wasvette

[/quote]

F1Fan - Thanks for the post - Would the Steeda ProAction non-adjustable struts and shocks work in your opinion or should I just save for the Tokico D-spec?
Thanks,
Kevin

[/quote]

Hi Kevin,

I have not personally installed or driven a set of these dampers yet. Many people have said good things about the Steeda non-adjustable dampersand I think they work O.K. with the Eibach Pro-Kit springs. But the N/A ProAction dampers may be a little bit soft when used with a Pro-Kit spring given the fact that the damping rates were designed specifically around the Steeda regular Sport and Ultralite spring rates which have 15-20% lower rates.The Steeda engineers are no dummies, they developed the damping rates for Tokico's S197 D-Spec damper sets and then had Tokico build them non-adjustable versions of these dampers. So I would expect they will work fine if a bit soft for a performance application. But this is a good thing for a high milage DD car or a car in used on bumpy roads.

HTH!


[/quote]

F1Fan - Thanks for taking the time (again--as I've seen your other information-rich posts) to educate a suspension rookie. This definitely is a DD and won't ever see a track. I most likely will go with the Steeda N/As as it sounds like it will be better than the stock dampers (and I'll have it all apart so why not). So many variables - alignment? panhard? A lot I won't know until it's on my car.
Thanks again. Kevin

JB_Sonic_197

FIfan,
That is all true in good for a dedicated track car, not a car driven everyday on the street. Most people have wide and variuous ideas of "ride quaility" and performance. Kind of like why you see some guys with fat chicks and some guys with skinny girls. I value your opinion and knowledge, but preception is more often reality than reality is reality.

It also seems that you believe that FRPP is just buying off the shelf parts and putting their lable on them, and then advertising that they are "engineered" parts. I've had experience with the FRPP and Team Mustang engineers who beg to differ from your assesment of their lable enineering. I've also seen the Ford Proving Grounds where their stuff is put through the paces in their "test mule" on some really ugly roads. (If you ever been to Michigan, the proving grounds are actually better roads than the streets outside the gates, that is why Ford delivers the Mustang with off road springs installed)

I too have driven the a factory Mustang GT, a Shelby GT, a Roush Stage 1, 2, Saleen, and Steeda Q. The difference in all these cars is like having to judge Miss America, they're all good looking it just comes down to do you blonde or brunette...


Most people are more intersted in these two variables in thisorder of importance:

1. The look. Low not the 4x4 package from Ford.
2. The ride on the street.

The only one that trumps number 2 is Price.

I'm curiuous just who is F1Fan?

F1Fan

Hi JB_Sonic_197,

I live in SoCal and have personally installed virtually the entire Steeda suspension catalogin my ownS197GT complete with D-Spec dampers andSteeda Competition springs. My car is used as a daily driver and I haul my family around in it every day. I'm a long time owner and driver of German sports and GT cars with a history of designing and building suspension components for the race track, display, demoand showcars. I have a road course type high performance focus for myS197GT and IMO it must work on bumpy, irregularsurface cayon roads or it is not a street car. Race cars are actually slower that a well tuned street car on this type of road and are ahazard to drive on this type of road, that is why they are called race cars. I have been 'testing'on Mulholland Road and the surounding canyons for over 35 years. If you don't know about Mullholand Road read the book, I was there and I'm still there ona regular basis.

By definition reality is objective and can be reliably quantified. Perception is by definition subjective, difficult to quantify well and is the basis for misinformation andignorance. I HATE chicks and love women because women know what they are about and chicks are stupid. If you like girls you may have issues.

I do not "believe" FRPP badgeengineers many of the products they sell, I know this for a fact. FRPP uses Eibach Pro-Kit springs and anti-roll bars straight off of Eibach's shelf. If you doubt this ask FRPP or Eibach, they'll giveyou the information. You can independently verify this by buying a set of FRPP springs and then buying a set of Eibach Pro-Kit springs and comparing the Eibach logo andpart numbers screened right onto all ofthe springs you have just purchased. I have personally installed several sets of Eibach and FRPP springs and anti-roll bars and they are all the same off the shelf Eibach parts with Eibach part numbers right on them. FRPP also uses Steeda parts and sells then as their own this is a fact, just ask FRPP or Steeda.

The differences between the Roush, Saleen, Shelby and Steeda suspensions is easily quantified using lap times from various roadracing courses. I seem to recall reading a Motor Trend article and a 5.0 or FF&M that both agreed that the Steeda Q cars tested on the track were the fastest and the best handling of the factory cars. This is notunfounded or untested opinion this is measured, quantified information which leads the writers to solid conclusion. A better handling car, even one withless measured grip can lap a road course faster than a more powerful car with more grip because it handles better and is better able toutilize the full potentialof the so called "lesser car." This is only possible with a very well balanced good handling car.

The problem is that I'm not most people and as a matter of fact neither are most other people posting here. For the money IMO the S197GT is a heck of a good value. I bought the S197GTbecause I think the S197GT is capable of being a very goodcar for the money once I put some work into the suspension and do a bit of tuning.Knowing what I know about suspension I prefer to build myown car up using my years of experience doing just that.

If you really want to know who F1Fan is read this post carefully.

Cheers!

JB_Sonic_197

F1,
Who builds Steeda's springs and sway bars?

Why use Steeda's stuff rather than your own design and built compoments? You seem to have the kwonledge and skill to handle it in house.

Thanks for the bio, I read it twice, real careful like...

RodeoFlyer

Have you ever SEEN the equipment required to do so? I have been INSIDE Eibach's manufacturing facility in Corona, Ca. They in FACT make FRPP's springs and swaybars.

Take a look at Roush's suspension parts in their catalog.......looksy a lot like *cough Cough* BMR *cough cough*

The Roush and Saleen both ride like **** and handle like it too. As much as Steve Saleen LOATHES the term, they are in fact a TUNER car. They just throw on wings and body kits anymore for the most part. They buy most of their parts from outside vendors just like FRPP. Gee - what's the first thing Roush and Saleen do - bolt on a HUGE front swaybar so dumbasses with too much money don't spin them into a tree and sue them. I ranover and then away from a Saleen GT last time I was at the track and loved every minute of it. Simply stated - performance cars don't come with 20" wheels and 12" brakes

So now I ask you - Who is JB_Sonic_197 ??

JB_Sonic_197

Rodeoflyer,
In fact I have seen what it takes to manufacture the springs and swaybars.

If you go back and read my posts, you might notice that I have never inferred the FRPP manufactures their handling pack (or that they don't buy their equipment from Eibach). It was F1 that infered that FRPP lable engineers their products.

Who is JB_Sonic_197?

Just someone who doesn't buy everything he reads in Motor Trend...

drbobvs

Hmm, that's interesting. I just checked out BMR springs and they don't look anything like the Roush's. I'm currently changing over my Steeda Sport springs to Roush. So far I've done the rear and will do the front next week. Everyone's taste is different I guess, and/or maybe it has something to do with chassis stiffness, or lack there of, but i felt a big improvement in ride quality on a typical road with bumps going from the Steeda linear spring of their Sport line rears to the progressive Roush springs. I feel the bumps with theSteedafronts may be a little harsh too, soI hope to like the Roush fronts better too.Since I'm not a road racer, really just a weekend cruiser with the kids and occasional 1/4 mile runs, thismay fit me better than others like you and F1 Fan who appreciate a track car.

RodeoFlyer

In regard to Roush I was referring to their control arms, strut tower brace, and other items in their catalog. I don't know whose springs and dampers they use. I've HEARD Bilstein on the dampers but don't know.

In regard to JB I was inferring that F1Fan obviously does not manufactore his springs and bars because as you must know that was an unrealistic statement.

Pretty much ANYTHING will ride better than Eibach's Sportlines.

I'm actually in the process of swapping H&R sports in place of my race springs since my S197 will only see limited track duty with the addition of my 93' Cobra AI car. I don't favor "street" cars over "track" cars or vice versa. I do favor using the appropriate components for a given application. Many people make uninformed choices due to both a lack of budget and a lack of information. I strive to help when I can with knowledge I have gained from LOTS of track time and parts given to me by generous manufacturers and performance shops. I realize I am abrasive at times but I give honest opinions based on experience. I've done things more than once and not always right the first time. My only goal is to help people spend less money and time to learn than I have.

JB_Sonic_197

RodeoFlyer,

That is a stand up thing you posted.

Thanks

JB_Sonic_197

F1fan,

Your silence is deafening...