HELP with my new (to me)94'gt
03-08-2011, 04:37 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: California
Posts: 36
HELP with my new (to me)94'gt
Hey i need a lil help, im completely mustang literate but when it comes to heads im pretty ignorant, i just bought a 94' gt 5speed w/ 130k on the clock , it's completely stock, i want a mid to low 13 second, i got a really good deal on the car so i was able to get a few bolt ons that i haven't installed yet, my plans are as followed; pypes full exhaust "the beast" ,x-pipe no cats, shorty headers, 75mm throttle body, BBK CAi, GT40 heads off Explorer port matched with Holley Stytemax intake manifold, 1:7 rockers, cobra ecu, 24lb hr injectors, Matching MAF sensor, 3:55 gears, pro 5.0 shifter, eibach sportlines, & tokiko shocks & struts. My questions are, should the gt40 heads be exact bolt on? will the 95' cobra ecu connect with no problems? will i need another tune for the injector or will connecting the cobra ecu take care of that? and finally will this set up get me into the 13's? i dont wanna do anything to the lower end of the block because i have 351w im stroking to a 427 for my 66' stang, and cant afford that. also will this set up be good for a daily driver? ... i know its alot but anything from anyone will help.
03-08-2011, 10:56 PM
#2
Yes the GT-40 heads will bolt on, but they are marginally better than stock at best, you should of looked into a set of GT-40 X heads, they're not as good as other brands, however aren't as pricey either, but a big improvement over the iron GT-40s.
A cobra ECU will go in with no problems.
A cobra ECU will go in with no problems.
Last edited by jthorn9; 03-09-2011 at 08:52 PM.
03-09-2011, 09:08 AM
#4
Don't know what you mean by digging the block but there are a lot of ways to do this, how ever a superchargers is the most efficient way. A vortech S/C running 8-10 psi will do it and the only thing you'd need is a 255lb hr fuel pump and some larger fuel injectors, 30lb would deffinitely be large enough, possibly even 24s.
See what you have now will put you around 240 rwhp on a load bearing dyno (like a Mustang or Dyno Dynamics dyno) and will get you in the high 13s if you're a good driver on certain track conditions however you'd probably be more prone to low 14s as your consitant with 13s being the odd ball. So will it get you there, yes, just depends on the track conditions and most importantly, you the driver.
Other options would be to look at a better set of heads as it's the heads and cam that's the choking point in these motors, but your stock cam with 1.7s is a good combo if you have the right heads. Now on the flip side you don't wanna run out there and buy the highest flowing head possible because that won't get you anywhere because now your cam becomes the choke point, so your basic aluminum heads like the GT-40 X series and it's Eddlebrock and Trickflow counterparts are all a little better over the GT-40 iron heads you picked.
In the end you'll get a lot of recommendations for heads cause everybody has an opinion just do what you want to do with the car because each different head type will change the cars performance, mpg, and responisiveness. They also all have their strengths/weaknesses, like iron is stronger/more heat resistant but heavier. Aluminum is lighter and easier to work with, but can warp if the engine gets too hot.
See what you have now will put you around 240 rwhp on a load bearing dyno (like a Mustang or Dyno Dynamics dyno) and will get you in the high 13s if you're a good driver on certain track conditions however you'd probably be more prone to low 14s as your consitant with 13s being the odd ball. So will it get you there, yes, just depends on the track conditions and most importantly, you the driver.
Other options would be to look at a better set of heads as it's the heads and cam that's the choking point in these motors, but your stock cam with 1.7s is a good combo if you have the right heads. Now on the flip side you don't wanna run out there and buy the highest flowing head possible because that won't get you anywhere because now your cam becomes the choke point, so your basic aluminum heads like the GT-40 X series and it's Eddlebrock and Trickflow counterparts are all a little better over the GT-40 iron heads you picked.
In the end you'll get a lot of recommendations for heads cause everybody has an opinion just do what you want to do with the car because each different head type will change the cars performance, mpg, and responisiveness. They also all have their strengths/weaknesses, like iron is stronger/more heat resistant but heavier. Aluminum is lighter and easier to work with, but can warp if the engine gets too hot.
03-09-2011, 09:20 AM
#5
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Lil' Rhody
Posts: 22,376
Dont listen to a single thing that Jthorn just posted... He obviously STILL has his head up his ***. There is no truth to what he said about the Cobra ECM being designed for 118.5° LSA. That is complete horse****. There is no LSA figures programmed in to the ECM. There is no need for you to find a Cobra cam, what so ever.
As for the $500-1000 software to tune the car... bull**** again. A professional dyno tune will run you about $500, but you can buy a Moates Quarterhorse for $250 and tune the car yourself.
You want low to mid 13's? Put the GT-40 heads on, retard your stock cam 4°, drop on the holley intake and 1.7 rockers. Put the 24# injectors in with the Cobra ECM, and keep the extra maf as a spare (yes, that means you can leave your stock one in the car). Ditch the 3.55's for a set of 3.73's or 3.90's. Get some sticky tires. Replace your rear control arms with a good quality set, and set your pinion angle. Buy some foxbody 4 cylinder springs for the front of the car, and cut one coil off the stock rear springs you have now. Replace the shocks with a set of Strange 10 way adjustables.
This combo (if you can drive) will net you a low 13-high 12.
Jthorn, go ahead and get me banned/post approved/whatever... you need to go back to CSMG and stay out of 5.0 tech.
As for the $500-1000 software to tune the car... bull**** again. A professional dyno tune will run you about $500, but you can buy a Moates Quarterhorse for $250 and tune the car yourself.
You want low to mid 13's? Put the GT-40 heads on, retard your stock cam 4°, drop on the holley intake and 1.7 rockers. Put the 24# injectors in with the Cobra ECM, and keep the extra maf as a spare (yes, that means you can leave your stock one in the car). Ditch the 3.55's for a set of 3.73's or 3.90's. Get some sticky tires. Replace your rear control arms with a good quality set, and set your pinion angle. Buy some foxbody 4 cylinder springs for the front of the car, and cut one coil off the stock rear springs you have now. Replace the shocks with a set of Strange 10 way adjustables.
This combo (if you can drive) will net you a low 13-high 12.
Jthorn, go ahead and get me banned/post approved/whatever... you need to go back to CSMG and stay out of 5.0 tech.
03-09-2011, 08:09 PM
#6
Wow adder...bad day at work? Nah you're cool, thanks for the correction and enlightenment on the misinformation. I thought I had read that Ford did program the 118.5* lobe separation the Cobra cam has into the ECU over the 115* the GT has for something with the ecu timing advance. Which from what I could understand causes the idel problems GTs have when running foxbody type cams that run 113* separation.
I just went back and found the site and I did misread that post, but there is a secondary difference between the ECU from a GT and a Cobra. The GT has a 5.0 WOT delay, and the Cobra has a 8.0 WOT delay. This has to do with the timing when entering WOT and is caused by the difference in cams. This number is not measured in seconds just a Ford spec that goes into the ECU that delays timing advance when entering WOT. In short the Cobra ecu takes a split second longer to advance timing than a GT. That's where I misread and I apologize.
Sorry havn't heard of the Moates Quarterhouse don't stay up to date on 5.0 tuning. Last I heard all that was available was the Tweecer and Anderson Motorsport piggy back systems both running $500-1000 and depending on the shop that's the price range for a dyno tune ($250 if you know people) for and OBDI tune.
I just went back and found the site and I did misread that post, but there is a secondary difference between the ECU from a GT and a Cobra. The GT has a 5.0 WOT delay, and the Cobra has a 8.0 WOT delay. This has to do with the timing when entering WOT and is caused by the difference in cams. This number is not measured in seconds just a Ford spec that goes into the ECU that delays timing advance when entering WOT. In short the Cobra ecu takes a split second longer to advance timing than a GT. That's where I misread and I apologize.
Sorry havn't heard of the Moates Quarterhouse don't stay up to date on 5.0 tuning. Last I heard all that was available was the Tweecer and Anderson Motorsport piggy back systems both running $500-1000 and depending on the shop that's the price range for a dyno tune ($250 if you know people) for and OBDI tune.
Last edited by jthorn9; 03-09-2011 at 08:56 PM.
03-09-2011, 11:43 PM
#8
Why such violence in your post adder, no reason for it, have a beer, it's on me lol.
Here is the direct quote from the author:
"Well, there is a bit of misinformation in this thread that I can hopefully clear up. First off there is an emissions delay in closed loop to open loop in a J4J1 processor, in fact there are two of them, one based on coolant temps and time and one based on RPM and time. The J4J1 indeed has a longer delay than a T4M0 - a 95 GT Computer, but it isn't that much. They ALL have this delay. The person who said 5 seconds was probably misled by looking at the numbers in the software because in SCT software the time to delay OL after the ECT temps have met the criteria for OL, is listed as 8.0 - some people interpret this to mean 8.0 seconds - and if that were the case, a car would probably never get to OL on the dyno. The numbers refer to clock tics of the PCM's crystal (which has a clock speed of 15 Mhz). Looking at it that way, it is not a really long wait at all. The delay is there for emissions. We normally zero these delays out on all tunes we do.
The other thing to consider is that once you get on it in 1st gear, you do transition to OL, and there are delays in the PCM code that delay transition back to CL, so you really do NOT start over when going through the gears. There IS a tip-in timing retard, that we normally get rid of too.
Timing is not based on a 'delay' it's basically based on RPM vs. load - and load is roughly volumetric efficiency. There are a number of things used in final spark calculations as well, so setting a target spak value doesn't necessarily mean that's what you'll get. What would happen when you go through the gears is as RPMs rise, load would normally rise, then when you get out of it to shift or even powershift, RPMs would drop and load would drop a little - and in those circumstances spark would not normally drop, just the opposite, at lower loads and RPMs spark usually is raised."
Here is the direct quote from the author:
"Well, there is a bit of misinformation in this thread that I can hopefully clear up. First off there is an emissions delay in closed loop to open loop in a J4J1 processor, in fact there are two of them, one based on coolant temps and time and one based on RPM and time. The J4J1 indeed has a longer delay than a T4M0 - a 95 GT Computer, but it isn't that much. They ALL have this delay. The person who said 5 seconds was probably misled by looking at the numbers in the software because in SCT software the time to delay OL after the ECT temps have met the criteria for OL, is listed as 8.0 - some people interpret this to mean 8.0 seconds - and if that were the case, a car would probably never get to OL on the dyno. The numbers refer to clock tics of the PCM's crystal (which has a clock speed of 15 Mhz). Looking at it that way, it is not a really long wait at all. The delay is there for emissions. We normally zero these delays out on all tunes we do.
The other thing to consider is that once you get on it in 1st gear, you do transition to OL, and there are delays in the PCM code that delay transition back to CL, so you really do NOT start over when going through the gears. There IS a tip-in timing retard, that we normally get rid of too.
Timing is not based on a 'delay' it's basically based on RPM vs. load - and load is roughly volumetric efficiency. There are a number of things used in final spark calculations as well, so setting a target spak value doesn't necessarily mean that's what you'll get. What would happen when you go through the gears is as RPMs rise, load would normally rise, then when you get out of it to shift or even powershift, RPMs would drop and load would drop a little - and in those circumstances spark would not normally drop, just the opposite, at lower loads and RPMs spark usually is raised."
