rebuild?
04-30-2007, 11:08 AM
#1
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rebuild?
Ok, I need the opinion of some people that are pretty good with engines & have had some background experience.
About 3 years ago I twised an oil pump shaft in half and spun two rod bearings. I rebuild the engine, new oil pump, hardened shaft, new main bearings, new rod bearings, reground rods, reground crank. I reused the cam bearings, lifters, and pushrods.
When everything was apart I had the pushrods & lifters punched into a cardboard box in order. It got kicked over by one of my friends so I didn't know what order they went in. I didn't have money to buy new ones at the time so I took the lifters apart, cleaned them, & put them back together. I went ahead & put them back in in a random order so they were tapping, not loud at all, but they were tapping. I probably put about 1000 miles on it & noticed it had a blown head gasket so I replaced that & put it back together. The ticking was a little louder, but head gasket was fixed. I got about 15000 miles on it & ticking kept getting louder & louder over time. I took off the radiator cap & started it one day... again a blown head gasket. I found that the passenger side head was warped.
The ticking noise got really loud over the 15000 miles to a point where if you were in front of the car you heard that over the exhaust. I do know the noise is coming from the around the lifters/pushrods/ or rockers, not the rods. Sounds like from 2-4 of them.
Oil pressure while the engine is cold stays at a steady 45psi at idle and 45psi at 3500rpm, steady.
& when the engine warms up it drops to around 8psi at idle (500-600rpm) but is at around 40psi when cruising (1800rpm).
I'm not sure what to do here. I don't make very much money after bills otherwise I would just rebuild the entire engine again. I bought some used heads & had them checked. They're good.
I'm not sure what the a good/cheap course of action here is. replace the rockers, lifters, pushrods, & head gasket would cost me around $300-350 I would assume which would take quite a while to save up for with my income/bills. Will used parts work here? (other than the head gasket) Not sure if it matters much, but I put an x303 cam in it about a month after I had it, still using stock rockers.
Also, should I be worried about the low oil psi and be thinking about replacing the bearings again soon?
About 3 years ago I twised an oil pump shaft in half and spun two rod bearings. I rebuild the engine, new oil pump, hardened shaft, new main bearings, new rod bearings, reground rods, reground crank. I reused the cam bearings, lifters, and pushrods.
When everything was apart I had the pushrods & lifters punched into a cardboard box in order. It got kicked over by one of my friends so I didn't know what order they went in. I didn't have money to buy new ones at the time so I took the lifters apart, cleaned them, & put them back together. I went ahead & put them back in in a random order so they were tapping, not loud at all, but they were tapping. I probably put about 1000 miles on it & noticed it had a blown head gasket so I replaced that & put it back together. The ticking was a little louder, but head gasket was fixed. I got about 15000 miles on it & ticking kept getting louder & louder over time. I took off the radiator cap & started it one day... again a blown head gasket. I found that the passenger side head was warped.
The ticking noise got really loud over the 15000 miles to a point where if you were in front of the car you heard that over the exhaust. I do know the noise is coming from the around the lifters/pushrods/ or rockers, not the rods. Sounds like from 2-4 of them.
Oil pressure while the engine is cold stays at a steady 45psi at idle and 45psi at 3500rpm, steady.
& when the engine warms up it drops to around 8psi at idle (500-600rpm) but is at around 40psi when cruising (1800rpm).
I'm not sure what to do here. I don't make very much money after bills otherwise I would just rebuild the entire engine again. I bought some used heads & had them checked. They're good.
I'm not sure what the a good/cheap course of action here is. replace the rockers, lifters, pushrods, & head gasket would cost me around $300-350 I would assume which would take quite a while to save up for with my income/bills. Will used parts work here? (other than the head gasket) Not sure if it matters much, but I put an x303 cam in it about a month after I had it, still using stock rockers.
Also, should I be worried about the low oil psi and be thinking about replacing the bearings again soon?
04-30-2007, 01:02 PM
#3
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RE: rebuild?
Doesn't sound stupid at all. They are stock springs, but didn't have many miles on them or so the guy said that sold me the car. I had to do quite a bit of research to find out if it would even work. They lifters do need to be upgraded pretty badly, but they are still stock. I haven't had one problem with the cam, springs, lifters, or pushrods until now & it wasn't at fault of the car, it was a mistake on my part for putting them back in not knowing which one came from where.
04-30-2007, 01:04 PM
#4
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RE: rebuild?
yep, that X cam will not work with stock springs. Big no no right there
the ticking could be spring binding or improper rocker adjustment
or bad valve guides or any number of things.
head gasket problems could be from warped heads or block
or improper head torquing
oil should be at 60psi while driving and 30 at idle so something
is not right there.
the ticking could be spring binding or improper rocker adjustment
or bad valve guides or any number of things.
head gasket problems could be from warped heads or block
or improper head torquing
oil should be at 60psi while driving and 30 at idle so something
is not right there.
04-30-2007, 01:08 PM
#6
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RE: rebuild?
r barn said a good point, a buddy of mine blew his head gasket in his honda 2 or 3 times and he finally realized his block was warped, that sucked for him cause the b series honda block is quite expensive, but for u a 5.0 ho block is a dime a dozen.
04-30-2007, 10:40 PM
#7
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RE: rebuild?
The x303 worked fine for well over 30,000 miles with no noise whatsoever, nor problems. The engine sounded the exact same as stock, no added noise.
I already know the passenger side head is warped. The two big issue i'm really on is whether or not to replace rods, mains, & cam bearings since it's dipping to a low 8psi at a 500rpm idle. I've been told that it's fine & there's still a lot of mileage to be had out of the engine.
Then there's also the other one. For cost I don't have much, which is why i'm hoping I can get by with those bearings. Can I put used lifters & pushrods in it? & Do I have to replace the rockers too? They are stock rockers, they aren't adjustable.
I already know the passenger side head is warped. The two big issue i'm really on is whether or not to replace rods, mains, & cam bearings since it's dipping to a low 8psi at a 500rpm idle. I've been told that it's fine & there's still a lot of mileage to be had out of the engine.
Then there's also the other one. For cost I don't have much, which is why i'm hoping I can get by with those bearings. Can I put used lifters & pushrods in it? & Do I have to replace the rockers too? They are stock rockers, they aren't adjustable.
04-30-2007, 11:11 PM
#8
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RE: rebuild?
you shouldnt have to replace rockers, pushrods, or lifters if they are in good shape. however, you are nutz for using that cam with stock springs. take our advice when we all say NOOOOOOOO - VERY BAD!!!!!
low oil pressure is most likely loose clearances on the rods/mains, basically if they ground the crank to the small end of the acceptable limits for .010 (or .020) and the rods are on the big end of the acceptable clearances you could be sloppy in the bottom and would cause you to have low pressure. thicker oil helps, and straight 40 is the best in these situations.
low oil pressure is most likely loose clearances on the rods/mains, basically if they ground the crank to the small end of the acceptable limits for .010 (or .020) and the rods are on the big end of the acceptable clearances you could be sloppy in the bottom and would cause you to have low pressure. thicker oil helps, and straight 40 is the best in these situations.
05-01-2007, 01:30 AM
#9
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RE: rebuild?
I'm not sure if I'm asking this question in the right way or not...
1. Is 8psi at 500rpm sufficient enough to keep from damage? I get more than enough oil psi when the rpm goes up a little, but at idle it is low.
2. Will using used lifters & pushrods out of an engine that's making no lifter noise work? If so, should I replace the rocker arms aswell.
I have no doubt that almost everone on here that hasn't ran an x303 would think it wouldn't work. I got the same exact response when I was trying to figure out if it would clear the pistons everyone said it wouldn't, thing was not one of the people that said that it wouldn't work had actually ran the cam. So I talked to a couple people that did run it. Out of 3 people that ran this cam, 2 used them with stock springs, stock pistons, stock pushrods, stock rockers. One even had 40,000 miles on his. Not one of them had any problems whatsoever with any of the valvetrain. I know the cam is pushing it on stock parts, but I do know it will run perfectly fine for quite a long time if the parts are in good condition. I've ran the cam for more than 20,000miles I doubt you're going to convince me it won't work or won't be reliable when I haven't had one problem with it. & in any case, like mentioned. 5.0 H.O.'s are a dime a dozen.
I am very aware that pushrods, lifters, & rockers wear & putting them in the wrong spots is a big no no, & will result in valvetrain noise. It was something I couldn't help, I had them set up in order, the box got kicked over. I ran short on money so I couldn't replace them. The lifters weren't in the best condition when I was cleaning them out so I do know they were needing replaced shortly after, putting them in the wrong spots just made the condition worse.
1. Is 8psi at 500rpm sufficient enough to keep from damage? I get more than enough oil psi when the rpm goes up a little, but at idle it is low.
2. Will using used lifters & pushrods out of an engine that's making no lifter noise work? If so, should I replace the rocker arms aswell.
I have no doubt that almost everone on here that hasn't ran an x303 would think it wouldn't work. I got the same exact response when I was trying to figure out if it would clear the pistons everyone said it wouldn't, thing was not one of the people that said that it wouldn't work had actually ran the cam. So I talked to a couple people that did run it. Out of 3 people that ran this cam, 2 used them with stock springs, stock pistons, stock pushrods, stock rockers. One even had 40,000 miles on his. Not one of them had any problems whatsoever with any of the valvetrain. I know the cam is pushing it on stock parts, but I do know it will run perfectly fine for quite a long time if the parts are in good condition. I've ran the cam for more than 20,000miles I doubt you're going to convince me it won't work or won't be reliable when I haven't had one problem with it. & in any case, like mentioned. 5.0 H.O.'s are a dime a dozen.
I am very aware that pushrods, lifters, & rockers wear & putting them in the wrong spots is a big no no, & will result in valvetrain noise. It was something I couldn't help, I had them set up in order, the box got kicked over. I ran short on money so I couldn't replace them. The lifters weren't in the best condition when I was cleaning them out so I do know they were needing replaced shortly after, putting them in the wrong spots just made the condition worse.
05-01-2007, 01:46 AM
#10
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RE: rebuild?
Your idle oil psi is way too low. Could be excessive bearing clearances, or the pressure relief bypass could be stuck open. With oil pressure that low at idle it could hammer out the bearings over time, increasing the clearance and compounding the pressure problem. Does the engine consume a lot of oil?(ie, do you have to add a fair amount of oil to it between oil changes)