Dj_Seph

Well. A lot of things have happened. Been a year or maybe more since I last posted. A lot has changed. Started caring for my sister's kids, moved to a nice house, totalled my black fox that most of you probably won't even remember. And now I have this red fox and 10k thanks to taxes to play with.

What I need your help with is places to get parts at the best price and routes to go. In the end, I want to end with a turbo 331/363 making about 700hp. The car must be manual as it'll be a road racing car. With my budget, where should I start? I'm currently building a rearend and swapping to five lug as we speak so consider 1.8k of that 10k gone. Also the car will be a DD so it will retain P/S and A/C, no exceptions. So here goes the parts list I think of.

DART SHP block: Best place to get this? Right now I'm looking at ADperformance for 1,799.

363 SCAT forged "Big Bore" stroker kit with JE pistons or 331 SCAT forged: 1,899/1,699 through ADperformance. Is it worth it to get dished or should I stick flat since I won't be doing much boost nor running turbo for 2-3 years after this motor build.

Transmission: Now here's where I get gummed up. What to do about tranny. Drop the almost 4k for a t56 viper spec from D&D or go for a TKO600? Which will handle my goals? The car will still be a DD so I need it reliable and not have to clinch my cheeks praying I don't break when I launch.

Heads: What should I do for this? I'm guessing with a 363 I really need 205 or better heads? I know 185s will be great for a 331. What are my options here to keep cost down? I see a lot use AFR 220 heads with this setup but god, them things are 2k alone. Could some 185s do the trick or another brand like trickflow? Need options here.

Injectors: Another one I have no clue on.

Upper intake: Up in the air.

Engine management: Will I just be able to use the whole mass air calibrated to fuel injectors thing while the car is NA? Serious help needed in this section.

Cooling: I live in AZ so what should I do here? Will a Fluidyne radiator and Black Extreme fan work or do I need something more?

I'm sure I'm missing some other necessary things so please add in what you believe I should really get. Also if you have any links to used or people with better deals LET ME KNOW. I'm not opposed to getting used equipment as long as it's in good working order. Just need some help. Never knew engine building was so damn stressful. Also don't worry, car already has turbular k-member, torque box reinforced, Stiffler's FIT, and tubular A-arms on the way for it. Thanks in advance for any help!+

mjr46

save yourself a headache on the motor and have Jim at www.fordstrokers.com build it......he'll do the 363 right and it'll last, all he builds are strokers.........I'm still running a stock block 347 he built almost 5 years ago for me. Jim can set you up with some killer tfs 205's or ED at www.flowrtechinduction.com set me up with some custom 203cc tfs tw's on my 347

barnett468

700 HP with only 10k to spend in a manual trans car and you don't want to break when you launch. Ahhh, ha, ha.


radiator depends on exactly what the fluidyne is. You can run a $1,000.00 custom dual or tripple pass aluminum radiator set up from mattsons radiator or possibly a triple pass optime core brass one from cool craft in arizona.


HEADS - Buy the $2000.00 afr 22O outlaw heads or the 205 heads and be done with it. they both come in 58 or 72 cc's. You could also save some money and buy some nice pro comp chinese heads for around $700.00.

http://www.airflowresearch.com/index.php?cPath=21_104


COMPRESSION - Here's a problem. What octane will you run and how much boost will you run?


RODS - i would run high quality $800.00 rods like carrillos, not the cheap chinese scat or eagle ones.


ROCKERS - scorpion or jessel shaft mount rocker arms.


PISTONS - $900.00 custom je forged pistons for turbos and superchargers


BLOCK - I would buy a ford racing block, they are the same price as the shp.


ati crank damper.


SOLID ROLLER CAM WITH ANYTHING BUT COMP LIFTERS. ELGINS, CRANES ETC. ARE GOOD


for used high perf parts try racingjunk.com


read this

http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/e..._ford_windsor/

http://www.joeshermanracing.com/347_..._combo_16.html

Dj_Seph

Yeah, hence why with the 10k I now only plan for about 500NA which I've seen done easily with a 363 on dished pistons. I'll be happy with that for the time being.

And for the radiators, what brands are these? I've never heard of them. I have a fluidyne 3 core. It's pretty massive and has served me well for a good while romping the crap out of my car but I'm not sure if it will be enough or not.

Also why the ford block over the dart SHP?

mjr46

nice and pro comp don't belong in the same sentence........valvetrain is utter junk, no reason to buy a dart block and top it off with a turds on top

barnett468

hi, ok, if you go na and run 91 - 93 octane you need around 10.5:1 - 10.75:1 static compression, it depends on the cam. if you run E85 corn gas you can go around 1 point higher.

with a true 500 hp it will have a very, very nasty idle.

i like torque so i would go with the 363 if possible, the 331 will need to spin more rpm's than a 363 to get 500 hp.

at 500 hp the dart block is fine. i would use the ford one only because it is a ford one and joe sherman uses it, otherwise there's likely not a huge diff.


fluidyne makes a few different rads. i would need to know exactly which one you have and your current fan set up etc however at 500 hp you might just run what you have and if it gesticulates in the 110 az summer heayt on the way to the macdonalds car shoe gut a bigger one then.

mattsons is a high end custom rad mfg.

the multi pass rads are very good.

us rad/cool craft is a huge us rad mfg.


if you are using a stroke for a 347 and getting the rest of the cubes from the bore that is ok. you do not want to stroke a 4.0" 8.2 tall block to 363 cubes believe me.

the 205 afr race heads will get you there, 220's are excessive.

eagle or scat rods with arp rod bolts are fine for 500 hp.

INTAKE - Intake is hard to say, probably a stealth high rise dual plane. I have seen a zillion dyno tests comparing tons of different intakes and rarely does a single plane have more hp than a good dual plane on a street engine plus the dual planes have much better perf below around 4000 rpm.

i would run an annular boost venturi carb around a 700. the race demons are very good but have no choke but you don't want a choke on a high perf engine.

hydraulic roller lifters will work fine for 500 hp.

IGNITION - buy a high voltage coil or hei set up and a cheap old msd 6al box. the box will get you around 5% more hp between around 1800 and 2400 rpm.

barnett468

i was hoping he would get the joke.

i'm waiting for the pro comp aluminum rods and crank.

Dj_Seph

Also forgot to put, it will be fuel injected. I'm not a carb guy at all. I can tune a little through laptop though. Probably going to get a megasquirt or something similar.

Also, I was planning to get a DART SHP 4.125x8.5 block buuut seems things have worked a little in my favor. Local out here build the SAME motor I planned to except with domed pistons and is selling for 3k. Probably would take 2.8k. What can I look at to make sure it's an actual SHP block and a 363?

mjr46

wouldn't use a dome piston set up.......depending on the head/chamber size compression won't be pump gas friendly....flat tops are all you need.
Easy 500+ = Dart 363, custom tfs 205cc's, custom cam with matched valve train, tfs box r intake and with all the other supporting mods easy 10.50-10.70 car......had a friend with such, with almost same set up.

barnett468

yeah you need the bore, stroke, head combustion chamber cc and the volume of the dome and your intake valve closing time, then calculate what your duynamic compression and cylinder cranking pressure is. if the cylinder pressure is over around 180 you will likely need E85 corn gas or race fuel.