Syracuse315

Going to be interesting deciding between the PHB and Watts Link (Fays2).

Syracuse315

Which should I do first, PHB/Watts Link & TA or Coilovers?

Jazzer The Cat

You pretty much need to go PHB or WL with TA first, as the suspension geometry changes and hence the spring rates. If you go CO's first, figure to go 50% stiffer springs than you want, as the TA will "soften" them up once it is installed.

I run a PHB, but wanted a WL instead I didn't get one, as the Griggs unit requires the loss of some spare tire well. This would require that I forgo my spare tire and not willing to do so.

Jazzer

Syracuse315

Just for the rear COs, correct?

Jazzer The Cat

Yes.... the front CO's spring rates are not effected by the installation of a PHB or WL with TA. The car will respond differently overall, with CO's up front, but wont need to be changed/corrected with the above mods.

Jazzer

Syracuse315

Similar to our discussion about the OEM location vs Coilovers, I'm assuming if I'm diving head in I should look at the Watts link over the PHB (About a $250 price difference)?

Trying to understand some previous posts, the PHB will adjust the rear setup slightly offcenter when under pressure (Because the bar moves in an arc) vs the Watts which keeps it centered when under pressure/roll?

The initial brands I'm thinking off are the MM TA and Fays2 WL, might as well do it right. Any concern with a stock exhaust location?

Jazzer The Cat

Yes... the PHB allows a certain amount of arc, depending on the lenght of the bar. That is NOT an issue, in any real way. The issue is how the PHB applies forcers to the body of the car. My car turns better to the LH side than the right. Not a huge difference, but I can tell and especially on VERY aggressive turns, such as AX course.

There is also debate on the "reverse" design that the Fays2 uses. Too big a discussion to have here, but most, including Griggs Racing, prefer the "traditional" design and their particular set-up requires the loss of spare tire well space.


Exaust is an issue, so you need to research it. Contact Fays2, as the owner is VERY good with customer service, I am told

Jazzer

Syracuse315

Exhaust should not be an issue, here is the Fays2 with an OEM exhaust (1998 SN95):





Not to oversimplify things, but the Watts link looks like a big metal frame that bolts to the old UCA loaction on both sides, secures to each axle tube, and only allows freedom of movement in the vertical direction. Simple, yet effective.

zero2005

it bolts behind the axle, not to the old UCA location. it bolts to where the extra dampers are. i think you need to drill 2 additional holes into the frame as well.

the problem is your limited to what TA you can run with a fays. your pretty much limited to the griggs style, as the maximum motorsport design also uses axle clamps which would interfere with the fays axle clamps.

optionally, it wouldnt be to hard to fabricate ones own WL using various designs. there's two main types, one is the propeller mounted to the frame (like the fays) the other is for it to be mounted with the axle (ie, griggs style). there used to be several "universal" off-road 4x4 weld in type kits available for much much cheaper than the fays or griggs.

alternatively one could probably fabricate a single short lateral link (sn197 style) more easily. there's advantages and disadvantages to both a short and long TA, tho i think the general consensus is "longer is better".

on the choice of struts/shocks - i say koni or bilstein. bilstein for more road duty (comfort) and koni for more track time.

i think another reasoning behind maximum motorsports flip-flopping on rear coil-overs is due to build-quality. alot of manufacturers arent making the shocks with enough quality to handle the stress that a coil-over sleeve puts on them. i know MMS specifically advocates against certain shocks with CO setups due to the lower mounting welds being very weak. tho if you go with a koni or bilstein this wont be an issue.

Syracuse315

You are right, I don't know why I said UCA. I meant the quad shock location.

I'm pretty set on the Bilstein HDs and looking at getting them through MM. Do the Bilsteins ever go on sale, or stay pretty constant in price?