Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
06-29-2008, 02:11 AM
#11
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Illinois
Posts: 311
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
ORIGINAL: cliffyk
The 5W-20 oil specified by manufacturers has nothing to do with longer engine life, and has everything to do with pumping out every last mile per gallon they can to minimise the EPA fines they pay for not meeting the CAFE standards.[/align][/align]Here's my edit of SynLube's good, but horrible to read, history of motor oil grading, and why 5W-20 sucks. In my edit all the advertorial stuff has been removed and I cleaned up the formatting and grammar, there's a link to the original document.[/align][/align]Read it and then decide for yourself what weight oil you wish to use, brand and dino/synthetic are far less important that selecting the proper viscosity for you ambient conditions...[/align][/align] [/align][/align]-[/align]One last comment, I have no desire or intention to argue with anyone about this. If you want to run 5W-20 because that's what Ford says then go right ahead. People with this attitude, who modify their cars with aftermarket parts,amaze me. If Ford's engineersare the grand gurus of engine oil selection, then why are you changing anything they engineered?[/align]
The 5W-20 oil specified by manufacturers has nothing to do with longer engine life, and has everything to do with pumping out every last mile per gallon they can to minimise the EPA fines they pay for not meeting the CAFE standards.[/align][/align]Here's my edit of SynLube's good, but horrible to read, history of motor oil grading, and why 5W-20 sucks. In my edit all the advertorial stuff has been removed and I cleaned up the formatting and grammar, there's a link to the original document.[/align][/align]Read it and then decide for yourself what weight oil you wish to use, brand and dino/synthetic are far less important that selecting the proper viscosity for you ambient conditions...[/align][/align] [/align][/align]-[/align]One last comment, I have no desire or intention to argue with anyone about this. If you want to run 5W-20 because that's what Ford says then go right ahead. People with this attitude, who modify their cars with aftermarket parts,amaze me. If Ford's engineersare the grand gurus of engine oil selection, then why are you changing anything they engineered?[/align]
People will belive anything!
What besides that lame page do you have to support this?First of all bearring tolerances dictate the needs of a specific oil.The tighter the clearances are the lighter the oil needed to lubricate.You honestly think a manufacturer would spend the time and moneyto do R&D on their engines and then run an inferior grade of oil for the sake of one lousy percent gain in fuel economy?
You keep running the thicker oil and see how long it is before youre replacing an oil pump that failed because you read something on the net and took it to heart.
And in response to to your last comment no one claimed ford engineers were grand gurus but i would have to say that they have spent countless dollars and hours researching this so they might have some clue as to whats going on.And as for anyone modding their vehicles and changing parts out dont you think if ford or any manufacturer for that matter could put out one vehicle with everyone in mind they would have by now?Not everyone sets their car up for road racing or drag racing or daily driving its all up to what you intend to do with the vehicle that decides mods!
Ford as well as all other manufacturers try to find that happy medium for the average consumer and sure things could be enhanced or improved in certain areas but just because you or i like it and would buy it doesnt mean the next joe blow will.
I suggest anyone listening to this garbage do some research on it.
06-29-2008, 02:36 AM
#12
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,996
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
So let me get this right, you started an account JUST to start an argument with someone that clearly stated that he had no intention on arguing this with anyone? Nice job.
06-29-2008, 03:28 AM
#13
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Illinois
Posts: 311
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
ORIGINAL: black35th
So let me get this right, you started an account JUST to start an argument with someone that clearly stated that he had no intention on arguing this with anyone? Nice job.
So let me get this right, you started an account JUST to start an argument with someone that clearly stated that he had no intention on arguing this with anyone? Nice job.
06-29-2008, 07:23 AM
#15
TECH SAVANT
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Saint Augustine, FL
Posts: 10,938
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
I had really intended to keep my mouth shut, however I will make a few statements and comments:[/align][/align]The "tighter tolerances" notion pushed out by automakers (to justify the ****-thin oil) and oil companies (to justify higher prices for "high-revving" blends) is silly. There have been no major changes in the tolerances to which motor vehicle engines are engineered in the last 30+ years* (see footnote), most of which are dictated by fundamentals of internal combustion engine design. Compare the service limit specs of then and now for proof of this;[/align][/align]
I would also put forth that after only 40k miles, and assuming the oil had been changed regularly at 2500 to 3000 mile intervals, I would expect any modern automobile engine to look like new internally; even if it had been run on straight 5W WalMart dino oil.[/align][/align]40k is nothing, in the last 25 years we have routinely kept our cars 'til 200k+. The record goes to my wife's '89 Celica GT that we bought new, it had 308k when we traded it in early 2000, after living on 10W-40 for the first 120k, 20W-50 MaxLife for the last 188k.[/align][/align]Lack of keeping the oil clean and relatively chemically inert is the biggest single threat to engine life there is.[/align][/align]In the last, FWIW and since the issue of credentials was brought up, I have a BSME from MIT ('71) and worked extensively with industrial machine design and construction for over 20 years, including forced and mist lubrication of very high speed (20k to 35k rpm) rotating assemblies, compressors, and large (1MW+) diesel generators. [/align][/align]I do not claim to be a lubrication expert by any means, however I do know quite a bit more about lubricants and application of same than many.[/align][/align]
And as for engine oil please feel free to do what ever you want to your engine...[/align][/align][/align]I also agree 110% about believing what you read on the web, and certainly fully endorse additional research before making as profound a decision as what weight oil to run in your engine. [/align][/align]The best descriptive analogy I have seenregarding the Internet was:[/align][/align]"It's like a herd of performing elephants. Large, entertaining, difficult to control, and capable of producing huge amounts of excrement in a very short period of time."[/align][/align]
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* - I am to large extent excluding the crap churned out by the US automakers during much of the 80's. Many of those were poorly produced on aging equipment and if made toward the end of the tool life had clearances you could drive a freight train through. That's why they nearly lost the industry to the Japanese.[/align][/align][/align]
I would also put forth that after only 40k miles, and assuming the oil had been changed regularly at 2500 to 3000 mile intervals, I would expect any modern automobile engine to look like new internally; even if it had been run on straight 5W WalMart dino oil.[/align][/align]40k is nothing, in the last 25 years we have routinely kept our cars 'til 200k+. The record goes to my wife's '89 Celica GT that we bought new, it had 308k when we traded it in early 2000, after living on 10W-40 for the first 120k, 20W-50 MaxLife for the last 188k.[/align][/align]Lack of keeping the oil clean and relatively chemically inert is the biggest single threat to engine life there is.[/align][/align]In the last, FWIW and since the issue of credentials was brought up, I have a BSME from MIT ('71) and worked extensively with industrial machine design and construction for over 20 years, including forced and mist lubrication of very high speed (20k to 35k rpm) rotating assemblies, compressors, and large (1MW+) diesel generators. [/align][/align]I do not claim to be a lubrication expert by any means, however I do know quite a bit more about lubricants and application of same than many.[/align][/align]
And as for engine oil please feel free to do what ever you want to your engine...[/align][/align][/align]I also agree 110% about believing what you read on the web, and certainly fully endorse additional research before making as profound a decision as what weight oil to run in your engine. [/align][/align]The best descriptive analogy I have seenregarding the Internet was:[/align][/align]"It's like a herd of performing elephants. Large, entertaining, difficult to control, and capable of producing huge amounts of excrement in a very short period of time."[/align][/align]
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* - I am to large extent excluding the crap churned out by the US automakers during much of the 80's. Many of those were poorly produced on aging equipment and if made toward the end of the tool life had clearances you could drive a freight train through. That's why they nearly lost the industry to the Japanese.[/align][/align][/align]
06-29-2008, 08:39 AM
#16
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location:
Posts: 2,363
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
cliffy jus threw down b!tches! my opinion is yes oil weight is dictated by bearing clearences but no matter what viscosity STILL changes with ambient temperature. so i believe your climate should dictate the weight of oil you choose.
06-29-2008, 09:17 AM
#17
TECH SAVANT
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Saint Augustine, FL
Posts: 10,938
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
Yes, absolutely; ambient temps/operating temps, which all relate to where you live!!![/align][/align]One other thing to keep in mind is that SAE "weight" classifications are only remotely (and arguably not at all) linked to viscosity at any given temperature. They are the motor oil rating equivalent of idiot lights,first assembled in 1910for consumers to have something to go by. [/align][/align]If you look at the actual viscosities for different grades at the usual rating temperatures you will that the actual viscosity numbers are far less dramatic that the SAE grades imply.[/align]
06-29-2008, 09:47 AM
#19
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location:
Posts: 454
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
ORIGINAL: racer02GTstang
the thickest i would run is 5w30. the mustang engine was built to run 5w20. there is alot more that comes into fact when you decide what oil to run and i will always run what the maufacture reccomends. bearing clearances, oil passages, etc can also effect what kind of oil is most effective. on these newers cars you need to run a thinner oil than something like 10w30 and such because they have alot less tolerances than the old motors. if you try and run a thicker oil through bearings it will have more trouble separating the crank and bearings with oil since its molecules are bigger and you will run a higher oil pressure as well with a thicker oil which can rob horsepower and cause things to go.
i took my old motor that had 40k miles on it apart today and it had 5w20 all its life and it showed no signs of bearing wear and everything looks perfect. the walls were still even perfect like brand new.
the thickest i would run is 5w30. the mustang engine was built to run 5w20. there is alot more that comes into fact when you decide what oil to run and i will always run what the maufacture reccomends. bearing clearances, oil passages, etc can also effect what kind of oil is most effective. on these newers cars you need to run a thinner oil than something like 10w30 and such because they have alot less tolerances than the old motors. if you try and run a thicker oil through bearings it will have more trouble separating the crank and bearings with oil since its molecules are bigger and you will run a higher oil pressure as well with a thicker oil which can rob horsepower and cause things to go.
i took my old motor that had 40k miles on it apart today and it had 5w20 all its life and it showed no signs of bearing wear and everything looks perfect. the walls were still even perfect like brand new.
06-29-2008, 11:16 AM
#20
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Barbourville, KY
Posts: 322
RE: Anti drainback oil filter for 2003 GT SOHC
I guess I have to jump in here. First, remember there is a difference between 'clearance' and 'tolerance'. 'Clearance' is the actual space betweenparts, 'tolerance' is the engineering spec to which a part must be made, so clearance is more of an issue with motor oil flow. The quickest way to cut through all the opinions is to look at actual laboratory dataof used motor oil that has been run in our engines. I will not post a direct link, but do a search and find the bobistheoilguy website. Hundreds of members including myself have posted lab data from thier used oil. There are lots of Ford modular V8's and you will find that Motorcraft 5w20 puts up numbers as good if not better than many30 weights. Sorry to post so long, I just can't stand when opinion is passed off as fact.