T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
11-28-2007, 08:41 PM
#1
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 336
T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
First thing first, I have pulled every hair on my head out dealing with this ordeal.Just had to get that out.As you may have seen by my other posts, Ihave a '93GT that I am doing clutch and tranny work to in the future.
I have begun by acquiring the parts etc. I had a shop in mind to do the work, and let them order the rebuild kit for the T-5 since they would be the ones doing the work and to make sure they got a kit that they were used to using on a regular basis and to AVOID problems. Well it took them over two weeks to get the parts in with no follow up on their part regarding our scheduled drop off date. now with the holidays etc, doing the clutch and tranny is not my priority but I still have a lot of time invested in this.
So...I decided to pick up the parts that they got in so they are not laying around the shop. I didn't see until I got home on the box of the T-5 rebuild kit, it says 1983-1985 B/W T4 GM 4SPD AND 1982-1992 B/W NON W/C T-5.My reaction OH GREAT!!!
I read this as Borg and Warner Non-World class and to top it off, it says it only goes to 1992. Please, correct me if I am wrongand this is why am asking, a 1993 5.0 T-5 should have been a late enough model year to be considered "World Class." I forget after what year the nomenclature started.
Also, being a 1993 I have read that Ford did a running upgrade and the transmission may have different input and output shafts as well as a special input shaft bearing and snap ring, but I have no way of telling as is.
So it appears I have two strikes against me already, as it is labeled as non-world class and the 1993 may be a little funky.
What I have did was take the rebuild kit to a tranny tech who hasn't seen my car, but he did see the kit and was able to confirm that it was not world class (I think he said that they synchros has three steps/levels on the inside of them).
I have taken pics of the kit I have. Please take a look and chime in. Just double checking, are they really not world class. How much cheaper of a rebuild kit than the correct one for my car? Are the world class kit and the non-world class interchangeable? If so why would anyone order the poorer one!? http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
I am thinking that this whole rebuild kit is ALL WRONG for my application. The best part is when I called the shop to clarify and ask if they have used this on 1993's or on a lot of T-5's they gave me such a sweet response that this is the standard rebuild kit they use (and right now I view it as inferior to what I already have) and proceeded to tell about how much experience they have. Similar to walking both ways uphill in the snow.
I am no mechanic, just trying to be thorough and eliminate any parts delays in the future. But I usually do read the box.
Attached is a link to the photobucket site where I have the pics as they are too large for here. http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
Furthermore, the reason why I am getting the tranny done is because (what I attribute to worn synchros) it grinds second if do a quick little blast through the gears, and most of the time grinds when you put it in reverse at no speed. Also, rarely it pops out of gear when you are shifting into third or second as the handle feels like it wiggles a little, and then takes a tap of the clutch again and a little more authority. One shop attributed this to the synchros, another today said that means that the slider is going? Any ideas.
How much cost would doing a slider add to the local cost of rebuilding a T-5 of $750
for just the rebuild kit featured (no hard parts) in it. Am I better off just getting a rebuilt from Tremec's website? It's going to be like $1,100 shipped.
Thank you very much for reading my very long/frustrating post and thanks in advance for the replies!
11-28-2007, 08:51 PM
#2
D.R. THE PATHETIC DORK
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 30,863
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
ORIGINAL: 50Stocker
First thing first, I have pulled every hair on my head out dealing with this ordeal.Just had to get that out.As you may have seen by my other posts, Ihave a '93GT that I am doing clutch and tranny work to in the future.
I have begun by acquiring the parts etc. I had a shop in mind to do the work, and let them order the rebuild kit for the T-5 since they would be the ones doing the work and to make sure they got a kit that they were used to using on a regular basis and to AVOID problems. Well it took them over two weeks to get the parts in with no follow up on their part regarding our scheduled drop off date. now with the holidays etc, doing the clutch and tranny is not my priority but I still have a lot of time invested in this.
So...I decided to pick up the parts that they got in so they are not laying around the shop. I didn't see until I got home on the box of the T-5 rebuild kit, it says 1983-1985 B/W T4 GM 4SPD AND 1982-1992 B/W NON W/C T-5.My reaction OH GREAT!!!
I read this as Borg and Warner Non-World class and to top it off, it says it only goes to 1992. Please, correct me if I am wrongand this is why am asking, a 1993 5.0 T-5 should have been a late enough model year to be considered "World Class." I forget after what year the nomenclature started.
Also, being a 1993 I have read that Ford did a running upgrade and the transmission may have different input and output shafts as well as a special input shaft bearing and snap ring, but I have no way of telling as is.
So it appears I have two strikes against me already, as it is labeled as non-world class and the 1993 may be a little funky.
What I have did was take the rebuild kit to a tranny tech who hasn't seen my car, but he did see the kit and was able to confirm that it was not world class (I think he said that they synchros has three steps/levels on the inside of them).
I have taken pics of the kit I have. Please take a look and chime in. Just double checking, are they really not world class. How much cheaper of a rebuild kit than the correct one for my car? Are the world class kit and the non-world class interchangeable? If so why would anyone order the poorer one!? http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
I am thinking that this whole rebuild kit is ALL WRONG for my application. The best part is when I called the shop to clarify and ask if they have used this on 1993's or on a lot of T-5's they gave me such a sweet response that this is the standard rebuild kit they use (and right now I view it as inferior to what I already have) and proceeded to tell about how much experience they have. Similar to walking both ways uphill in the snow.
I am no mechanic, just trying to be thorough and eliminate any parts delays in the future. But I usually do read the box.
Attached is a link to the photobucket site where I have the pics as they are too large for here. http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
Furthermore, the reason why I am getting the tranny done is because (what I attribute to worn synchros) it grinds second if do a quick little blast through the gears, and most of the time grinds when you put it in reverse at no speed. Also, rarely it pops out of gear when you are shifting into third or second as the handle feels like it wiggles a little, and then takes a tap of the clutch again and a little more authority. One shop attributed this to the synchros, another today said that means that the slider is going? Any ideas.
How much cost would doing a slider add to the local cost of rebuilding a T-5 of $750
for just the rebuild kit featured (no hard parts) in it. Am I better off just getting a rebuilt from Tremec's website? It's going to be like $1,100 shipped.
Thank you very much for reading my very long/frustrating post and thanks in advance for the replies!
First thing first, I have pulled every hair on my head out dealing with this ordeal.Just had to get that out.As you may have seen by my other posts, Ihave a '93GT that I am doing clutch and tranny work to in the future.
I have begun by acquiring the parts etc. I had a shop in mind to do the work, and let them order the rebuild kit for the T-5 since they would be the ones doing the work and to make sure they got a kit that they were used to using on a regular basis and to AVOID problems. Well it took them over two weeks to get the parts in with no follow up on their part regarding our scheduled drop off date. now with the holidays etc, doing the clutch and tranny is not my priority but I still have a lot of time invested in this.
So...I decided to pick up the parts that they got in so they are not laying around the shop. I didn't see until I got home on the box of the T-5 rebuild kit, it says 1983-1985 B/W T4 GM 4SPD AND 1982-1992 B/W NON W/C T-5.My reaction OH GREAT!!!
I read this as Borg and Warner Non-World class and to top it off, it says it only goes to 1992. Please, correct me if I am wrongand this is why am asking, a 1993 5.0 T-5 should have been a late enough model year to be considered "World Class." I forget after what year the nomenclature started.
Also, being a 1993 I have read that Ford did a running upgrade and the transmission may have different input and output shafts as well as a special input shaft bearing and snap ring, but I have no way of telling as is.
So it appears I have two strikes against me already, as it is labeled as non-world class and the 1993 may be a little funky.
What I have did was take the rebuild kit to a tranny tech who hasn't seen my car, but he did see the kit and was able to confirm that it was not world class (I think he said that they synchros has three steps/levels on the inside of them).
I have taken pics of the kit I have. Please take a look and chime in. Just double checking, are they really not world class. How much cheaper of a rebuild kit than the correct one for my car? Are the world class kit and the non-world class interchangeable? If so why would anyone order the poorer one!? http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
I am thinking that this whole rebuild kit is ALL WRONG for my application. The best part is when I called the shop to clarify and ask if they have used this on 1993's or on a lot of T-5's they gave me such a sweet response that this is the standard rebuild kit they use (and right now I view it as inferior to what I already have) and proceeded to tell about how much experience they have. Similar to walking both ways uphill in the snow.
I am no mechanic, just trying to be thorough and eliminate any parts delays in the future. But I usually do read the box.
Attached is a link to the photobucket site where I have the pics as they are too large for here. http://s238.photobucket.com/albums/ff112/bigredstang/
Furthermore, the reason why I am getting the tranny done is because (what I attribute to worn synchros) it grinds second if do a quick little blast through the gears, and most of the time grinds when you put it in reverse at no speed. Also, rarely it pops out of gear when you are shifting into third or second as the handle feels like it wiggles a little, and then takes a tap of the clutch again and a little more authority. One shop attributed this to the synchros, another today said that means that the slider is going? Any ideas.
How much cost would doing a slider add to the local cost of rebuilding a T-5 of $750
for just the rebuild kit featured (no hard parts) in it. Am I better off just getting a rebuilt from Tremec's website? It's going to be like $1,100 shipped.
Thank you very much for reading my very long/frustrating post and thanks in advance for the replies!
I'd return that kit..the 4 cyl trannies were non w/c but look I dentical except for a few differences like input shaft tip diameter and torque capacity rating......anyway call D&D and get a complete kit for less that 200 beans
11-28-2007, 09:03 PM
#3
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 336
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
Thanks for more info. Yeah i know that was long post, and I try not to do that but I am seriously starting to blow a gasket because everyone has a different story. I would have ordered the D&D kit, but I was trying to make it easy...being the operative word.
So...do you think that it would be work switching to a different kit D&D or aFord kit http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/...1&comp=LRS.
would be worth it if I haven't started on the car?
what about the slider?
Thanks.
So...do you think that it would be work switching to a different kit D&D or aFord kit http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/...1&comp=LRS.
would be worth it if I haven't started on the car?
what about the slider?
Thanks.
11-28-2007, 09:35 PM
#5
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 336
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
mjr46:
http://www.ddperformance.com/T-5%20Parts.htm
Part#AK3 and #AK4 rebuilt kit and new synchros from D&D or the Ford Kit?
http://www.ddperformance.com/T-5%20Parts.htm
Part#AK3 and #AK4 rebuilt kit and new synchros from D&D or the Ford Kit?
11-28-2007, 09:44 PM
#6
D.R. THE PATHETIC DORK
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 30,863
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
AK-3 should be all you need to start with the actual synchros are part of the hub that is built on to each gear assembly...and I 'd get a steel input shaft retainer as a upgrade too.........this is all I've ever bought when rebuilding a t-5...that is of course unless upon inspection I find a trashed syhncro hub on one of the gears when apart...then I buy the whole gear
11-28-2007, 10:19 PM
#8
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 6,882
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
11-28-2007, 10:57 PM
#9
6th Gear Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: earleville md
Posts: 10,357
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
www.ddperformance.com for the rebuild kit... i got one through them, its perfect, i did my trans with it...
as for the slider being an issue, ill assume he meant the outer hub of the syncro assembally, ill go ahead and say i dont think this is the case, i would say its prolly worn out syncros(actually the brass blocker rings)... if it is the "slider" well you have 2 options at this point... spend $999 and get a rebuilt trans from D and D (link above), or spend the 200 on a rebuild kit, $xxx on the labor(Assuming ur not doing this yourself?) and a good bit on the ENTIRE syncro assembly...personally i wouldnt just get the outer hub...
as for the slider being an issue, ill assume he meant the outer hub of the syncro assembally, ill go ahead and say i dont think this is the case, i would say its prolly worn out syncros(actually the brass blocker rings)... if it is the "slider" well you have 2 options at this point... spend $999 and get a rebuilt trans from D and D (link above), or spend the 200 on a rebuild kit, $xxx on the labor(Assuming ur not doing this yourself?) and a good bit on the ENTIRE syncro assembly...personally i wouldnt just get the outer hub...
11-28-2007, 11:24 PM
#10
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 336
RE: T-5 rebuild, "world-class" and FRUSTRATION
86 5.0L: thanks again for posting that article. with so many variations of the T-5 out there I want to make sure that I have the right rebuild kit. Like my post said the kit was labeled as Non-world class, and from what the tranny tech told me today he told me there are inconsisencies and this would not even fit (again he hasn't seen my car but a '93 is WC by Ford/ B&W standards).I was sure from all the literature I read that my car was, but it had been awhile since I read that specific part.
Am I correct in now thinking that the kit that I hyperlinked (and now unfortunately own)will not fit, and basically is inferior? This is obviously a big job and I want it done right. Can anyone elsetell by looking at it?
I do not want to make a mistake here with this kit. I was thinking of keeping it for a couple of days and have it taken apartand if it is wrong then I have to move on from there and get another kit. It is just hard to return a kit that I am now uncomfortable with when the shop makes the processdifficult/restocking fees/ and I have none of the original paperwork concerning ordrering it form the manufacturer as the shop did.
I know it is a Natpro kit, and I have the product # on it. Anyone have their info so I can call and verify with them? I did a search online and didn't find it off of Yahoo!
Simple things just keep adding up..boo!
Thank you everyone.
Am I correct in now thinking that the kit that I hyperlinked (and now unfortunately own)will not fit, and basically is inferior? This is obviously a big job and I want it done right. Can anyone elsetell by looking at it?
I do not want to make a mistake here with this kit. I was thinking of keeping it for a couple of days and have it taken apartand if it is wrong then I have to move on from there and get another kit. It is just hard to return a kit that I am now uncomfortable with when the shop makes the processdifficult/restocking fees/ and I have none of the original paperwork concerning ordrering it form the manufacturer as the shop did.
I know it is a Natpro kit, and I have the product # on it. Anyone have their info so I can call and verify with them? I did a search online and didn't find it off of Yahoo!
Simple things just keep adding up..boo!
Thank you everyone.