How long will exhaust smoke after rebuild?
03-11-2010, 06:59 PM
#1
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Iowa
Posts: 248
How long will exhaust smoke after rebuild?
Well, over the past few months my car has been getting rebuilt with forged internals. I took it to a shop that specializes in Mustangs, who then referred me to an engine builder they usually work with who has done several rebuilds on the 4.6l.
Anyways, they've put about 250 miles on the car for the break in, and the smoke has gotten progressively better they said, but I'm wondering how long it will do this. It was a complete rebuild, where basically they shipped the engine to the builder, and I told him fix what needs to be fixed so I don't have problems. The car runs fine, although I haven't actually driven it yet. I was told to go ahead and pick up the car in a couple days, and just drive it a lot, give it a bit more load (nothing crazy), and they figure eventually the smoke should settle. They keep saying that it's pretty normal for it to smoke a while, but then I hear a lot of people online saying a rebuilt engine shouldn't smoke at all.
The shop said that if the problem persists after say 600 miles of driving or so to bring it back in and they'd pull the engine again free of charge and check it out. They keep me positive by saying things like:
-It's normal for awhile
-Stuffs just burning off
-You don't have cats
-And these specific type of rings take a while longer to seat (not sure if they're chrome or steel, I forgot to ask)
I trust them on one hand with all their knowledge, but does this sound normal to you. If they offer to fix it free of charge if the problem persists, that's fine, but how long can I expect to see smoke. I don't know much about terminology, but I was told the valves were sanded or grounded down, so I would assume they checked the valve guides and seals prior to installation and fixed them, it'd be their benefit to make more money anyways. Anyways, all gaskets were replaced, during the process as well.
Diamond Pistons bored .03
Scat Rods
Stock Cobra crank
Anyways, they've put about 250 miles on the car for the break in, and the smoke has gotten progressively better they said, but I'm wondering how long it will do this. It was a complete rebuild, where basically they shipped the engine to the builder, and I told him fix what needs to be fixed so I don't have problems. The car runs fine, although I haven't actually driven it yet. I was told to go ahead and pick up the car in a couple days, and just drive it a lot, give it a bit more load (nothing crazy), and they figure eventually the smoke should settle. They keep saying that it's pretty normal for it to smoke a while, but then I hear a lot of people online saying a rebuilt engine shouldn't smoke at all.
The shop said that if the problem persists after say 600 miles of driving or so to bring it back in and they'd pull the engine again free of charge and check it out. They keep me positive by saying things like:
-It's normal for awhile
-Stuffs just burning off
-You don't have cats
-And these specific type of rings take a while longer to seat (not sure if they're chrome or steel, I forgot to ask)
I trust them on one hand with all their knowledge, but does this sound normal to you. If they offer to fix it free of charge if the problem persists, that's fine, but how long can I expect to see smoke. I don't know much about terminology, but I was told the valves were sanded or grounded down, so I would assume they checked the valve guides and seals prior to installation and fixed them, it'd be their benefit to make more money anyways. Anyways, all gaskets were replaced, during the process as well.
Diamond Pistons bored .03
Scat Rods
Stock Cobra crank
Last edited by dastangman; 03-11-2010 at 07:03 PM.
03-11-2010, 07:10 PM
#2
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: oregon
Posts: 1,501
well personally ive built 2 motors and didnt have any smoke that i could see...but they were small car motors not mustang v8s...but i wouldnt worry about it unless it keeps going, plus they said theyd fix it. cats has nothing to do with it...new motor shouldnt burn noticable amount of oil.
03-11-2010, 07:25 PM
#6
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Iowa
Posts: 248
I haven't actually had a chance to go see the car yet...and thererfore, haven't seen what color smoke. The car had a blown piston from detonation, and I immediately had it hauled to the shop there. Anyways, they said the cylinders were out of round, and scuffed, so they bored it out .30 to get it back in shape, but the guy is now thinking that the cylinders are possibly trying to reform back to an out of round state, almost like the block remembers it's previous shape. It's the WAP aluminum block I believe, as I'm sure I wasn't a lucky few to get the left over Teksids. I'm wondering if they just haven't gotten on it hard enough or something, but I would think this not being their first Mustang rebuild, they'd pretty much know what's going on and what's normal.
Previous to the piston blowing the car didn't smoke at all, although very lightly black sometimes during initial start up, which I figured was because I wasn't running any cats. According to the dyno tune, our A/F was spot on, and he put it back on the dyno this week just to test the tune without going WOT. After the piston blew, it began to smoke what I thought looked gray, but easily could have been blue (cold, windy October day, so exhaust was steaming anyways)...it didn't smoke much, but the light knock in the bottom end was proof something was wrong, and the smoke was attributed to it I was sure. I thought it could possibly be coolant as well, but it smelled like burning oil. Again this was right after piston blew. I put it on a truck, hauled it there, and basically said..."There's a knock in the lower end, the thing is smoking, find out the problem fix it and while we're in there let's build it up too." I'm sure they would have noticed if a head was cracked, and the gaskets were replaced as well.
An interesting thing he said though, was it almost seemed like sometimes when they started it up, it would smoke worse than other times and sometimes not at all. I'm wondering if what I get the car, I need to a heavier load break in on it to see if I can get the rings to seat faster. They said whatever type of rings they used tend to take awhile longer. I'm sorry I don't know some of the definitives, I don't have the build papers with me right now. I'm fine with them fixing the problem free, but that still takes away a lot of driving time, which is a bummer.
Previous to the piston blowing the car didn't smoke at all, although very lightly black sometimes during initial start up, which I figured was because I wasn't running any cats. According to the dyno tune, our A/F was spot on, and he put it back on the dyno this week just to test the tune without going WOT. After the piston blew, it began to smoke what I thought looked gray, but easily could have been blue (cold, windy October day, so exhaust was steaming anyways)...it didn't smoke much, but the light knock in the bottom end was proof something was wrong, and the smoke was attributed to it I was sure. I thought it could possibly be coolant as well, but it smelled like burning oil. Again this was right after piston blew. I put it on a truck, hauled it there, and basically said..."There's a knock in the lower end, the thing is smoking, find out the problem fix it and while we're in there let's build it up too." I'm sure they would have noticed if a head was cracked, and the gaskets were replaced as well.
An interesting thing he said though, was it almost seemed like sometimes when they started it up, it would smoke worse than other times and sometimes not at all. I'm wondering if what I get the car, I need to a heavier load break in on it to see if I can get the rings to seat faster. They said whatever type of rings they used tend to take awhile longer. I'm sorry I don't know some of the definitives, I don't have the build papers with me right now. I'm fine with them fixing the problem free, but that still takes away a lot of driving time, which is a bummer.
Last edited by dastangman; 03-11-2010 at 07:32 PM.
03-11-2010, 07:40 PM
#8
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Iowa
Posts: 248
I'm sorry, but I don't know if I completely understand. The engine builder was given the whole engine, and to my knowledge was supposed to look everything over. He remember him saying that the valves were ground down a bit or smoothed, something like that. I guess I would have just assumed he would have checked the heads and intake.
We'll see, maybe I'm just over worrying myself at this point. If I had given him the short block and told him to do all the work and this problem occured, that'd be one thing...but they had the whole engine there...in fact the whole car. I basically, again told them to fix it and check everything out. If something needed replaced, I would have replaced it, and they knew that. I wasn't on some sort of strict budget per se, and because of that, while the engine was out and in their hands, it should be their responsibility to check everything...again, had I given them guidelines to follow and a budget to work with, that would have been one thing. But I specifically asked them to look it over and get back to me with their recommendation on what direction to go.
I know they said they'd fix it free of charge, but I guess I'm scared they'll come back and say, well this is the problem now, and this is something we hadn't initially checked out so it's going to cost such and such amount of money, because it the problem is associated with something we fixed. I've worked with them before, and they're always very friendly and truthful, and he said he'd stand behind their work...but doesn't every company act that way until you challenge them?
Just for reference, let's say it was valve guides or seals (and could that be it given the situation), wouldn't that be something they would have just checked before assembling the engine?
We'll see, maybe I'm just over worrying myself at this point. If I had given him the short block and told him to do all the work and this problem occured, that'd be one thing...but they had the whole engine there...in fact the whole car. I basically, again told them to fix it and check everything out. If something needed replaced, I would have replaced it, and they knew that. I wasn't on some sort of strict budget per se, and because of that, while the engine was out and in their hands, it should be their responsibility to check everything...again, had I given them guidelines to follow and a budget to work with, that would have been one thing. But I specifically asked them to look it over and get back to me with their recommendation on what direction to go.
I know they said they'd fix it free of charge, but I guess I'm scared they'll come back and say, well this is the problem now, and this is something we hadn't initially checked out so it's going to cost such and such amount of money, because it the problem is associated with something we fixed. I've worked with them before, and they're always very friendly and truthful, and he said he'd stand behind their work...but doesn't every company act that way until you challenge them?
Just for reference, let's say it was valve guides or seals (and could that be it given the situation), wouldn't that be something they would have just checked before assembling the engine?
Last edited by dastangman; 03-11-2010 at 07:47 PM.
03-11-2010, 07:47 PM
#9
Yes top end being your heads and their internals. If the entire bottom end (block and internals) has had the once over or even new...and the a/f is just peachy...I would imagine it has something to do with your top end.
If it's smoking...theres a problem. Period. I would suggest pressing the issue with this rebuild shop. Never heard of an engine doing that (if it's running up to par).
If it's smoking...theres a problem. Period. I would suggest pressing the issue with this rebuild shop. Never heard of an engine doing that (if it's running up to par).
03-11-2010, 07:55 PM
#10
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Iowa
Posts: 248
Yes top end being your heads and their internals. If the entire bottom end (block and internals) has had the once over or even new...and the a/f is just peachy...I would imagine it has something to do with your top end.
If it's smoking...theres a problem. Period. I would suggest pressing the issue with this rebuild shop. Never heard of an engine doing that (if it's running up to par).
If it's smoking...theres a problem. Period. I would suggest pressing the issue with this rebuild shop. Never heard of an engine doing that (if it's running up to par).
I think I'm pretty safe with this being completely on their shoulders...but I've worked with some pretty shady placed in the past in terms of body work, and they were great at first until suddenly I was questioning their work. Again, I brought them the whole car, said check everything over (including the fuel system and tune because of the detonation)...they had the car from October through March, plenty of time to do a non sloppy job too. I didn't hassle them at all, and I've done everything how they asked me to in terms of payment. I figure, the last person I want to **** off is the guy building and tuning my car...but I won't stand down if they try to screw me. It probably shouldn't be a big issue if it's the valve guides or seals, as it wouldn't require the complete removal of the engine, just the heads. So I hope to God it's not the rings not seating properly, cause sure they might fix it free, but that's even more down time for the summer.
Last edited by dastangman; 03-11-2010 at 07:59 PM.