Baddog

Portmaster or others in the know please comment on this mill. I have more specs on the motor I continually talk about but have known little of in the past. Keep in mind I'm just transferring what I've been told, many of these numbers could be written in Chinese and it would be the same to me. Here goes...

-DSS .030 over smallblock 302
-forged pistons
-TW heads
-202 valves
-cam specs 609/596 232/224 whatever that means
-Victor intake
-190lph fuel pump
-24lb injectors (30's apparently purged raw fuel and were too much)
-shotpeened crank and rods
-stud girdle?
-high flow oil pump and electric fan
-custom chip


The car has the same Koni's and CC plates as mine and every other bolt on except they're matched for his motor. He also has an SVO front brake upgrade and a TKO 600. This car eats Termi's with ease and I'm just curious as to what kind of power you think it makes. It hasn't been on a dyno but the builder touts 475 at the crank. Thanks in advance for any input. It's in an '87 vert BTW...

Baddog

Just realized after reading this that it belongs in the 5.0 section and not S/S. Mods please move this to the applicable forum. Thanks...

ahittz24

hmm 24lb injectors only support up to 350hp before they max out.

a DSS motor will blow up if it exceeds 50hp (joking, but not really)

I just cannot buy the 475hp mark with those mods listed, 320-330, maybe, and beating 03-04 cobras? they must need new drivers.

Portmaster

Weeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll. Heres the deal. I think the cam spec's are turned around backwards and should prob read 224/232 and 596/609 and depending on which TW heads he has would also be a determining factor. It sounds as if he built a high rpm engine and high rpm normally makes good numbers on the dyno. On a Naturally aspirated engine it is possible to get up into the 425+ hp range on 24 lb injectors (most people won't beleive it) but 475 is pushing it just a little. It's hard to say in a case like this not knowing all the fine details of the engine but if his cam is a custom grind solid roller or a custom ground "short lashed" hyd roller he sholdn't have any problem shooting to 7,000 rpm mark. It prob wouldn't be making peak torque until about 5000 rpm but if he knows how to keep the rpms up on it he just may be able to walk away from a stock terminator.

While the Naysayers may not buy into the injector but I'll give you an example. My wifes car (2003 GT) puts down 320 hp at the rear wheels in a N/A 4.6 with ported stock heads(larger valves), Comp XE262 cams, long tubes,Adjustable timing gears, Ported Typhoon intake,70mm T body and the rest of the usual suspects of mods and a tune and runs on 21lb injectors. Figuring the HP at the crank losing 20% through the driveline (automatic) it's putting out around 400 hp at the crank. I have a friend that I built his car the same way but he has short tubes, hasn't it had it tuned because he's about to install a Vortec and it put's down 305 at the wheels so thats about 375 at the flywheel on 19lb injectors.

As far as the terminator mustangs go it doesnt take but about 15 minutes to wake one of them up. Most of them we have had with a ported blower, smaller pulley and a tune will lay down an easy 500 at the wheels with the torque numbers as well. So your bud better pick his races well. I doubt he could touch many of the ones in my area. He's prob picking on the older non blown Cobras.

AdderMk2

475 crank hp, out of a 306... WITHOUT boost... must be turning it at like 9k


I've got a bridge for sale if you are interested

Portmaster

With a set of CNC 185 Twisted Wedge heads,10.5+ compression with that cam and a Victor intake that 306 would be making some serious high end power if tuned right. Throw a set of 4:10-4:30s in it and your in there.

USMCrebel

i know it's not 475, but still it's a nice little read if you get bored

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...dup/index.html

Portmaster

Oh yea of little faith. It could make that just before 7000 rpm. You can build a 500 hp 306 with all off the shelf parts and run it on 93 octane pump gas. It's easy to build Hp but quite another to build the power where it works on the street.

I could take a 306 and just off the top of my head on all off the shelf parts as following

Well built 306
Trick Flow CNC 185's or AFR 185 or Victor Jr 210's, Pro Comp 210s
Comp Cams 288 solid "street" roller
11.1 compresion
Holley HP 750 "Street" Carb
and any decent ignition system and that thing would fly up to 500 "flyweel" hp easily. This engine wouldn't be very short on torque either. Thrown in a car that weighs less than 2500 lbs and you better know how to drive. We were building 380 hp 289s in 1968 with factory iron ported 289 castings, stock rods, Holman & Moody intake, solid flat tappet cam and a 780 holley with a dual point distributor.

If the bottom end can hold up to the rpm 500 hp is a cake walk these days. Most engines you see today as in strokers and such have to make the power down low the keep the engine in a safe rpm. A 306 can make the same HP as a 347 becuase it's better suited to high rpm with the shorter stroke. 347's rule the street becuse it's having to push a heavy street car. If I had a little Cobra Kit car. I'd build a little solid roller 306 for it and go Viper hunting.

Baddog

Portmaster, he runs 11.1 compression and Chevron 94 octane fuel. Beleive me man, it's the 03/04 Cobra's that I was talking about dusting, not the N/A 320hp model. Keep in mind it's an optionless vert that is a 4cyl conversion. It doesn't weigh much and you're right, it pulls like a wild banshee all the way to 7500. I'm not an a$$hole, I'm not trying to **** Cobra owners off, Im aware a worked one is a faster car but my buddy has no problem dispatching stock ones and I've been a passenger on several occasions to prove the fact. I always figured it made in the ballpark of 425-450hp so I figure you're pretty close with your estimate. It also has 3.55's and he just blew 5th gear which he redlined easily. He has a 125shot uninstalled at the moment for altercations with bikes and Vipers, and yes the motor can handle it. It's a fairly expensive motor by all accounts, he spared no costs. I'm sure I left a few things out but he knows his ****, don't let my reversed cam specs fool you LOL, I'm pretty green about things like that. He had the means to do a 347 but preferred the 306 for the way it makes power on the high end. Thanks for your comments.

ahittz24

I am not trying to take anything away from you by any means, and port seems to know his stuff, but I am still skeptical about this build. Everything would have to be almost so perfect to run 7500 RPM, Engine would have to be fully balanced, spring rates all matched perfect for the cam setup, and I just cant believe somone would put all that work onto a DSS short block. But if it exists, then more power to him.