New to the thread, with lots of engine and driveline questions!
#1
New to the thread, with lots of engine and driveline questions!
Hello everyone!
Thought I would pop by here and ask some questions, as it seemed the right place to do so!
I have recently purchased a 1981 Ford Mustang with the N/A 2.3L Inline 4 in it from a guy for $700 cash in hand. It runs, it drives, it stops. The seals on the engine are bad as it requires about a quart of oil every 45 minutes - 1 hour you drive it because it has been sitting most of its life. The reason I bought this car is because the frame is solid, I wanted to have a fun little project car, and I was interested in the plethora of Fox Bodies on the market (New Old Stock is everywhere). I have had several project cars before, but nothing quite this involved.
First thing is first. I need to fix some rust here and there; pulling the engine so the body guy can paint the engine bay before the peeling paint turns into holes. The rear wheel wells have some good rust on the outsides and will need to be cut out, and the floor pan has two holes under the bench seat near the drain plugs in the pan (see pics below). But the rest of the exterior is just sun faded. Keep in mind, it was less than a thousand dollars for it!
Back on track to the engine: The 2.3, like I said is just leaking oil like no other. While I have it pulled, I was considering rebuilding it and putting a turbo kit on it. Now, I know that the 2.3 N/A engines need a complete overhaul to be turbo ready. (Which I was going to do anyways if I decide to stay with the 2.3L, and YES I did read the sticky thread!) I have done a few engine overhauls on 1980's era GM products before (307's, 305's), but I am new to the Ford family having just purchased this mustang and a 2003 Ford Crown Victoria. I want someone with experience to tell me what would be best option and make the the happiest in the long run.
Second thing: It has an automatic transmission in it currently, and I am looking to get a manual in it. Would this be a good idea, or am I a little too ambitious? If this is plausible; which one would you recommend? The T56? I have also heard that the drive shaft for the automatics and manuals are different lengths, but like I said I am new to this whole Mustang and driveline swap business, so I don't know! Another question in regards to the engine: Are computers readily available for these cars? It is currently carbeurated and I am looking at updating it to a EFI (new heads, etc). Once again I ask. Am I getting ahead of myself, or is this a viable option with the 2.3L?
My goal is to have a fun, good looking car with a clean looking engine bay. Not something with ungodly amounts of horsepower, but something that is peppy, fun to drive, sounds nice, and is a bit of a head turner. I was initially just going to toss the 2.3L and put in the 2011 Ford Racing Coyote engine, but I realized that was way more money than I had available and am considering the possible 2.3 rebuild + turbo add on or some other recommended engine that is not $7000! Let's be realistic here guys! I do not have $30,000 to put into this. I have around $10,000 at the moment for EVERYTHING and plan (hope) to keep it under 15k. A good paint job (with me doing most of the prep work) is not going to be cheap. Not to mention, the plastic on the bumper is faded, and I might need to replace those! (doh!)
In short:
-Should I rebuild the 2.3L I have now with foraged internals, port and polish it and turbo it? If so, are there computers readily available for the 2.3L I4 turbo (possibly with a manual transmission)? Or should I slap a different engine in there?
-Should I trash the automatic transmission and do a manual swap? If so, should I use the T-56?
-Should I kick the carbeurator and make it EFI?
-I am having issues finding New Old Stock for the 2.3L. Any help/resources would be greatly appreciated.
NOTE: Car has 19,000 original miles on it. It was kept in a barn most of its life. You can see all the mud and dust inside the car in the pictures below! Keep in mind I want her to be shiny when I am done!!
Enjoy some pictures of my project.
I parted out two mustangs and make frankenstang
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...d4d48-full.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_51613_.jpg
Interior has been gutted already; sanding down rust and prepping for the bodyshop.
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_70208_.jpg
The engine bay
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71481_.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71482_.jpg
The carbeurator
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71485_.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71493_.jpg
And last but not least: The rust hole under the bench seat.
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71496_.jpg
Thought I would pop by here and ask some questions, as it seemed the right place to do so!
I have recently purchased a 1981 Ford Mustang with the N/A 2.3L Inline 4 in it from a guy for $700 cash in hand. It runs, it drives, it stops. The seals on the engine are bad as it requires about a quart of oil every 45 minutes - 1 hour you drive it because it has been sitting most of its life. The reason I bought this car is because the frame is solid, I wanted to have a fun little project car, and I was interested in the plethora of Fox Bodies on the market (New Old Stock is everywhere). I have had several project cars before, but nothing quite this involved.
First thing is first. I need to fix some rust here and there; pulling the engine so the body guy can paint the engine bay before the peeling paint turns into holes. The rear wheel wells have some good rust on the outsides and will need to be cut out, and the floor pan has two holes under the bench seat near the drain plugs in the pan (see pics below). But the rest of the exterior is just sun faded. Keep in mind, it was less than a thousand dollars for it!
Back on track to the engine: The 2.3, like I said is just leaking oil like no other. While I have it pulled, I was considering rebuilding it and putting a turbo kit on it. Now, I know that the 2.3 N/A engines need a complete overhaul to be turbo ready. (Which I was going to do anyways if I decide to stay with the 2.3L, and YES I did read the sticky thread!) I have done a few engine overhauls on 1980's era GM products before (307's, 305's), but I am new to the Ford family having just purchased this mustang and a 2003 Ford Crown Victoria. I want someone with experience to tell me what would be best option and make the the happiest in the long run.
Second thing: It has an automatic transmission in it currently, and I am looking to get a manual in it. Would this be a good idea, or am I a little too ambitious? If this is plausible; which one would you recommend? The T56? I have also heard that the drive shaft for the automatics and manuals are different lengths, but like I said I am new to this whole Mustang and driveline swap business, so I don't know! Another question in regards to the engine: Are computers readily available for these cars? It is currently carbeurated and I am looking at updating it to a EFI (new heads, etc). Once again I ask. Am I getting ahead of myself, or is this a viable option with the 2.3L?
My goal is to have a fun, good looking car with a clean looking engine bay. Not something with ungodly amounts of horsepower, but something that is peppy, fun to drive, sounds nice, and is a bit of a head turner. I was initially just going to toss the 2.3L and put in the 2011 Ford Racing Coyote engine, but I realized that was way more money than I had available and am considering the possible 2.3 rebuild + turbo add on or some other recommended engine that is not $7000! Let's be realistic here guys! I do not have $30,000 to put into this. I have around $10,000 at the moment for EVERYTHING and plan (hope) to keep it under 15k. A good paint job (with me doing most of the prep work) is not going to be cheap. Not to mention, the plastic on the bumper is faded, and I might need to replace those! (doh!)
In short:
-Should I rebuild the 2.3L I have now with foraged internals, port and polish it and turbo it? If so, are there computers readily available for the 2.3L I4 turbo (possibly with a manual transmission)? Or should I slap a different engine in there?
-Should I trash the automatic transmission and do a manual swap? If so, should I use the T-56?
-Should I kick the carbeurator and make it EFI?
-I am having issues finding New Old Stock for the 2.3L. Any help/resources would be greatly appreciated.
NOTE: Car has 19,000 original miles on it. It was kept in a barn most of its life. You can see all the mud and dust inside the car in the pictures below! Keep in mind I want her to be shiny when I am done!!
Enjoy some pictures of my project.
I parted out two mustangs and make frankenstang
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...d4d48-full.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_51613_.jpg
Interior has been gutted already; sanding down rust and prepping for the bodyshop.
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_70208_.jpg
The engine bay
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71481_.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71482_.jpg
The carbeurator
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71485_.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71493_.jpg
And last but not least: The rust hole under the bench seat.
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ket_71496_.jpg
#2
So, I was also contemplating on the 5.0 swap like every other person out there. One problem... Ford didn't have the 5.0 on the Mustang in 81. They offered the A - 2.3L 2V 4-cyl. with 88hp, B - 3.3L 1V 6-cyl. with 94hp and D - 4.2L 2V V-8 with 120hp .... I am worried if I get a 5.0, that it won't work in the 81 fox body. Any advice on that as well? http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/...P-Crate-Engine
#3
How well can you handle wiring?
That will be the biggest factor on if you should do a 2.3t or a carbed 302 or 351.
Slow down , read more. Your going to end up spending 50,000 if you start buying up the stuff your looking at without learning and planing more.
A basic carbed V8 5 speed will swap in the easiest.
That will be the biggest factor on if you should do a 2.3t or a carbed 302 or 351.
Slow down , read more. Your going to end up spending 50,000 if you start buying up the stuff your looking at without learning and planing more.
A basic carbed V8 5 speed will swap in the easiest.
#4
How well can you handle wiring?
That will be the biggest factor on if you should do a 2.3t or a carbed 302 or 351.
Slow down , read more. Your going to end up spending 50,000 if you start buying up the stuff your looking at without learning and planing more.
A basic carbed V8 5 speed will swap in the easiest.
That will be the biggest factor on if you should do a 2.3t or a carbed 302 or 351.
Slow down , read more. Your going to end up spending 50,000 if you start buying up the stuff your looking at without learning and planing more.
A basic carbed V8 5 speed will swap in the easiest.
And the engine isn't gunna be for another year. Still working on the body at the moment. There is no real rush to this project. I kinda want it done by summer of 2013, but from what I have seen in the past... this will go on a LOT longer and cost more than I budgeted for.
But will they fit in the 1981 Fox Body without heavy modifications?
I mean, a new V8 306 engine will run ~$3,499, New T56 tranny will run ~$2,395 ... and that is about 1/3 of what I have planned thus far. Obviously I gotta include body work, suspension (it is.... shot.), exhaust (shot as well), which carb I want (any advice?), new gauges (optional for now), new seats (old ones are shot) and the computer.
Like I said, new to the whole overhaul business. So I will LISTEN and soak in as much advice as you are willing to throw at me so I don't dig myself into a hole I can't get out of!
Notes thus far
-Forget the 2.3L, go for the V8 carbed swap for ease.
-Slow down kid, you'll shoot your eye out!
#5
Forget the V8....
Forget the carburetor....
Forget thinking you have to spend that kind of money for an awesome whip!
I'll try to go through what I would do and give you some sites to look through, but if you have any questions, don't be afraid to PM or email me.
First off, nice score on the 4-eyed fox! Definitely one of the classiest looking stangs out there. It looks as if most of your body work should be pretty straight forward. If you are going to go as far as you are with it, make sure to get all the rust removed. Even under the body. Replace sheet metal as needed, use a good quality filler, and if you have any connections in the auto body world, a nice paint job really doesn't cost that much. Heck, give it to a local community college or skills center automotive class for paint. All you will have into it is cost of materials.
As far as engine goes,
I would get a short block from these guys http://www.raceeng.com/default.aspx
There are a lot of options when it comes to 2.3 variations lol. Do some reading and figure out what you would really like out of it. It's not a cheap option, but once you figure the cost of good connecting rods, machine work, pistons, etc. you will have about that much wrapped up into a stout bottom end.
Now to the top end. You can spend a pretty penny on a good flowing head, roller cam, and intake set up based from the Ford head. I would purchase a Volvo B234F twin cam head and modify it to work on the 2.3 Ford block. There are several sites related to this conversion, and you can usually find a modified head on Ebay ready to bold onto the Ford block. All you would need to figure out is pulleys, belt, and tensioner at that point.
Forget that leaky fuel system (carburetor) and join the 21st with EFI.
I would get a MegaSquirt 2 system and Tuner Studio software and make my own wiring harness. These guys make it pretty simple as far as a one stop shop for MS parts http://www.diyautotune.com/ Plus, if you plan to turbo, carbs dont usually last that long, and EFI is the only way to really make sure you have optimal fuel/spark situations for any boost level.
Turbo? Yes Please! You can find very good turbos from name brand suppliers for a really good price. Just check these guys out, http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/. Go to turbos, then Turbonetics. They have an awesome selection of several different trims for your Mustang for very reasonable prices. If you had the know how and time to tinker with it a bit, I would entertain the idea of a compound turbocharging setup ;-)
A 5 speed is always more fun than an auto, but don't think you need to spend an arm and a leg for one. Grab a T5 out of any of the 4cyl foxes. Or with a little work, grab one out of a 5.0 car. There are kits/pats/tech out there about how to adapt a 5.0L T5 to a 2.3L.
I tried to give you some good info, but it is early in the morning, and I know I left some good info out. Feel free to get a hold of me for more details. I have wished to have that kind of cash for a long time to really wake my stang up. If you follow my direction, you will be blowing off modified 5.0 GT's without breaking the $10,000 mark, easily.
Enjoy!
Forget the carburetor....
Forget thinking you have to spend that kind of money for an awesome whip!
I'll try to go through what I would do and give you some sites to look through, but if you have any questions, don't be afraid to PM or email me.
First off, nice score on the 4-eyed fox! Definitely one of the classiest looking stangs out there. It looks as if most of your body work should be pretty straight forward. If you are going to go as far as you are with it, make sure to get all the rust removed. Even under the body. Replace sheet metal as needed, use a good quality filler, and if you have any connections in the auto body world, a nice paint job really doesn't cost that much. Heck, give it to a local community college or skills center automotive class for paint. All you will have into it is cost of materials.
As far as engine goes,
I would get a short block from these guys http://www.raceeng.com/default.aspx
There are a lot of options when it comes to 2.3 variations lol. Do some reading and figure out what you would really like out of it. It's not a cheap option, but once you figure the cost of good connecting rods, machine work, pistons, etc. you will have about that much wrapped up into a stout bottom end.
Now to the top end. You can spend a pretty penny on a good flowing head, roller cam, and intake set up based from the Ford head. I would purchase a Volvo B234F twin cam head and modify it to work on the 2.3 Ford block. There are several sites related to this conversion, and you can usually find a modified head on Ebay ready to bold onto the Ford block. All you would need to figure out is pulleys, belt, and tensioner at that point.
Forget that leaky fuel system (carburetor) and join the 21st with EFI.
I would get a MegaSquirt 2 system and Tuner Studio software and make my own wiring harness. These guys make it pretty simple as far as a one stop shop for MS parts http://www.diyautotune.com/ Plus, if you plan to turbo, carbs dont usually last that long, and EFI is the only way to really make sure you have optimal fuel/spark situations for any boost level.
Turbo? Yes Please! You can find very good turbos from name brand suppliers for a really good price. Just check these guys out, http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/. Go to turbos, then Turbonetics. They have an awesome selection of several different trims for your Mustang for very reasonable prices. If you had the know how and time to tinker with it a bit, I would entertain the idea of a compound turbocharging setup ;-)
A 5 speed is always more fun than an auto, but don't think you need to spend an arm and a leg for one. Grab a T5 out of any of the 4cyl foxes. Or with a little work, grab one out of a 5.0 car. There are kits/pats/tech out there about how to adapt a 5.0L T5 to a 2.3L.
I tried to give you some good info, but it is early in the morning, and I know I left some good info out. Feel free to get a hold of me for more details. I have wished to have that kind of cash for a long time to really wake my stang up. If you follow my direction, you will be blowing off modified 5.0 GT's without breaking the $10,000 mark, easily.
Enjoy!
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