STi Rob

My question is how much of a difference will the Billstein shocks make when used with the stock springs. Im looking to improve the feel and handling perfromance of the car but I realy dont wantto lower it due to it being my daily driver. Any input or personal experience will be greatly appreciated.

Thx,
Rob

Sam Strano

I really can't recommend them... They are a line we sell, but I just don't feel they are a great option given where they fit in on price and the fact you can't do a damned thing with them to tweak the ride, or the response of the car. They are what they are, and while that's not in any way meant to say they are junk, it's just that they aren't good bang for the buck.

I'd sooner put you on either Koni's or D-specs (which bracket Bilstein's on price). Koni's are less than $100 for for the set, D-specs less than $100 less per set. Both offer damping adjustment, though different in what and how they change the damping. And Koni's are just flat screwed together better than D-specs (like Bilstein's are), but with the ability to alter the way the car feels and reacts.

Further, if you eventually addlowering springsif you opt for either of the other two, you have dampers in place that cancontrol mostany spring you might choose to put on. HD's aren't meant for lowered springs and are valved accordingly where as the adjustables have a wide range of damping built in that's super easy to change and tune.

I tend to prefer Koni's for all around reasons.But the D-specs are good bang for the buck and wouldget my nod over the Bilstein HD's.

FWIW, since D-spec stock has been a bit hit and miss: We have some 24 sets available right now. Koni stock is very, very low and we won't have more for a few more weeks.

STi Rob

Thankyou for you input. Have you driven many s197 mustangs with only the shocks and struts being upgraded? If so what was your take on the differences over completely stock. Is there enough of a positive difference in the way the car feels and handles to justify the cost?

Rob

Sam Strano

My daily driver, and '07) has stock springs/bars and Koni's. A friend's '05 had D-specs only. My girlfriends V-6 has all GT parts installed (springs, bars and my OEM dampers). My car deals with sharp impacts better than it did stock/her car does now). I always had a tippy-toe feeling due to a lack of damping in the rear with the stock shocks that my car doesn't have any more. I.E. it feels more locked down.

I have to say that there are a lot of other car out there with much worse dampers stock than this car has. That said, I'm a shock snob (admittedly), and most things that folks don't like about how a car drives tends to come back to some sort of rebound damping issue.

Better shocks just control the mass better, the car rolls and pitches more slowly, and it feels much more in the road vs. up on top of it. Lately, I've been pushing hard on the fact that I feel that parts are added to deal with a specific issue(s). I can't know that you'd find the same change from shocks I did because I don't know exactly what you want to change about how the car drives, but I'm pretty sure you'd find better dampers to be an improvement.

The car is pretty firm, most lowering springs stiffen it about 25%, but part of that is just making up for the shorter spring. The stock swaybars are not exactly terribly sized either. I've always been a believe in dampers first since they do so much for feel, but this is even more the case when there aren't HUGE glaring problems elsewhere. That's not to say the car is 100% perfect for every person or need, or that it can't be improved upon in some way. I'm simply saying that there isn't a lot here that's seriously broken.

STi Rob

You said it perfectly,in stock form the car feels on top of the road (or floaty). This isexactly what I want to eliminate. Overall Im very pleased with the way the car drives, I just want that little extra connection to the road.

So to sum it all up the Koni's or D-specs with stock springs will give a noticeablymore planted and in touch with the road feel over completely stock.

Rob

Sam Strano

You got it.... then we see how the car drives/feels to you with various damping adjustments. At that point we see what, if anything, you'd next like to change about how the car drives and we pick appropriate parts from there if other changes are warranted.

Hopefully we can help you out. If you have any questions, please don't hesistate to call.

RodeoFlyer

I ran Bilsteins on my car for a while. They are for sale if anyone is interested.

The Bilsteins are advertised as being acceptable for lowering springs. On two seperate occasions two of their engineers advised me of this as well. I originally ran them on Maximum Motorsports' advice. Their application is simply a matter of debate.

I had great success with them, however eventually the lack of adjustability became an issue for me. They aren't cheap, but you get what you pay for. You can always send them to Bilstein and have them rebuilt and revalved, but it isn't cheap. For someone that isn't concerned with adjustability and/or isn't a track person, and on stock springs - I think they would be a good buy, however I agree with Sam in that they don't give you future options.

FWIW, a very successful AI/AIX/A Sedan/Trans Am/ V8 Supercar driver is running them up front on his AI S197. Something to consider.

Sam Strano

Bilstein does not make a Sport version damper for this car, but for most other Sports/GT cars they either make both an HD and Sport, or just a Sport valving. That doesn't fill me with warm fuzzies, especially after having dealt with the exact same issue for years on F-bodies. They'd say HD's are fine, but for years their own catalog stated on the top of page 1, that "Heavy Duty shocks are not suitable for lowered cars". That disclaimer is now gone, but doesn't change the fact for a number of other Sports/GT cars (including some cars of dubious lineage and as diverse as PT Cruisers and Mercedes E-class sedans) get the option of Sport dampers where the S197 and some other Mustangs don't.

I also tend to disagree with the commonly held ideathat adjustable shocks are useful only for someone tracking or autoxing a car. The car always has mass, and has not any idea of where it's being driven. It doesn't get lightersomehow on the street. Shocks are dampers, they damp movement. You get movement on the road as well as on a track. Certainly folks who don't care a lick about performance might not see a benefit to adjustable damping, but then again those folks don't tend to hang out in places like this. I beleive that when practical flexibility is a good thing to have. Adjustable damping offersa lot of flexibility for a person to find what he/she likes best be that on a hardcore track car, or on a driver that is used more sportingly than your average rental car. YMMV.

I will not deny that Bilstein's are high quality dampers. I won't deny a car can be fast on them in a track situation. I just feel the money could be spent on dampers that don't pigeon hole the owner's options for tuning. It's simply a value vs. performance debate to me here and in my opinion, no single thing has more effect on more aspects of a car's all arounddriveability than good, suitable damping.

STi Rob

Hopefuly the shocks and struts alone will suit my needs. I realy wish there was a performance spring that didnt lower the car or stayed very close to stock height (within a 1/2 inch). Ive driven a new Bullitt and the suspenion was a noticeable improvement over the stock GT. I guess I could wait until the Bullitt springs are available before having shocks and struts installed, I dont want to have to pay for the samelabor twice.

Rob

STi Rob

Thanks for the info. If you could shoot me a pm with information about the Bilsteins you have for sale.

Rob