HaneyMotorsport.Com

Thanks for putting up the info Cliff. You are correct!!

That was largest post I have ever done, hopefully the last. I tried to make it as short and to the point as possible.

As you can see there can be big differeneces from the "design lab" to "real world" conditions. As Cliff basically said, everything should work "out of the box/design", but that Rarely happens.

Another example to show real world conditions/variables...... wide band units. I am not going to go deep one on this though Wide band accuracys will vary depending on the WB software doing the calculations, exhaust pressure, heat, sensor itself and so on. Accuracys vary much more on either end of the range of stoich......lean side and rich side. This does bring us to how correct we calibrate a "fuel injection syetem" i.e. maf transfer and true afr readings. After much information and education from OE calibrator and manufacturers/designers for use by OEs, I stepped up to a Lambda Pro.

I did know and expect what was happening with the Termi MAF. And being forced induction, it is affected more so then an n/a set up. I was trying to show it needed to be adjusted (BA MAF and actually org. the stock MAF did too)

Bottom line, in the real world we need to make changes and adjustments to get the "we know what it requires" results out of an engine. Yes, we may change the MAF 's "true flow" #s (engine is taking this much, but we tell it more or less) to get it the required results. We know an engine basically runs the best at 14.64 afr (idle, cruise, fuel economy, etc.) and say a boosted engine under boost/load is around 11.80 afr. These are "In General" facts people. Yes, some engines will perform better/worse with different afrs!!!

So, as long as all of the parameters are correct in the calibration.......injector slopes, injector breakpoints, engine/cylinder displacement, etc. ,etc. , wide band data is real, engine data is correct (for example pcm calculated load/VE #s are correct for the giving conditions. i.e. pcm says 30% load/ve. My penciled math of engine displacement, rpm, map, etc. equal about the same), the end result calculations of the pcm are correct.

This was a short one again I am going to go work now.

Stevecooper

This changes things, I didn't realize we were talking in terms of kg/hr. I thought we were all on the same page using lb/hr or lb/min. I guess I default to Lb/Min because that's what SCT displays, although metric measurements for the most part make more sense.

1 815.36 kilograms = 4 002.18372 pounds this would make the P.M.A.S HPX Tool's numbers a lot more realistic.

Stevecooper

This is something I learned (rather read) recently in Greg's second book. Its fantastic that my AEM wideband setup is very accurate at 14.64:1 lambda 1 for gas, but not so great as the mixture moves away from lambda 1 which is were I actually want it to be accurate.

cliffyk

I agree, however they claim on the lead-in page that the worksheet is displaying lb/h???

I generally think in lb/h as that the ways we "yanks" rate injectors--makes the math real easy...

cliffyk

Innovate's LC-1 is quite accurate in the useful range (10:1 to 16:1), as they chose to ignore the laser trimmed calibration resistor in the Bosch sensor and instead require the free-air calibration be performed periodically. It's a bit of a hassle, but it makes a more accurate instrument.

However I will no longer recommend their products as the quality control and support have turned sour over the last year...

Stevecooper

I may try adapting the NGK AFX to use the NGK / NTK Laboratory grade sensor. If not I'll bite the Bullet and by the AFM1000.

I would like to get a Lambda Pro but at this point in the game I just can't justify $3500.00

HaneyMotorsport.Com

The only cheap "off the shelf" wb is the AFX with the NTK sensor. The Bosch sensor will start swaying farther away from it's accuracy as it ages. The NTK does not, it just stops working....basically it is good or dead. I have already talked a couple friends into dumping their current wb and get an AFX.

Stevecooper-

You can purchase a replacement AFX sensor, which will be the NTK I wonder what company is behind the AFX and sold through NGK. The Lambda Pro is definitely Not Cheap! I decided that, to be a professional calibrator, you need professional grade hardware/software!

Stevecooper

Right the AFX uses the standard NTK sensor. I was thinking about replacing it with the Laboratory Grade High End Sensor. Link1 standard Link2 Laboratory.

I could then maybe use the standard NTK sensor on the AEM that's in the car and use the AFX with the high end sensor when tuning.

http://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/pro...roducts_id/438

http://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/pro...roducts_id/647

cliffyk

Quality tools are essential to quality work--I have nearly $75k invested in my electronics lab (when I'm not talking BS here I repair and calibrate electronic test equipment--not to live on, but to feed my habit).

"ManCave" North end (that's my pirate FM station, 103.9, in the corner):


"ManCave" South end:

tbirdscwd

I was going to say that the chart was most likely in kg/hr because it's unlikely that their numbers would be so far off, but right after the link it says "you might have to change values into kg/hr or lb/min"

EDIT: Oh and nice Man Cave cliffy makes sense that you are so learned in tuning if electronics is your hobby