RICE IN MY TREMEC!!!!
02-21-2007, 03:40 PM
#1
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Deerfield, VA
Posts: 674
RICE IN MY TREMEC!!!!
I just got my Mustang back from Ford, had the tranny re-done under warranty for gear clash in 2nd and 3rd. Here's what they did: Installed the Ford "upgrade kit" which included new synchros, shift forks and shafts, and they replaced ALL the bearings in the box. Here's the surprise, The mainshaft bearings, which are big tapered roller units, WERE TOAST! As I was talking to the lead Tech who did my car, he showed me the bearings, I was amazed! The bearing surface was severely deteriorated, like the tranny was run dry, which wasn't the case. My car has 27K miles on it, and for the most part is babied. (I'm 51)
I look atthe bearing, it says "MADE IN JAPAN"!!! I'm amazed they are still using Japanese bearings in their vehicles, I owneed two Fords in the '80's with similar manual transmission issues, and yes, the bearings that failed were Japanese! My father the old WWII vet and tool and die maker had told me years ago, that one of the biggest failures in Japanese machines was their bearings, it appears their steel is not the best quality, and their heat-treating is inconsistent, AMAZING HUH?So they are still at it. Just makes you want to run out and buy a Civic or Corrola huh? BTW, my tranny shifts AMAZING now, better than when I first bought it with 5K miles. BTW, if you ever try to rebuild one of these Tremec 3650 boxes, you will need a 5 point, security Torx bit, size T-45. Good luck finding one!
John
I look atthe bearing, it says "MADE IN JAPAN"!!! I'm amazed they are still using Japanese bearings in their vehicles, I owneed two Fords in the '80's with similar manual transmission issues, and yes, the bearings that failed were Japanese! My father the old WWII vet and tool and die maker had told me years ago, that one of the biggest failures in Japanese machines was their bearings, it appears their steel is not the best quality, and their heat-treating is inconsistent, AMAZING HUH?So they are still at it. Just makes you want to run out and buy a Civic or Corrola huh? BTW, my tranny shifts AMAZING now, better than when I first bought it with 5K miles. BTW, if you ever try to rebuild one of these Tremec 3650 boxes, you will need a 5 point, security Torx bit, size T-45. Good luck finding one!
John
02-21-2007, 05:18 PM
#2
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12,575
RE: RICE IN MY TREMEC!!!!
ORIGINAL: 70 MACH I
I just got my Mustang back from Ford, had the tranny re-done under warranty for gear clash in 2nd and 3rd. Here's what they did: Installed the Ford "upgrade kit" which included new synchros, shift forks and shafts, and they replaced ALL the bearings in the box. Here's the surprise, The mainshaft bearings, which are big tapered roller units, WERE TOAST! As I was talking to the lead Tech who did my car, he showed me the bearings, I was amazed! The bearing surface was severely deteriorated, like the tranny was run dry, which wasn't the case. My car has 27K miles on it, and for the most part is babied. (I'm 51)
I look atthe bearing, it says "MADE IN JAPAN"!!! I'm amazed they are still using Japanese bearings in their vehicles, I owneed two Fords in the '80's with similar manual transmission issues, and yes, the bearings that failed were Japanese! My father the old WWII vet and tool and die maker had told me years ago, that one of the biggest failures in Japanese machines was their bearings, it appears their steel is not the best quality, and their heat-treating is inconsistent, AMAZING HUH?So they are still at it. Just makes you want to run out and buy a Civic or Corrola huh? BTW, my tranny shifts AMAZING now, better than when I first bought it with 5K miles. BTW, if you ever try to rebuild one of these Tremec 3650 boxes, you will need a 5 point, security Torx bit, size T-45. Good luck finding one!
John
I just got my Mustang back from Ford, had the tranny re-done under warranty for gear clash in 2nd and 3rd. Here's what they did: Installed the Ford "upgrade kit" which included new synchros, shift forks and shafts, and they replaced ALL the bearings in the box. Here's the surprise, The mainshaft bearings, which are big tapered roller units, WERE TOAST! As I was talking to the lead Tech who did my car, he showed me the bearings, I was amazed! The bearing surface was severely deteriorated, like the tranny was run dry, which wasn't the case. My car has 27K miles on it, and for the most part is babied. (I'm 51)
I look atthe bearing, it says "MADE IN JAPAN"!!! I'm amazed they are still using Japanese bearings in their vehicles, I owneed two Fords in the '80's with similar manual transmission issues, and yes, the bearings that failed were Japanese! My father the old WWII vet and tool and die maker had told me years ago, that one of the biggest failures in Japanese machines was their bearings, it appears their steel is not the best quality, and their heat-treating is inconsistent, AMAZING HUH?So they are still at it. Just makes you want to run out and buy a Civic or Corrola huh? BTW, my tranny shifts AMAZING now, better than when I first bought it with 5K miles. BTW, if you ever try to rebuild one of these Tremec 3650 boxes, you will need a 5 point, security Torx bit, size T-45. Good luck finding one!
John
Its a pretty tortured environment.. lots of movement between heat and cold, lots of water and sludge in them, etc etc.
02-21-2007, 07:49 PM
#3
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location:
Posts: 186
RE: RICE IN MY TREMEC!!!!
I hear what you are saying and i am a die hard american muscle car fan, but some of those japaneese cars (that are left stock) like toyotas and hondas, are some of the most reliable, fuel efficient, and affordable cars on the road. They are hard to beat when they are cared for and used for their intended purpose i.e. not putting humiliating fart cans on em and thinking they are 13 second cars.
[:'(][
]
02-22-2007, 08:14 AM
#8
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Deerfield, VA
Posts: 674
RE: RICE IN MY TREMEC!!!!
Hey guys, not for nuthin,I started tearing trannies apart when I was 17 in the '70's. Ford toploaders, Chevy Muncies, Dodge, Saginaw,New Departure, Borg Warner. They had bearings in them from Timken, New Departure Hyatt, Fafnir....................... Even with the snot beaten out of them with the synchronizer teeth chewedoff of them, the bearings were still good. Perhaps the problem lies in using Mercon in transmissions, those old boxes used 80W-90 gear oil, and you didn't see bearing failures. Gear oil has a great ability for shear, shock cushioning, and lubrication/cling compared tp Mercon, the negative of course being, cold weather operation.
It could be also that the averageJapanese vehicle inherently being lighter and with less torque, don't place the load on components like a good old fashioned American V-8.I was impressed by the size of the bearings used in my Tremec, the countershaft and mainshaft bearings are Huge, it just puzzled me why they failed. Perhaps we should do some research on lubricants to find out which of the Mercon style lubricants has the best properties for transmission use. I like doing manual trannies, I've done more than I can count over the years, but like I said, I'm seeing a trend of bearing failures. If my tranny does fail again out of warranty, I'm headed to my local bearing house (instead of Ford) for replacement pieces. Years ago, you could pick and choose what you put in a box, because many companies produced the same size bearings. Call me pig-headed, call me old school, but, why is it I keep finding failed Japanese bearings in Ford trannies? Couldit beour eastern "partners" are selling Ford 2nd ratebearings to make themselves look better? If that is the case, then Ford ought to smarten up. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be outsourcing parts from a competitor country, that seems to me to be asking for it!
John
It could be also that the averageJapanese vehicle inherently being lighter and with less torque, don't place the load on components like a good old fashioned American V-8.I was impressed by the size of the bearings used in my Tremec, the countershaft and mainshaft bearings are Huge, it just puzzled me why they failed. Perhaps we should do some research on lubricants to find out which of the Mercon style lubricants has the best properties for transmission use. I like doing manual trannies, I've done more than I can count over the years, but like I said, I'm seeing a trend of bearing failures. If my tranny does fail again out of warranty, I'm headed to my local bearing house (instead of Ford) for replacement pieces. Years ago, you could pick and choose what you put in a box, because many companies produced the same size bearings. Call me pig-headed, call me old school, but, why is it I keep finding failed Japanese bearings in Ford trannies? Couldit beour eastern "partners" are selling Ford 2nd ratebearings to make themselves look better? If that is the case, then Ford ought to smarten up. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be outsourcing parts from a competitor country, that seems to me to be asking for it!
John
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