Redline
06-26-2005, 09:51 PM
#22
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location:
Posts: 516
RE: Redline
Remember too, that this thing has overhead cams. Which means that the valve springs have it rather easy because they are not trying to return a heavy rockerarm,pushrod, and lifter to their seats, so to speak. And it has two small, lightweight intake valves that dont need much spring pressure to return them, either. I would think the rods would go at high rpm before the valves would float. At least on a new engine.
I thought Don's was pushing the limit but he has now been usurped. Btw, nice cars though 
07-28-2005, 03:36 PM
#25
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 17
RE: Redline
ORIGINAL: Crazyhorse393
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
Would a Predator tune help with the throttle response problem, too?
Is it strictly the rev limit mod which corrects this problem?
Does a CAI installation have any effect on throttle response?
Is the Xcalibur limited to downloaded tunes or are the parameters individually adjustable as in the Predator?
I guess what I'm really wondering is if the throttle response can be improved without accepting a complete tune. I'm from the old school that used to change distributor springs & weights in order to alter a timing curve. And I like making one change at a time to weigh the benefits of that particular modification. I'm still trying to get a handle on what these computerized tuners can do.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
07-28-2005, 05:14 PM
#26
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 336
RE: Redline
ORIGINAL: dzcues
Great report! I haven't received my '06 GT yet but I'm trying to learn which mods to perform when it arrives. Maybe someone can clarify a few things:
Would a Predator tune help with the throttle response problem, too?
Is it strictly the rev limit mod which corrects this problem?
Does a CAI installation have any effect on throttle response?
Is the Xcalibur limited to downloaded tunes or are the parameters individually adjustable as in the Predator?
I guess what I'm really wondering is if the throttle response can be improved without accepting a complete tune. I'm from the old school that used to change distributor springs & weights in order to alter a timing curve. And I like making one change at a time to weigh the benefits of that particular modification. I'm still trying to get a handle on what these computerized tuners can do.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
ORIGINAL: Crazyhorse393
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
Would a Predator tune help with the throttle response problem, too?
Is it strictly the rev limit mod which corrects this problem?
Does a CAI installation have any effect on throttle response?
Is the Xcalibur limited to downloaded tunes or are the parameters individually adjustable as in the Predator?
I guess what I'm really wondering is if the throttle response can be improved without accepting a complete tune. I'm from the old school that used to change distributor springs & weights in order to alter a timing curve. And I like making one change at a time to weigh the benefits of that particular modification. I'm still trying to get a handle on what these computerized tuners can do.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
It is very difficult and perhaps cost preventative on the 2005 mustang to increase timing by swapping in parts. You need a tune. The comptuer controls all parameters including a/f at specific RPMS. The 2005 mustang also has dual knock sensors that are extremely accurate and they will pull or add timing depending on the situation. The easiest way to increase performance (and perhaps the only way) is with a new tune.
X-Calibrator 2 will allow you to control individual parameters, I'm a beta tester on this right now. This functionality will be available to everyone in August. The pred already has this ability.
07-28-2005, 09:17 PM
#27
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 17
RE: Redline
ORIGINAL: bahbahblacksheep
The throttle in the 2005 mustang (like most new cars today) is "drive by wire". What this means is that the throttle is electronically controlled. In the old days, there was a direct link between the accelerator pedal and the carburetor via a cable which controlled speed. But now this direct link does not exist. The accelerator pedal is interpretted by a computer which determines how much gas/air etc. which translates to speed. Because everything is controlled by the computer, you will need a tune to control the throttle response.
It is very difficult and perhaps cost preventative on the 2005 mustang to increase timing by swapping in parts. You need a tune. The comptuer controls all parameters including a/f at specific RPMS. The 2005 mustang also has dual knock sensors that are extremely accurate and they will pull or add timing depending on the situation. The easiest way to increase performance (and perhaps the only way) is with a new tune.
X-Calibrator 2 will allow you to control individual parameters, I'm a beta tester on this right now. This functionality will be available to everyone in August. The pred already has this ability.
ORIGINAL: dzcues
Great report! I haven't received my '06 GT yet but I'm trying to learn which mods to perform when it arrives. Maybe someone can clarify a few things:
Would a Predator tune help with the throttle response problem, too?
Is it strictly the rev limit mod which corrects this problem?
Does a CAI installation have any effect on throttle response?
Is the Xcalibur limited to downloaded tunes or are the parameters individually adjustable as in the Predator?
I guess what I'm really wondering is if the throttle response can be improved without accepting a complete tune. I'm from the old school that used to change distributor springs & weights in order to alter a timing curve. And I like making one change at a time to weigh the benefits of that particular modification. I'm still trying to get a handle on what these computerized tuners can do.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
ORIGINAL: Crazyhorse393
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
(snipped for relevance)
One of the biggest reasons for raising the limit is throttle response. ...
Throttle response on the new mustang sucks. Because it is the "throttle by wire" type it can't be thrown open as quickly as a linkage type throttle setup. By raising the rev limit it actually speeds up the throttle response on the car giving you a positive throttle feel that you are likely more used to. It slams open quicker.
So in my opinion, if I were going to change the rev limit, it would be for the throttle response. You will feel more on the "seat of the pants meter" from the improve throttle. The additional power is just an added benefit. I would not raise the limit higher than 6500. There is no power gain at that 6500 RPM, the only benefit is the faster throttle. The HP gains you will see will be lower in the band. You will still want to shift at the same point as before. Give ar take a couple a hundred Rs.
Would a Predator tune help with the throttle response problem, too?
Is it strictly the rev limit mod which corrects this problem?
Does a CAI installation have any effect on throttle response?
Is the Xcalibur limited to downloaded tunes or are the parameters individually adjustable as in the Predator?
I guess what I'm really wondering is if the throttle response can be improved without accepting a complete tune. I'm from the old school that used to change distributor springs & weights in order to alter a timing curve. And I like making one change at a time to weigh the benefits of that particular modification. I'm still trying to get a handle on what these computerized tuners can do.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
It is very difficult and perhaps cost preventative on the 2005 mustang to increase timing by swapping in parts. You need a tune. The comptuer controls all parameters including a/f at specific RPMS. The 2005 mustang also has dual knock sensors that are extremely accurate and they will pull or add timing depending on the situation. The easiest way to increase performance (and perhaps the only way) is with a new tune.
X-Calibrator 2 will allow you to control individual parameters, I'm a beta tester on this right now. This functionality will be available to everyone in August. The pred already has this ability.
If I may pursue this: if, FOR THE SAKE OF ARGUMENT, one decided to shut down the rev limiter via a Predator or XCaliber, would that single parameter change suffice to correct the throttle response?
What I'm trying to determine, strictly to satisfy my own curiosity, is if that single parameter is what governs the "cushioning" effect on the throttle. It makes sense, if the rev limiter being ON attempts to cushion the approach to redline, then turning it OFF might eliminate the cushion. Or...is it a combination of tuning changes that improve the response.
Actually, that brings to mind another purely hypothetical question: can the computer tuners be used to change ONLY one parameter, for example: turning the rev limiter ON or OFF?
07-29-2005, 08:41 PM
#28
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 336
RE: Redline
I don't think that raising the rev limiter on its own is going to increase throttle response. The tune would also have to call for more torque in various RPM ranges to make the car more responsive.
I don't know about the pred, but with Steeda and the X-Cal 2, they give you max boundary limits (for your own safety) and you can set it somewhere in the range. Mines set at 6500rpm...just a tad more than the factory 6250 before you hit fuel cutoff. You don't want to rev too high anyways because the 4.6L 3V makes max power at about 5500rpm or there abouts so it would be to your detriment to rev way higher. The only reason you would want to rev a little higher is so that when the next gear engages, it will be in a good rpm where it can make power
I don't know about the pred, but with Steeda and the X-Cal 2, they give you max boundary limits (for your own safety) and you can set it somewhere in the range. Mines set at 6500rpm...just a tad more than the factory 6250 before you hit fuel cutoff. You don't want to rev too high anyways because the 4.6L 3V makes max power at about 5500rpm or there abouts so it would be to your detriment to rev way higher. The only reason you would want to rev a little higher is so that when the next gear engages, it will be in a good rpm where it can make power
07-29-2005, 10:09 PM
#29
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location:
Posts: 273
RE: Redline
with the agressive tune sent with my Xcal2, it pulls hard all the way to the 6600 red line. It hits it quick in first, usually before I even quit spinning. I have to be carefull because I'll hit it in most of the gears. TUFF motor! And to think I didnt like Fords till I got this one...
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