Coil-Over or Springs???
07-24-2006, 09:34 PM
#11
1st Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 129
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
07-25-2006, 10:12 PM
#13
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Temecula, CA ...SoCal....
Posts: 345
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
I am going to get coilovers myself.
I looked at H&R, Tein, KW, Eibach, Ground Control, and a few more I can't think of off the top of my head. The reason that I am going with the coiovers is because of the full adjustablility for the car. So, while I have the stock wheels on now, I can dump the crap out of the car. But when I have the nice wheels on I can make the car have no wheel gap (which is very important to me).
Also, the reason that I have chosen the Eibach set over all the others is as follows:
H&R: The set isn't refined enough for me. This was initailly my first choice, and I was dead-set on them until they finally released the pics of them. I was disappointed to say the least. They didn't have the top mount or "pillow mount" as they call it.
Tein: Its a bit pricey, and they are really harsh riding for just normal street driving everyday. If I was going to track the car, and it be only a track car, I would get these hands down.
Ground Control: Super awesome kit!!! I was going to get this one up until a week or so ago when I found the Eibach. This kit has everything, the yellow Koni's, the camber plates, the awesome GS coiloiver system. The reason that I didn't go with this kit is because it is a bit pricey, and for only driving the street I didn't think that I would see a difference between this and the Eibach. And again, if I had the money and I was going to track the car, this would be the second choice to the Tein.
Eibach: I went with this system because it is from trusty Eibach and it had all the components that I really needed. Obviously it doesn't have all the goodies that the GS does, but it is perfect for everyday street use. And being a SoCal girl, I can run over to Brothers and pick it up!
The other kits follow the same pattern, just lacking refinement really. And if this is what my car is going to be rolling around on, it has to be up to the high standards that I trust and from a company that I trust.
I hope that this helps you guys!
I looked at H&R, Tein, KW, Eibach, Ground Control, and a few more I can't think of off the top of my head. The reason that I am going with the coiovers is because of the full adjustablility for the car. So, while I have the stock wheels on now, I can dump the crap out of the car. But when I have the nice wheels on I can make the car have no wheel gap (which is very important to me).
Also, the reason that I have chosen the Eibach set over all the others is as follows:
H&R: The set isn't refined enough for me. This was initailly my first choice, and I was dead-set on them until they finally released the pics of them. I was disappointed to say the least. They didn't have the top mount or "pillow mount" as they call it.
Tein: Its a bit pricey, and they are really harsh riding for just normal street driving everyday. If I was going to track the car, and it be only a track car, I would get these hands down.
Ground Control: Super awesome kit!!! I was going to get this one up until a week or so ago when I found the Eibach. This kit has everything, the yellow Koni's, the camber plates, the awesome GS coiloiver system. The reason that I didn't go with this kit is because it is a bit pricey, and for only driving the street I didn't think that I would see a difference between this and the Eibach. And again, if I had the money and I was going to track the car, this would be the second choice to the Tein.
Eibach: I went with this system because it is from trusty Eibach and it had all the components that I really needed. Obviously it doesn't have all the goodies that the GS does, but it is perfect for everyday street use. And being a SoCal girl, I can run over to Brothers and pick it up!
The other kits follow the same pattern, just lacking refinement really. And if this is what my car is going to be rolling around on, it has to be up to the high standards that I trust and from a company that I trust.
I hope that this helps you guys!
07-25-2006, 10:13 PM
#14
1st Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 129
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
This Tein coilovers looks like the best on the market! I wish someone on the forum had some feedback! I am sure they are better than replacing shocks and springs. This way you replece them both in one swoop and you have the option of change the height and firmness. Looks to me that it is the best way to go.
http://www.prostreetonline.com/buy/t...s/dsg12-kuas2/
http://www.tein.com/ss1damp.html
Only drawback I can see is that they are BABY SH*T green!!!! [sm=feedback.gif]
http://www.prostreetonline.com/buy/t...s/dsg12-kuas2/
http://www.tein.com/ss1damp.html
Only drawback I can see is that they are BABY SH*T green!!!! [sm=feedback.gif]
07-25-2006, 10:41 PM
#15
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location:
Posts: 62
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
I just installed the Eibach sportlines.It dropped my car 2 inches front and 2 1/2" rear.It rides really nice still and handles the corners much better,almost as good as my c5.I will eventually go with coil overs for the fact i want to lower the car another rinch when i put the 20 inch wheels on.I want zero gap,and the clearance from the rocker panels to ground around 2 inches.
It me about 6 hours in the driveway with 2 jack stands and a ton floor jack,i didn't even use spring compressors.
It me about 6 hours in the driveway with 2 jack stands and a ton floor jack,i didn't even use spring compressors.
07-25-2006, 11:05 PM
#16
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Peoria, AZ
Posts: 382
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
The Teins would be a fabulous setup, though I am imagining as I have not tried them. They make a fantastic product which is durable, precise and rebuildable. You can get them revalved and change the springs at any time. The only reasons not to get them are you can't afford them or you don't like cornering.
I had a set of JIC Magic FLT-A2 on my last daily driver and I loved them, and they're pretty much road race coilovers. They certainly could be rough at times... railroad crossings were brutal, old craggly streets downtown were annoying... but every single moment in between was fantastic. Cornering was dead flat, even lane changes could be exciting, and communication with the road was awesome.
I will be going with a set of Tein Flex or comparable as soon as it is within reach.
I had a set of JIC Magic FLT-A2 on my last daily driver and I loved them, and they're pretty much road race coilovers. They certainly could be rough at times... railroad crossings were brutal, old craggly streets downtown were annoying... but every single moment in between was fantastic. Cornering was dead flat, even lane changes could be exciting, and communication with the road was awesome.
I will be going with a set of Tein Flex or comparable as soon as it is within reach.
07-25-2006, 11:33 PM
#17
1st Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 129
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
OK guys I just broke down and bought the TEIN Type SS Adjustable Height and Shock Coilover Kit. I have had Eibach before and have not been happy with how quickly the springs wear out so I decided to spend the extra $200 and go with the Tein over the EIBACH PRO-STREET-S System. I will post an update and pics once I get them installed.
In case you want to know I got them here:
http://www.prostreetonline.com/buy/t...s/dsg12-kuas2/
I am so excited I think I am going to **** my pants! I LOVE MODDING!!!!!!
Peace out!
Jim
In case you want to know I got them here:
http://www.prostreetonline.com/buy/t...s/dsg12-kuas2/
I am so excited I think I am going to **** my pants! I LOVE MODDING!!!!!!
Peace out!
Jim
07-25-2006, 11:36 PM
#18
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location:
Posts: 3,758
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
IMHO i don't see any real benefit to a coilover system other than adjustable ride height.
a couple reasons:
a) we have macphereson-strut setups in front, so the spring is already coiling the shock. with an adjustable rate lowering spring and good adjustable shocks (eibach sportline/pro kit, and tokico d-specs for example), you get all the benefits of a coilover system minus the marginal tunability improvement of ride height/spring stiffness
b) we have solid rear axles, which move up and down as a whole unit for the most part. any bump on the left rear side will be felt to some degree on the right rear side. thus, having two springs controlling the movement of the rear axle vertically accomplishes the same thing as havingt a coilover system. the only benefit i see is the suspension response is pushed as far out on the axle as possible with a coilover, which might lend toward some form of noticeable improvement, but nothing drastic. NOW, IF WE HAD IRS this arument would be void and i would say that you would be stupid to pass up coilovers if they were an affordable alternative...but alas, we do not.
c) coilovers are expensive. ok ok so there were some for 1200$ on ebay in the above links, but realistically those are $2000 setups from any shop...NOT installed. My sportlines were 220 and my tokicos were 539 shipped. That comes out to 800$ installed because i did it myself, or about 1100 installed if done by a shop. (about 4hrs of labor). that is an easy 500$ savings, but likely even more than that compared to a good coilover setup, and i can still pass an m3 on the outside lane of a freeway onramp...with shltty 225 tires up front. IMO you are better off getting springs + shocks/struts + sways + lca's for the same price as a coilover kit, and will handle quite noticeably better in the end. of course, with the budget, coilovers are slightly better for road-racing applications on our cars, and offer that added adjustability, plus sways and other suspension parts are still available for even more handling improvement
i am happy with the route i took
a couple reasons:
a) we have macphereson-strut setups in front, so the spring is already coiling the shock. with an adjustable rate lowering spring and good adjustable shocks (eibach sportline/pro kit, and tokico d-specs for example), you get all the benefits of a coilover system minus the marginal tunability improvement of ride height/spring stiffness
b) we have solid rear axles, which move up and down as a whole unit for the most part. any bump on the left rear side will be felt to some degree on the right rear side. thus, having two springs controlling the movement of the rear axle vertically accomplishes the same thing as havingt a coilover system. the only benefit i see is the suspension response is pushed as far out on the axle as possible with a coilover, which might lend toward some form of noticeable improvement, but nothing drastic. NOW, IF WE HAD IRS this arument would be void and i would say that you would be stupid to pass up coilovers if they were an affordable alternative...but alas, we do not.
c) coilovers are expensive. ok ok so there were some for 1200$ on ebay in the above links, but realistically those are $2000 setups from any shop...NOT installed. My sportlines were 220 and my tokicos were 539 shipped. That comes out to 800$ installed because i did it myself, or about 1100 installed if done by a shop. (about 4hrs of labor). that is an easy 500$ savings, but likely even more than that compared to a good coilover setup, and i can still pass an m3 on the outside lane of a freeway onramp...with shltty 225 tires up front. IMO you are better off getting springs + shocks/struts + sways + lca's for the same price as a coilover kit, and will handle quite noticeably better in the end. of course, with the budget, coilovers are slightly better for road-racing applications on our cars, and offer that added adjustability, plus sways and other suspension parts are still available for even more handling improvement
i am happy with the route i took
07-26-2006, 01:11 AM
#19
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Peoria, AZ
Posts: 382
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
ORIGINAL: Sleeper05
IMHO i don't see any real benefit to a coilover system other than adjustable ride height.
a couple reasons:
a) we have macphereson-strut setups in front, so the spring is already coiling the shock. with an adjustable rate lowering spring and good adjustable shocks (eibach sportline/pro kit, and tokico d-specs for example), you get all the benefits of a coilover system minus the marginal tunability improvement of ride height/spring stiffness
b) we have solid rear axles, which move up and down as a whole unit for the most part. any bump on the left rear side will be felt to some degree on the right rear side. thus, having two springs controlling the movement of the rear axle vertically accomplishes the same thing as havingt a coilover system. the only benefit i see is the suspension response is pushed as far out on the axle as possible with a coilover, which might lend toward some form of noticeable improvement, but nothing drastic. NOW, IF WE HAD IRS this arument would be void and i would say that you would be stupid to pass up coilovers if they were an affordable alternative...but alas, we do not.
c) coilovers are expensive. ok ok so there were some for 1200$ on ebay in the above links, but realistically those are $2000 setups from any shop...NOT installed. My sportlines were 220 and my tokicos were 539 shipped. That comes out to 800$ installed because i did it myself, or about 1100 installed if done by a shop. (about 4hrs of labor). that is an easy 500$ savings, but likely even more than that compared to a good coilover setup, and i can still pass an m3 on the outside lane of a freeway onramp...with shltty 225 tires up front. IMO you are better off getting springs + shocks/struts + sways + lca's for the same price as a coilover kit, and will handle quite noticeably better in the end. of course, with the budget, coilovers are slightly better for road-racing applications on our cars, and offer that added adjustability, plus sways and other suspension parts are still available for even more handling improvement
i am happy with the route i took
IMHO i don't see any real benefit to a coilover system other than adjustable ride height.
a couple reasons:
a) we have macphereson-strut setups in front, so the spring is already coiling the shock. with an adjustable rate lowering spring and good adjustable shocks (eibach sportline/pro kit, and tokico d-specs for example), you get all the benefits of a coilover system minus the marginal tunability improvement of ride height/spring stiffness
b) we have solid rear axles, which move up and down as a whole unit for the most part. any bump on the left rear side will be felt to some degree on the right rear side. thus, having two springs controlling the movement of the rear axle vertically accomplishes the same thing as havingt a coilover system. the only benefit i see is the suspension response is pushed as far out on the axle as possible with a coilover, which might lend toward some form of noticeable improvement, but nothing drastic. NOW, IF WE HAD IRS this arument would be void and i would say that you would be stupid to pass up coilovers if they were an affordable alternative...but alas, we do not.
c) coilovers are expensive. ok ok so there were some for 1200$ on ebay in the above links, but realistically those are $2000 setups from any shop...NOT installed. My sportlines were 220 and my tokicos were 539 shipped. That comes out to 800$ installed because i did it myself, or about 1100 installed if done by a shop. (about 4hrs of labor). that is an easy 500$ savings, but likely even more than that compared to a good coilover setup, and i can still pass an m3 on the outside lane of a freeway onramp...with shltty 225 tires up front. IMO you are better off getting springs + shocks/struts + sways + lca's for the same price as a coilover kit, and will handle quite noticeably better in the end. of course, with the budget, coilovers are slightly better for road-racing applications on our cars, and offer that added adjustability, plus sways and other suspension parts are still available for even more handling improvement
i am happy with the route i took
B) The coilovers for the rear axle are most likely a contradiction. Most aftermarket coilover sets for seperate spring and shock systems use a sleeved spring in place of the standard spring so it's not really a coilover. In the end its about tuning which a live axle can benfit from just as much as a IRS.
C) All those bits are still necessary since the springs shouldn't be used to handle all the cornering force, but it isn't a crime to do so. A stronger spring and shock can negate the need for any sway bar, but it would make traction over bumps and dips problematic.
It all comes down to tuning the entire system to work optimally. Lowering springs and shocks make a vast improvement over the stock suspension, but they are still working around compromises. Some folks don't want to compromise even just to pick up a bottle of Advil from the drug store.
07-26-2006, 03:19 AM
#20
5th Gear Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,881
RE: Coil-Over or Springs???
So.. from what Ive gathered so far.. if I care about some extra money but still want good suspension then I should go with the new springs/shocks combo ...BUT if I want to maximize the suspension to be the best it possibly could be (plus have the ability to change the feel of the ride) and am willing to spend a little extra cash then get the coilovers.. correct?