleaner burn...not sure on the actual hp differences, but it does promote better efficiency
11-27-2006, 08:09 PM
#5
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
yes I uderstand exactly,you explained it very well, the higher you are hp wise before a blower, the higher the total will be at the same %.
But it seems that mostly centris' use %, the roots/screw types use actual hp nums. EX. Kenne bell says 160 hp increase on blah blah blah. Frpp says 55 hp on stock motor. Is 55hp a percentage of the stock 200 hp? Or will it only add 55 hp no matter what the starting hp is?
My thinking is that it is a percentage, and will be higher as hp increases due to heads cams etc. But I could be wrong, it happened once a very,very long time ago
But it seems that mostly centris' use %, the roots/screw types use actual hp nums. EX. Kenne bell says 160 hp increase on blah blah blah. Frpp says 55 hp on stock motor. Is 55hp a percentage of the stock 200 hp? Or will it only add 55 hp no matter what the starting hp is?
My thinking is that it is a percentage, and will be higher as hp increases due to heads cams etc. But I could be wrong, it happened once a very,very long time ago
11-27-2006, 08:10 PM
#6
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
+1...im curious to see if duration is the key to good supercharger cams, because air will fill a void (that whole physics idea)...so wether or not it opens .450 or .550 would not be as relevent/see as much hp as say 30 degrees of intake duration[&:]
11-27-2006, 08:22 PM
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
ORIGINAL: Armydad
But it seems that mostly centris' use %, the roots/screw types use actual hp nums. EX. Kenne bell says 160 hp increase on blah blah blah. Frpp says 55 hp on stock motor. Is 55hp a percentage of the stock 200 hp? Or will it only add 55 hp no matter what the starting hp is?
But it seems that mostly centris' use %, the roots/screw types use actual hp nums. EX. Kenne bell says 160 hp increase on blah blah blah. Frpp says 55 hp on stock motor. Is 55hp a percentage of the stock 200 hp? Or will it only add 55 hp no matter what the starting hp is?
. That would imply that it acts indepently of the engine. Maybe that is where efficiencies come in and such. Maybe someone who knows can chime in, now you have my curiosity.
11-27-2006, 08:29 PM
#8
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
The tune has a lot to do with the claims of 50% etc. 7.5psi is approximatly 50% as standard pressure is 14.7lbs./"^2(square inch. Take the same motor and run it at 7.5 psi and have one tune at 15* timing advance and the Air Fuel Ratio on the rich side, say 10.5:1 on 93 octane. Then change the tune to 20* advance with the AFR at 11.3:1 and you will make more power with the 2nd tune. Same tune and 50% more. Repeated runs with a non IC system would see the power drop off until properly cooled.
The cams I ran with a boosted motor(turbo) added a lot of power but also raised the power range to a higher rpm range. By the time I had made 3 cam changes and added a Sheet Metal intake with a large turbo the motor did not start to pull until 4500 and didn't really kick until 6000 and then it was a rocket and shift point was 8500rpm's.
I happen to like the KB SC's and if I get that far they are whose SC I would get. 40% on a stock motor so the typical motor with the bolt ons I have should make 400crank HP which is enough for the stock internals as I would not want to push it. Same with the tune. I would run a conservative tune. Boost is addicting to those with a history of abuse as I ended up running 30psi with a DD requiring at least 100 octane unleaded or a mix of 93 and 112 leaded. I would leave the tuning to the guys selling the SC, at least the KB folks as they provide a new chip for the EEC I blelieve. The gains can be amazing.
To see some times of these 2.0Liter motors go to ww.dsmtimes.org
The cams I ran with a boosted motor(turbo) added a lot of power but also raised the power range to a higher rpm range. By the time I had made 3 cam changes and added a Sheet Metal intake with a large turbo the motor did not start to pull until 4500 and didn't really kick until 6000 and then it was a rocket and shift point was 8500rpm's.
I happen to like the KB SC's and if I get that far they are whose SC I would get. 40% on a stock motor so the typical motor with the bolt ons I have should make 400crank HP which is enough for the stock internals as I would not want to push it. Same with the tune. I would run a conservative tune. Boost is addicting to those with a history of abuse as I ended up running 30psi with a DD requiring at least 100 octane unleaded or a mix of 93 and 112 leaded. I would leave the tuning to the guys selling the SC, at least the KB folks as they provide a new chip for the EEC I blelieve. The gains can be amazing.
To see some times of these 2.0Liter motors go to ww.dsmtimes.org
11-27-2006, 09:07 PM
#9
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RE: s/c efficiency related to head/motor mods ?
ORIGINAL: sweet99
The tune has a lot to do with the claims of 50% etc. 7.5psi is approximatly 50% as standard pressure is 14.7lbs./"^2(square inch. Take the same motor and run it at 7.5 psi and have one tune at 15* timing advance and the Air Fuel Ratio on the rich side, say 10.5:1 on 93 octane. Then change the tune to 20* advance with the AFR at 11.3:1 and you will make more power with the 2nd tune. Same tune and 50% more. Repeated runs with a non IC system would see the power drop off until properly cooled.
The cams I ran with a boosted motor(turbo) added a lot of power but also raised the power range to a higher rpm range. By the time I had made 3 cam changes and added a Sheet Metal intake with a large turbo the motor did not start to pull until 4500 and didn't really kick until 6000 and then it was a rocket and shift point was 8500rpm's.
I happen to like the KB SC's and if I get that far they are whose SC I would get. 40% on a stock motor so the typical motor with the bolt ons I have should make 400crank HP which is enough for the stock internals as I would not want to push it. Same with the tune. I would run a conservative tune. Boost is addicting to those with a history of abuse as I ended up running 30psi with a DD requiring at least 100 octane unleaded or a mix of 93 and 112 leaded. I would leave the tuning to the guys selling the SC, at least the KB folks as they provide a new chip for the EEC I blelieve. The gains can be amazing.
To see some times of these 2.0Liter motors go to ww.dsmtimes.org
The tune has a lot to do with the claims of 50% etc. 7.5psi is approximatly 50% as standard pressure is 14.7lbs./"^2(square inch. Take the same motor and run it at 7.5 psi and have one tune at 15* timing advance and the Air Fuel Ratio on the rich side, say 10.5:1 on 93 octane. Then change the tune to 20* advance with the AFR at 11.3:1 and you will make more power with the 2nd tune. Same tune and 50% more. Repeated runs with a non IC system would see the power drop off until properly cooled.
The cams I ran with a boosted motor(turbo) added a lot of power but also raised the power range to a higher rpm range. By the time I had made 3 cam changes and added a Sheet Metal intake with a large turbo the motor did not start to pull until 4500 and didn't really kick until 6000 and then it was a rocket and shift point was 8500rpm's.
I happen to like the KB SC's and if I get that far they are whose SC I would get. 40% on a stock motor so the typical motor with the bolt ons I have should make 400crank HP which is enough for the stock internals as I would not want to push it. Same with the tune. I would run a conservative tune. Boost is addicting to those with a history of abuse as I ended up running 30psi with a DD requiring at least 100 octane unleaded or a mix of 93 and 112 leaded. I would leave the tuning to the guys selling the SC, at least the KB folks as they provide a new chip for the EEC I blelieve. The gains can be amazing.
To see some times of these 2.0Liter motors go to ww.dsmtimes.org
The question is easier to ask this way
If I have an engine rated at 225hp stock and I add the FRPP blower and I now have 275HP ( It's rated +55hp on a stock 98)
If I then take the heads and port them and add blower cams, and now have 260 HP (no blower)
Heres the question - When I put the FRPP blower back on will it only add 55hp as rated and give me 315hp,OR will it add more due to the increased ports, valves, and cams.