Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
04-13-2008, 12:24 PM
#11
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Long Island
Posts: 191
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
I still recommend throwing them in a river.
ORIGINAL: crazystylin
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
04-13-2008, 12:49 PM
#12
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location:
Posts: 1,602
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: MustangEsq
Why?
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
I still recommend throwing them in a river.
ORIGINAL: crazystylin
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
I am sick of idiots not knowing what the hell they are talking about.
$400....4HP. Long tubes, 18-25 HP for about $700.Shorty headers are totallyworthless no matter what kind of spin you try to put on it. Quit trying to argue your ridiculous opinionsand stfu.
04-13-2008, 02:43 PM
#13
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Long Island
Posts: 191
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
How about a reputable source like Brenspeed? Does that qualify your highness?
I am sick of idiots not knowing what the hell they are talking about.
$400....4HP. Long tubes, 18-25 HP for about $700.Shorty headers are totallyworthless no matter what kind of spin you try to put on it. Quit trying to argue your ridiculous opinionsand stfu.
ORIGINAL: MustangEsq
Why?
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
I still recommend throwing them in a river.
ORIGINAL: crazystylin
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
I am sick of idiots not knowing what the hell they are talking about.
$400....4HP. Long tubes, 18-25 HP for about $700.Shorty headers are totallyworthless no matter what kind of spin you try to put on it. Quit trying to argue your ridiculous opinionsand stfu.
Kooks...ARH??? $700??? in your dreams....try $1300-1500...
18-25hp...maybe on an FI application...N/A looking at 10-15. I'll take my $1000 and leave 3hp on the table, your highness.
My ridiculous opinions...I HAVE THESE ON MY CAR AND AM SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE. My car has much more throttle response throughtout the powerband. What application are you running BTW? stock exhaust manifolds, huh...Keep on reading the forums son...and believe every word of what you read.
04-13-2008, 03:08 PM
#14
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location:
Posts: 1,599
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
Well if you look at the dyno chart of the bbk shorties that were tested, they actually lose power up top. The main gains are down at 3k rpms where they pick up almost 20 ft lbs of torque, which is much more usable power for a street car. I'm no expert, but I would suggest shorties for N/A DD's and Long tubes for high speed racing, FI, or people who want to brag that they have an extra 25hp.
EDIT: Here is the link to the numbers. http://www.mustangmonthly.com/techar...o_results.html
EDIT: Here is the link to the numbers. http://www.mustangmonthly.com/techar...o_results.html
04-13-2008, 05:53 PM
#15
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location:
Posts: 1,602
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: MustangEsq
hmm...very odd...Dave at Brenspeed said different when I purchased mine...said for a street car I would see better low-mid gains with still a decent peak gain...370 delivered.
Kooks...ARH??? $700??? in your dreams....try $1300-1500...
18-25hp...maybe on an FI application...N/A looking at 10-15. I'll take my $1000 and leave 3hp on the table, your highness.
My ridiculous opinions...I HAVE THESE ON MY CAR AND AM SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE. My car has much more throttle response throughtout the powerband. What application are you running BTW? stock exhaust manifolds, huh...Keep on reading the forums son...and believe every word of what you read.
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
How about a reputable source like Brenspeed? Does that qualify your highness?
I am sick of idiots not knowing what the hell they are talking about.
$400....4HP. Long tubes, 18-25 HP for about $700.Shorty headers are totallyworthless no matter what kind of spin you try to put on it. Quit trying to argue your ridiculous opinionsand stfu.
ORIGINAL: MustangEsq
Why?
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
I still recommend throwing them in a river.
ORIGINAL: crazystylin
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
OK, PLEASE ADVISE:
I am not concerned with having shiny chromed out headers and am comfortable with a low profile look.
Instead of buying shorty ceramic coated headers, would you think the following would work well:
Ordering a pair of good quality 304 s/s shorty headers, like BBKs or (YOUR RECOMENDATIONS HERE) and spraying them with several coats of high temp blk paint or (YOUR RECOMENDATION HERE). Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
OR[/align]
In addition to painting/coating them, wrapping them with header wrap. Would this significantly decrease heat soak/engine bay temps????
The reason I don't mind a black painted or wrapped finish is because I think it would have a better chance of being overlooked during a CA SMOG/5.0 inspection. Keep'n it low profile with the added gains is fine by me, as I am buying for the go, not the show.[/align]
Because you read a internet message board?
Do you have them on your car?
Have you ever seen a comparable comparison between shorties and l/t's?
I am honestly getting sick of people who post regurgitated BS...
I am sick of idiots not knowing what the hell they are talking about.
$400....4HP. Long tubes, 18-25 HP for about $700.Shorty headers are totallyworthless no matter what kind of spin you try to put on it. Quit trying to argue your ridiculous opinionsand stfu.
Kooks...ARH??? $700??? in your dreams....try $1300-1500...
18-25hp...maybe on an FI application...N/A looking at 10-15. I'll take my $1000 and leave 3hp on the table, your highness.
My ridiculous opinions...I HAVE THESE ON MY CAR AND AM SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE. My car has much more throttle response throughtout the powerband. What application are you running BTW? stock exhaust manifolds, huh...Keep on reading the forums son...and believe every word of what you read.
On behalf of all people on this forum, and all people who know anything about cars everywhere, please accept my apology! Apparently since you bought shorty headers you are 100% right and we all have been wrong the whole time!
Oh my God I am so stupid! And you're so totally right about me getting all my info from mindless people on forums!
Now I'll feel better when I get my shorty headers. I won't feel like I have to make up facts to justify my purchase. I'll be well on my way to 1000 horsepower. And thank God they are so cheap....you're right I checked and long tubes are like $25,000...and only 1HP gain.
04-13-2008, 06:12 PM
#17
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 24
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
Suoperdave84 you could probably make your point without looking like an indignant know it all, no one listens to a know it all. Being right doesnt give one the right to be demeaning especially when he presents a point and supports it with evidence. Now play nice.
04-13-2008, 06:56 PM
#18
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Babylon, NY
Posts: 3,031
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
With a good shorty header and mid pipe with high flow cats you can see 15 hp or more. PM F1fan for his story, and he has no reason to lie. LT's probably 20 hp or so.Bt there are stories of moreand less out there. For example, one of my patients is the co-president of ARH, and I ran into him at a local bar/restaurant. He was trying to tell me that, on my S/C car I could see 50hp! Now this goes against everything I've seen or read on the subject for our S197's. But he kept insisting that on a S/C car he has seen 50hp gains.
WellI didn't have to take his word for it as a friend of mine with a Shelby GT and Shelby/Paxton S/C running meth injection and putting 500hp to the wheels soon after bought a set of ARHLT's and catted X pipe for his car. Prior to that he was runningstock exhaustexcept for Borla Stingers. He kept the Borla Stingers on and replaced everything else as mentioned above and gained.....a whopping 6 hp! Of course my patient kept scratching his head in disbelief but the dyno he used is a local one that is recommended by ARH and it doesn't lie. Now I also know of N/A guys who gained 22 hp with the same setup!
So for me, I wanted to keep an H-pipe, so it was either set of $370 BBK ceramic shorties with which I could keep my cats and H-pipe, or $1300 for a LT and H-pipe setup from ARH. (for LT's I would only use Kooks or ARH) So the decision was easy.
All I can say is, it's best to test and tune, test and tune, and don't believe everything you read or hear. Every car and application is different. And callout F1fan and get his story!
WellI didn't have to take his word for it as a friend of mine with a Shelby GT and Shelby/Paxton S/C running meth injection and putting 500hp to the wheels soon after bought a set of ARHLT's and catted X pipe for his car. Prior to that he was runningstock exhaustexcept for Borla Stingers. He kept the Borla Stingers on and replaced everything else as mentioned above and gained.....a whopping 6 hp! Of course my patient kept scratching his head in disbelief but the dyno he used is a local one that is recommended by ARH and it doesn't lie. Now I also know of N/A guys who gained 22 hp with the same setup!
So for me, I wanted to keep an H-pipe, so it was either set of $370 BBK ceramic shorties with which I could keep my cats and H-pipe, or $1300 for a LT and H-pipe setup from ARH. (for LT's I would only use Kooks or ARH) So the decision was easy.
All I can say is, it's best to test and tune, test and tune, and don't believe everything you read or hear. Every car and application is different. And callout F1fan and get his story!
04-14-2008, 01:35 AM
#19
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 4,552
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: crazystylin
I respectfully disagree. With the mods and exhaust I haveon now I will see some very nice mid range tq and hp gains.
HOWEVER, THE QUESTION IS NOT WHETHER I SHOULD BUY SHORTIES, IT IS WHETHER I CAN COAT THE S/S WITH HIGH TEMP PAINT AND REDUCE ENGINE HEAT.
I live in CA, and they have visual inspections, I don't want JBA, I want BBK, my choice.I think blk paint coated shorties will pass a visual inspection from a cop or smog inspector as the headers sit near the bottom of the engine bay.
ORIGINAL: suoperdave84
Tie a chain to shorty headers and use them as an anchor in your fishing boat. That's about all they are good for.
Tie a chain to shorty headers and use them as an anchor in your fishing boat. That's about all they are good for.
HOWEVER, THE QUESTION IS NOT WHETHER I SHOULD BUY SHORTIES, IT IS WHETHER I CAN COAT THE S/S WITH HIGH TEMP PAINT AND REDUCE ENGINE HEAT.
I live in CA, and they have visual inspections, I don't want JBA, I want BBK, my choice.I think blk paint coated shorties will pass a visual inspection from a cop or smog inspector as the headers sit near the bottom of the engine bay.
1. JBA uses thicker steel to make their headers.
2. They are CARB legal. Big deal for those of us in CA. If you wrap or coat your BBKs the smog inspector will send you to a referee and you will have to pay gain for the appointment and the smog check. Then you will have to un-wrap the headers to show them the CARB# or lack there of and then you will be screwed. A friend had the JBAs put on about 13-14 years ago and the welds broke on the CARB plate (or rusted off)and thus the CARB # fell off somewhere. He had to buy one header and put it on his car with a CARB # just so he could pass.
3. I'm not sure if they are equal length but that is very important.
04-14-2008, 01:38 AM
#20
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 4,552
RE: Jimmying the finish of shorty headers - yes or no?
ORIGINAL: mustangford289
Suoperdave84 you could probably make your point without looking like an indignant know it all, no one listens to a know it all. Being right doesnt give one the right to be demeaning especially when he presents a point and supports it with evidence. Now play nice.
Suoperdave84 you could probably make your point without looking like an indignant know it all, no one listens to a know it all. Being right doesnt give one the right to be demeaning especially when he presents a point and supports it with evidence. Now play nice.